Scotland: too small to be its own country. Too big to be an insane asylum. :hehe:

The situation hasn't changed in Scotland, there was never any misunderstanding that they were voting to stay in the U.K. and that any future decisions would be taken by the UK as a whole, yes the referendum was based on lies and misinformation from both sides, the EU vote was based on lies and misinformation from both sides, yet you only champion a Scottish rerun :think: and you want NI to go it alone when the two main parties can't even agree on power sharing most of the time, :facepalm: you have no logic at all

:clap1:

True

Can London stay in the EU as we voted in as well? How's that for flawed logic

Tbf though as long as theres a government theres always going to be someone telling the people what to do whether that country is independent or not, SNP were told that the last referendum was a once in a generation vote, Scotland knew this and voted to stay in the union, Nicola and the rest of the SNP should be respecting that vote but they never will because independence has been the sole point of the party since the beginning, the divide in this country has only just began to heal since the last ref and now it's started again. IMO the PM is right, this isn't the time, not until we all find out whats going on and going to happen after bexit.

"now it's started again."

Yes and Scotland
can have a 2nd vote after the UK
is fully out of the EU.
Not before.

I suppose doing it after brexit is done and dusted isn't a terrible idea. If it really is the "great British promised land" then we can stay... And if it's as **** as any unbiased economist thinks it will be then we'll be desperate to leave and "out" will win by a landslide :joker:. Not a terrible scenario, I guess. In truth I don't think enough has changed yet for the voting percentages to be much different; I think there would be a small shift but it would only be maybe 53% to 47% (remain in UK still winning). After Brexit, when the UK is floundering and Scotland (and the north of England) is being thrown under the bus as London closes ranks to protect itself, people might actually wake up and realise where they sit in the Tory / Westminster pecking order.

How convenient that all the unbiased economists are opposed to Brexit and apparently predict gloom and doom. Do you know them all personally TS? :hee:

The PM is right. This not the time. They had a referendum not long ago and many Scott's don't want it.

Sturgeon is trying to take advantage of Brexit hoping that any hostility against Brexit will emerge with a vote in favour of Scottish independence. She is nothing if not totally transparent.

Of course the situation has changed, Brexit did not win by a majority. if the other three countries voted to leave then fair enough but in terms of countries it was split right down the middle and it was England's vote that swayed it.

Why should we expect Scotland to to stay with us when there's obviously an imbalance of influence in an union in which each country should be equal? Like Niamh said, it's utterly hypocritical to make Scotland stay when the Brexit supporters apparently voted to leave because they didn't want to live under EU 'rule' anymore (It was immigration, let's be real.). It's the same situation.

I don't support an EU rerun because it was obvious to anyone that wasn't wilfully ignorant what was going to happen if Leave won. People who make bad decisions deserve to face the consequences but the result of Scotland Ref, at the time, wasn't a bad decision. It was the only decision really but that decision has turned sour through no fault of Scotland's which I believe means they should get another shot at deciding whether or not they want independence. If they stay then they face the consequences with eyes open like the rest of us.

Indeed.

You see, Cherie. London is a city where as Scotland is a country. Do I REALLY have to explain the differences to you between the two and why a city becoming independent is a world apart than a country?

They will have their referendum just not while the Brexit deal is going through like selfish Nicola wants, they are out of the EU for the foreseeable whether they have a referendum or not as it will take time to get back in that is if the EU will take them. Let's be real this isn't about the EU for Scotland either it just an opportunity to have another referendum,keep asking the question you will get the answer you want in the end.

Yeah I do think the Eu is being used as an excuse. Bet Sturgeon was over the moon when the leave vote came through...there might not have been another excuse for a while. Next one would probably have been at the general election when tories are voted in again.

[QUOTE=Dezzy;9252805]You see, Cherie. London is a city where as Scotland is a country. Do I REALLY have to explain the differences to you between the two and why a city becoming independent is a world apart than a country?



[/The capital was shown to be monumentaly out-of-step wit the rest of Britain after largely voting Remain while the nation voted to Leave the EU.

But today the disconnect was heightened further as London's army of Bremain-backing resident called on the city's new mayor Sadiq Khan, to declare Greater London and its nine

million population an independent state.

Breakaway campaigners then want London to join Scotland in a new referendum which would allow them to re-join the EU.

So far, nearly 65,000 people have signed a petition asking Labour's Mr Khan "to declare London independent, and apply to join the EU".

It goes on to ask Mr Khan to "make the divorce official and move in with our friends on the continent".

Sturgeon doesn't give a damn about Scotland only getting what she wants.

And may wants to keep her tartan bargaining chip to tout at the WTO.

Brexiteers getting up in arms about a union between countries possibly ending?

https://media.giphy.com/media/Vsl4fGedmYFRC/giphy.gif

Scotland would have to join the back of the queue for EU membership
 

'An independent Scotland would have to join the back of the queue if it wanted to rejoin the E U, the Spanish foreign minister has said.

Responding to Monday’s announcement from Scotland’s first minister, Nicola Sturgeon, that she intends to hold a second independence referendum , Alfonso Dastis said Spain was opposed to the fracturing of the UK.'

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.t...ck-of-eu-queue

I can't imagine why you would think the government would need Scotland as a bargaining chip with the WTO. Where do you get these ideas? :shrug:

It stands to reason unless you think that of the United Kingdoms one of those kingdoms has nothing to trade :shrug:

I get my ideas from my brain, where do you get yours... jaxie?

Scotland voted to remain in the union knowing full well the union was set to vote on the EU. Scotland voted in the EU referendum as part of the union, not as a separate country. I don't see why that is hard to understand. :shrug:

No offence but I sometimes wonder as it does come across sometimes that if some said the world was round you would disagree for the sake of disagreeing. I may be wrong but to me it comes across that way on occasion.

:laugh: I feel the same way.

Is this why you came into the thread, to disagree with my stance ladies?... :laugh:

The world is square and that's the end of it

Why else?

Not at all first I didn't vote for Brexit, I am happy for a 2nd ref to take place just not at the time Nicola wants its, once the deal is done or not done or however it turns out, Nicola can have it after that

This for Me too.

I'd say more oblong.... :fan:

I think you'll find that it is infact actually an oblate ellipsoid in actual fact

Maybe I'm being unfair, maybe some brains are square or oblong. :laugh:

I don't care about Sturgeon's motives, she's a toad.

I just think that Scotland has the grounds to demand another referendum as does NI if they want to rejoin Ireland or go it alone. Like I said before, if they decide to stay then they face the carnage with the rest of us but we can't force them to stay by denying a referendum. We could very well be forcing their hand if we make them wait.

Scotland wouldn't leave if there was another Ref now. It would be better to do the vote ASAP and get it out the way then allow the embitterment and resentment to grow and cause Scotland to break away when we're in a sensitive position post brexit.

Better to go through Brexit knowing that we stand united.

You know, I do find it odd how against a Scottish Indy ref English people seem to be. I mean... You don't live here and therefore aren't affected by it directly... And APPARENTLY Scotland is nothing but a drain on UK funds being propped up by the English taxpayer... So why so against it? Why are you so bothered by it?

Is it simply because you find the notion that a large chunk of Scottish people don't want to be a part of Precious Britain offensive? Is it a "How dare you!" thing?

Unfortunately you have misread the situation, happy for you to have it, just don't want it to be a distraction during the Brexit it talks, better together once we don't suffer because of your antics :hehe:

I sort of agree but then, on the other hand, this was Camerosborne's exact thinking with the Brexit referendum [emoji23]. That's why there was no plan for it and its all such a colossal mess. They were absolutely positive that it wouldn't be "leave" so they called it to get it out of the way and move on... Wups. We know how that turned out.

That's a good point I guess, the problem is the getting the timing right so it doesn't distract from the Brexit Deal or No Deal

Ohhh so you want to keep hold of your vassal until you can secure a better deal for yourselves, and then it doesn't matter any more, even if it's detrimental to Scotland to wait until after full Brexit to break away. Gotcha.

I want the best deal for the UK, once that is done you can stay or you can go, it makes no odds to the majority of people south of the border