Exactly. He's been negative from the start.

LOL,sorry that is ridiculous why would you be friends with someone out of fear ,ffs, I'm not even gonna bother this is so silly

You would also remember that Ashleigh played a part in the isolation of Jale too...

its getting rather silly now isnt it Kaz, methinks Ashleigh fans (the ones she has left) are shaking in their kickers lol

That gets conveniently swept under the carpet. :thumbs:

I wouldn't want to be friends with Ashleigh. She reminds me of those Mean Girls from that movie.

Exactly. Helen and the nasty gang all like each other because they are nasty. Nasty people stick together

I seem to recall that most of history's dictators had many friends and acolytes

The Kray Twins had hundreds of friends

Are you seriously comparing Helen and her friends to the Kray twins? Fml :joker:

She was the soul cause of the divide. Kimberly repeatedly tried to involve Ashleigh and Danielle in the bigger group and help them feel more accepted and her efforts were rebuffed with scorn from them both.

The only person Helen alienated was Jale and she said sorry and got to know Jale well after.

When was Winston nasty? when was Steven nasty? When was Pav nasty?

Keep reaching.

I didn't say "everyone" so kind of silly to put that in quotation marks, but yes I'll agree not all of those people were friends with her through fear. But I really believe that Kim and Tamara both took the role of submissive sidekick to Helen. You could argue that fear is a strong word, but I think it plays a role. A few hms have also brought this up iirc.

Further, I wouldn't say they're just friends with Helen through fear, but behave in certain ways because of it. Lots of people have agreed that Ash was up her arse for ages and would never ever admit she'd done wrong. I think Pav nominated Winston instead of Ash face to face because of fear of her reaction.

It isn't ridiculous or silly so please don't say that. Plenty of people remain in friendships and relationships through fear, or behave in certain ways simply to appease a stronger character. I haven't long since left school, where some friendship group hierarchies are built around a dominant character who other people are scared of.

She does create divides and secludes herself yeah, she has isolated herself from very early on in the series, which she admitted to herself during that court task but I see they conveniently left that out of the highlights.

Like Danielle? because her and Ashleigh were nowhere near being 'positive people' when they were together in the pod bitching about everyone else with faces like thunder.

Steven's relentless battering of Chris now that he's been evicted, even in a task about Helen and Ashleigh, is pretty nasty

Everyone in there is nasty, except Saint Ashleigh. :angel:

Is that a serious question? If so, refer to today's highlights for starters

No she don't, it Helen who causes a divide.

How was it? he said the truth and nothing but. It was also as part of a task.

Are you denying Chris and Ashleigh sit on their beds slagging people off? like seriously?

That was part of a task and what did he say that was nasty? it was all true and that's why you don't like it.

steven got voted out:hehe:

Opps silly me I forgot the dun shines out of her arse. :hehe:

I think Chris and Ashleigh create the divide. They hardly ever mix with the group.

I think Ashleigh and Danielle started it but Chris took over once Danielle went and it has just gotten deeper since.

The common denominator being miserable Ashleigh.

Ashleigh isolating herself (I don't even know why this is a big deal, I suspect most people would in that kind of situation) really only accounts for the divide between Helen and Ashleigh. With everyone else, it's all about Helen's actions. How Helen treated Chris, how Helen treated Danielle, how Helen treated Christopher, how Helen treated Jale early on, etc. It was never Ashleigh and her clique against Helen and her clique.

Helen has always mixed with the group.

Irrelevant but nice try at baiting me :thumbs:

Judi "Ashleigh, did you cause the divide?"

Ashleigh "I'm partly responsible"

Judi "Helen did you cause the divide?"

Helen "No, it's not my fault"

The delusion. :facepalm:

Because you said all of her friends, so silly of you to be pedantic about it.

"I think" "I believe" not actual proof. Pav nominating Winston was no surprise, he hasn't got on with Winston at all, Winston was the one more openly wary with him. Ash being up her arse is how some 'friends' are. No suggestion it comes from fear of any kind.

Yeah, that Judi wants sectioning.

BUT YOU ARE A HELEN FAN the blind bias is so laughably absurd

No I'm not denying that they do that, but EVERY other person in the house has slagged someone off before, and I don't see how that is a problem (unless they were saying something really out of order). Of course people are gonna call people names and vent about their annoyances to other hms. Helen's group slags Ashleigh's group off just as much as Ashleigh's group slags Helen's group off.

I believe what Steven did was nasty because it was uncalled for. Firstly, it made it seem like it was just the two of them that do it. When Matthew spoke, he just spoke about his own experience with Helen in the house, because that is all that was needed. When Steven spoke, he just had to bring up things that are "outsider knowledge" in an attempt to make them seem worse than they are.

Secondly, the task wasn't about Chris, it was about Ashleigh and Helen. There was no need to bring up anything about Chris.

For the most part, I think Ashleigh removes herself because Helen jumps on everything she says, all the F'ing time. Helen is just waiting for her to say anything in the hopes that she can say some horrid thing and grin her evil grin and have a laugh with her brood about it. So, if you really think about it, its still pretty much Helens doing. For the most part.

I just don't like Ashleigh.

I'm not being pedantic.. I said people are friends with Helen through fear, not everyone.

And this is a forum where we can express opinions, so me saying that I think they're friends with Helen through fear is just as valid as you saying you don't think they're friends with her through fear.

Obviously, but saying Ashleigh is like one of those girls from the movie Mean Girls and then championing a Helen victory is laughably contradictory.

They've both helped cause the divide tbf, but I don't like how certain people just pile all the blame on Helen all because Ashleigh is out of this world attractive and 18 years old, she's a young adult so she should be as equally responsible for this divide as Helen is.

I much prefer Helen, because at least she admits it when she's wrong.

Yes, every one of her friends. But be pedantic all you wish. :idc:

Ashleigh 100% started the divide between her and Helen !

She started off bitching with Danielle calling Helen 'vile human being' etc (Helen said nothing about Ashleigh like that at this point in the series)

But then it REALLY kicked in with Ashleigh's 'evil plan' to exclude Helen from all the girls and manipulate them into not saving Ash

Helen had no problem with Ashleigh until she heard that in the gossip app task (and also the morgue when BB showed them snippets of Ashleigh's bitching)

Ashleigh started on Helen first. No question. We all saw it.

I don't think that's why people don't blame Ashleigh, that's not why I don't at least. Helen being an obnoxious bitch and Ashleigh isolating herself from said obnoxious bitch explains why those two never got along. But until very recently, Ashleigh was never in a power position in the house to enforce any sort of divide on a larger scale. Helen's pretty much been The Power Housemate socially speaking the whole game courtesy of Pauline giving her a pass to the final, and the divide pretty much resonated from how Helen treated anyone who wasn't on her side.