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-   -   Is the Union Jack slowly becoming a symbol for racism/xenophobia? (https://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=192275)

SoBig 01-12-2011 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid* (Post 4793571)
It's incredibly easy to tell the difference.

At first glance? No.

If you stare at it then, yeah.

Pyramid* 01-12-2011 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4793576)
I thought that too, sheer pedantry

In your opinion MTVN.... anyone who knows anything about their country, should be able to tell when their country's flag is flown the right way or not. It's hardly rocket science.

MTVN 01-12-2011 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid* (Post 4793589)
In your opinion MTVN.... anyone who knows anything about their country, should be able to tell when their country's flag is flown the right way or not. It's hardly rocket science.

I know plenty about my country thank you, and such knowledge is not determined by whether or not you think there a big difference in the appearance of the flag when it's upside down :rolleyes:

spitfire 01-12-2011 04:38 PM

No, The Union Flag is not becoming a symbol for racism/xenophobia.
What Flag would you expect The British National Party to use?
The Tories use it too.

Scarlett. 01-12-2011 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spitfire (Post 4793631)
No, The Union Flag is not becoming a symbol for racism/xenophobia.
What Flag would you expect The British National Party to use?
The Tories use it too.

Nope, it's a tree
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/image...ogo_bbc203.jpg

Pyramid* 01-12-2011 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4793620)
I know plenty about my country thank you, and such knowledge is not determined by whether or not you think there a big difference in the appearance of the flag when it's upside down :rolleyes:

At least I know when the Union Jack is being flown correctly - and I know the reason for it, now that's pretty basic knowledge as far as I'm concerned. You may not agree, but I think being able to tell if your country's flag is hung the right way, is fundamental. :rolleyes:

MTVN 01-12-2011 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyramid* (Post 4793642)
At least I know when the Union Jack is being flown correctly - and I know the reason for it, now that's pretty basic knowledge as far as I'm concerned. You may not agree, but I think being able to tell if your country's flag is hung the right way, is fundamental. :rolleyes:

Well woop de doo, there are far more important things to know about the UK

spitfire 01-12-2011 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chewy (Post 4793638)

http://www.conservatives.com/

Pyramid* 01-12-2011 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN (Post 4793654)
Well woop de doo, there are far more important things to know about the UK

Deary me. Weren't you inferring I was being pedantic only a few posts ago: and now you appear to be doing similar to what you accused me of .

I do believe there may be far more important things to know, but given that this is a thread debating and discussing the Union Jack (as you tried to point out to me earlier on remember), I'd say it was an important part of the discussion - rather than somewhat childish 'well, woop de doo' comment.

After all, it is meant to be a SERIOUS DEBATES thread MTVN.

Livia 01-12-2011 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InOne (Post 4793516)
There are racists in all walks of life. But I think people who don't live in multicultural areas probably more likely to be less racist, as they have not experienced it, and still live in a genereally British populated part of Britain.

That's not my experience. I come from a very ethnically mixed part of east London. While there were tensions at times, on the whole people were more accepting of each other and likely to have friends and colleagues from a variety of nationalities. Now I live in the countryside where it's almost exclusively white, and I have never heard such xenophobic bull**** in my life. Some of the outrageously racist comments I've heard people make with absolutely no shame at all have taken my breath away at times. I think those who don't mix with people of other ethnic backgrounds and have no experience of them see them as different, whereas people who mix with them all the time realise that we all bleed red.

Scarlett. 01-12-2011 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spitfire (Post 4793662)

Never see that used in public though, heck even their Facebook uses the blue and green one.

Liberty4eva 01-12-2011 09:10 PM

I wish people wouldn't make big fusses about a piece of cloth. We have a society today where if someone owned a swastika it would be like a big deal but I wish people would just mellow out. BTW, I don't own a swastika in case anyone thinks I do.

Livia 01-12-2011 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva (Post 4794276)
I wish people wouldn't make big fusses about a piece of cloth. We have a society today where if someone owned a swastika it would be like a big deal but I wish people would just mellow out. BTW, I don't own a swastika in case anyone thinks I do.

I guess you have to understand what the piece of cloth in question stands for, and has stood for. I'm happy to live in a society where someone owning a swastika would be a big deal.

Liberty4eva 01-12-2011 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 4794431)
I guess you have to understand what the piece of cloth in question stands for, and has stood for. I'm happy to live in a society where someone owning a swastika would be a big deal.

I suppose it may also be a big deal if someone in the MiddleEast owned an Israeli or American flag (unless they got it just to burn it). Those flags to them may represent imperialism or genocide as well. In former UK colonies which still harbor some resentment it may be a big deal to own a UK flag. That's why I think it's so stupid how people make big deals out of pieces of cloth.

MTVN 01-12-2011 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva (Post 4794718)
I suppose it may also be a big deal if someone in the MiddleEast owned an Israeli or American flag (unless they got it just to burn it). Those flags to them may represent imperialism or genocide as well. In former UK colonies which still harbor some resentment it may be a big deal to own a UK flag. That's why I think it's so stupid how people make big deals out of pieces of cloth.

I think the difference is that the Swastika is more associated with an ideology and specifically Nazi Germany whereas the Union Jack doesn't necessarily stand for British Imperialism

GypsyGoth 01-12-2011 11:40 PM

I think of it as a symbol of multiculturalism before I associate it with the likes of the bnp & racists. However I think those tiny groups are very loud in the media.

Livia 02-12-2011 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva (Post 4794718)
I suppose it may also be a big deal if someone in the MiddleEast owned an Israeli or American flag (unless they got it just to burn it). Those flags to them may represent imperialism or genocide as well. In former UK colonies which still harbor some resentment it may be a big deal to own a UK flag. That's why I think it's so stupid how people make big deals out of pieces of cloth.

We're talking about flying the Union Flag in Great Britain, not in any other country. The British Empire was a long, long time ago and people have moved on, the vast majority of former Empire countries now belonging to the Commonwealth and for some, the Union Flag is a part of their own national flag. Mozambique was never part of the British Empire but sees the Commonwealth as being valuable and chooses to be a member. I would imagine there are a fair few Native Americans who resent the Stars and Stripes, yet in the USA people are proud of their flag, they fly it frequently and no one weeps and wails about attrocities that the USA may have committed generations ago.

The Swastika is something different. It's origins are Indian, and you do see it in some Indian designs, but there's nothing wrong with that. People who own a swastica belonging to the Third Reich do it because they are nazis or nazi sympathisers.

letmein 04-12-2011 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 4794431)
I guess you have to understand what the piece of cloth in question stands for, and has stood for. I'm happy to live in a society where someone owning a swastika would be a big deal.

You're happy to live in a Nanny State where everyone else tells you what opinion is and isn't acceptable. You're the mind police.

Scarlett. 04-12-2011 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letmein (Post 4799615)
You're happy to live in a Nanny State where everyone else tells you what opinion is and isn't acceptable. You're the mind police.

Well I don't think people need to be told that supporting the people who brought about the mass extermination of Jews in World War II isnt acceptable, it's just one of those things that make sense.

Grimnir 04-12-2011 02:41 PM

patriotism and racism are two cheeks of the same arse

Livia 04-12-2011 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letmein (Post 4799615)
You're happy to live in a Nanny State where everyone else tells you what opinion is and isn't acceptable. You're the mind police.

As many of my family were wiped out in WW2 by people wearing swastikas, I'd say yes, I'm very happy to live here.

There isn't a country in the world that loves their flag more than the good ol' US of A. The way some Americans go at it I imagine some of them think Team America, World Police was a documentary.

Pyramid* 04-12-2011 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letmein (Post 4799615)
You're happy to live in a Nanny State where everyone else tells you what opinion is and isn't acceptable. You're the mind police.

Makes me wonder what country you live in, because the way you are portraying it: your country has no laws I suppose then and those who live there must clearly just run riot.

nah...I'd prefer to live in a land where there is a semblence of law and order. I'll stick to the UK and accept that we do at least have laws that deal with reprobates accordingly.

Pyramid* 04-12-2011 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 4799695)
As many of my family were wiped out in WW2 by people wearing swastikas, I'd say yes, I'm very happy to live here.

There isn't a country in the world that loves their flag more than the good ol' US of A. The way some Americans go at it I imagine some of them think Team America, World Police was a documentary.

What do you mean..... are you saying they weren't for real??? I thought some of it was hilariously true to form.


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