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- - Is Suicide selfish? (https://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338043)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987465)

With all due respect LT, a lot of people who end up committing suicide have admitted they have a problem and have gotten professional help

really, how do you know that?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987465)

With all due respect LT, a lot of people who end up committing suicide have admitted they have a problem and have gotten professional help

Yes One Lady , I knew
was in Love with a Married Man
his Wife stopped her Solid

She sadly was so in love with him
and because she was stopped from seeing him,
she killed herself
Tragic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987478)

really, how do you know that?

Well I was aware that my best friend was suffering from depression and was getting professional help before she died, I was also at a funeral very recently of a man I know who committed suicide and his close family and friends were all aware he suffered with depression and he was getting professional help.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherie (Post 9987476)

I don't think it is black and white, I think if the person takes their life and outwardly there were no signs and they leave no note it leaves the family behind with questions that will never be answered and also at a loss as to why they couldn't help' so in some ways it can be unintentionally selfish as the person is so wrapped up in their own depression they can't take account of anyone else's feelings, just imagine if your brother, sister, mother, daughter took their life and you had no idea why? I don't know how I would cope with that

That was one thing I was really glad about after my friend died, that she'd left me a note trying to help me understand what was going on in her head and to say goodbye.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987483)

She professional help
is not enough, on its own for some folks,
Valid Points
Fine Lady.

Quote:

Originally Posted by arista (Post 9987486)

She professional help
is not enough on its own for some folks
Valid Points
Fine Lady.

No it isn't, I do often wonder if she'd waited a bit longer because she was so young would things have gotten better for her but maybe not I don't know. 18 is so young, my own daughter just turned 18 last Monday

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987483)

maybe the fact that 3x more men kill themselves explains that women are more likely to seek help/talk than men?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987485)

That was one thing I was really glad about after my friend died, that she'd left me a note trying to help me understand what was going on in her head and to say goodbye.

So sad for you but a note at least is closure of sorts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987492)

maybe the fact that 3x more men kill themselves explains that women are more likely to seek help/talk than men?

Well I just gave you an example of both a man and a woman there who both seeked help. My friend also said there was alot of men in her group.

I read somewhere though that (or maybe Vicky told me this statistic) that its not that men are more inclined to suffer from depression than women or more inclined to attempt suicide but that they are more inclined to use more violent and therefore successful methods

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987497)

Yes but anecdotal evidence is just that, I wonder if there have been any studies done?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherie (Post 9987494)

So sad for you but a note at least is closure of sorts.

Yeah, I mean I know we all have down times where we feel sad and low for no real reason but with most people they know they'll snap out of it the next day or after a nights sleep or whatever. I just try to imagine feeling like that but not knowing if you'll ever snap out of it again. It must be truly horrendous

The current thinking on depression ( and gathering evidence apace) is that it is medical, an inflammation of the brain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987499)

Yes but anecdotal evidence is just that, I wonder if there have been any studies done?

Yeah it's anecdotal but that's all I have I'm afraid. And I was replying to your comment about getting help and admitting you have a problem which people do do and for some that doesn't help

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987501)

The current thinking on depression ( and gathering evidence apace) is that it is medical, an inflammation of the brain.

I suppose that's good news? That you can treat it properly with medication but I have heard that the current medications they prescribe can totally dampen peoples personalities and abilities to enjoy life aswell. Hopefully that will change

Coincidentally when i went to my dads grave last week I took the TL to see my G Grandfathers grave, he hung himself in his loft when he was 39

Imagine going up the ladder to your loft knowing that you were about to do that, does not bear thinking about

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987509)

Yeah which is why I think that it can't be a frivolous decision too, I mean no person acting out of just selfishness will do that. You know, if that's the only way you think is going to stop the despair you're going through? It's so sad

Had an auction pal, Irish chap, 5 kids, spoke to everyone, knew everyone, lovely and friendly had banter going with all the porters and ladies in the office, in his early 40s

One day i went to my usual auction and a lady came up to me and aid did you here about Jim, i said no, she said went off into the woods by his house with a sleeping bag and pills and vodka and killed himself

I still cant quite believe that and it was 4 years ago now, awful

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987490)

No it isn't, I do often wonder if she'd waited a bit longer because she was so young would things have gotten better for her but maybe not I don't know. 18 is so young, my own daughter just turned 18 last Monday

Yes I agree very Sad loss.
So Young.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987518)

Yeah, you always hear that too don't you, how friendly and funny and joyful people are and how it's such a shock. My friend was like that too, always the joker in the group

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987523)

Yeah, you always hear that too don't you, how friendly and funny and joyful people are and how it's such a shock. My friend was like that too, always the joker in the group

this is why i think that it must be in many cases a medical condition that alters the brain and the thought process chemically

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9987524)

this is why i think that it must be in many cases a medical condition that alters the brain and the thought process chemically

Yeah I think you could be right. Brains are funny things.

Ugh this thread is making me feel a bit weepy. It's an interesting topic though

Crude Suicide Rate by Country 2018

Spoiler:

http://worldpopulationreview.com/cou...te-by-country/

How come the UK isn't on that list?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9987530)

How come the UK isn't on that list?

i dont know

suicide rate for the UK is 16.0 per 100,000 for males and 5.0 per 100,000 for females

Looks like the Caribbean is the place to be :laugh:

Quote:

Originally Posted by kirklancaster (Post 9987392)

It's NOT really a long post Twosugars, but it is a beautifully honest and brilliant post. Thank you.

AS with the other honest posts on here, I am genuinely moved and more than a little disturbed.

All too often on these forums, we become so used to unconscious imagery and imagined personas created by avatars and words, that we lose sight of the fact that there are real people - humans - behind the chat and discussions.

I have been 'depressed' as I guess most people have at some times in their lives but I don't think that I have ever suffered 'Depression' of the degree being revealed here and my heart goes out to those who are suffering from this.

We are all too familiar with the increasingly common reports of medical/surgical patients being kept overnight on trolleys in corridors through a lack of hospital beds and other atrocious and unacceptable 'horror' stories due to the NHS lack of funding crisis, but experiences like yours with the lack of care from Medical profession and Psychiatrists are less well publicised but as equally enraging and SOMETHING must be done to improve this unacceptable state of affairs.

I believe wholeheartedly that discussion has a cathartic effect on me and I hope - genuinely hope - that this is the same for you and other depression sufferers on here.

My Message Box is always open should you or anyone else ever feel any need to talk - politics or shet - it does not matter.

I have been made to stop and think about my views on certain subjects by the contributions to this thread about a subject which I hitherto never thought about, and THAT in itself is a fact to be lauded.

Aw, thank you Kirk for your kind and thoughtful words. And your offer of lending a sympathetic ear. :blush:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twosugars (Post 9987546)

Aw, thank you Kirk for your kind and thoughtful words. And your offer of lending a sympathetic ear. :blush:

No problem Twosugars. I mean every word mate. This has shaken me a little because I have never given this horrible illness any real thought despite a very dear friend of mine committing suicide by pouring petrol over himself in his parked van and setting himself on fire when still a young man over 35 years ago now.

He was always a little 'miserable' looking but perfectly normal to all intents and purposes and enjoyed a laugh and living, but apart from the great shock and the mentally wondering 'Why?' when he did what he did with NO warning, I never thought any more about depression.

Anytime you need to talk mate I'm here.

Not selfish at all imo

It is selfish but I don't think they realise this they just want to end their suffering

Sorry to say it is selfish.

More so when someone kills themselves and their wife and kids.

:mad:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gusto Brunt (Post 9987637)

Sorry to say it is selfish.

More so when someone kills themselves and their wife and kids.

:mad:

Well that's murder, totally different from suicide

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twosugars (Post 9987223)

Agreed, if you want to kill yourself you can always do it.

As to those with depression not seeking help, life is not that simple.
Sometimes people are trapped pretending they're fine because that's what's expected of them.
Sometimes people try to seek help and are met with unhelpful or demoralised health service professionals. Sometimes depressed people cannot be persistent and eloquent enough to explain how they feel because depression diminished their cognitive skills.
I can give you some examples from my encounters with "help".
I moved from one part of London to another 6 years ago. I'd suffered from depression for the last 19 years and my records showed that. The first practice I registerd with at the new address couldn't manage to get my records transferred from the old practice for 6 months. I had to beg for every single prescription of antidepressants until they finally got my records. For the next two years it was smooth sailing. Then I started going downhill very quickly. Went to ask for a referral, a GP told me that I have nothing to be depressed about and should try his life to see what hardship is. So I changed the practice. There first doctor I saw agreed to refer me and then forgot while I waited for 5 months. Went to another who thankfully refered me straightaway. 2 months later had my assessment with a psychiatrist where I was told I have to wait up to a year to see a therapist. During that year they tinkered changing my antidepressants as nothing seemed to work anymore. Finally arrived at something that wasn't brilliant but made my life bearable. The therapy consisted of 8 1hr meetings with no possibility of extension (lack of resources). Try to get your whole outlook on life and unresolved issues sorted in 8 hours. After that psychiatrist had enough and started pressurising me gently to say I wasn't suicidal anymore. I complied and they dropped me. Am I better, yes. Am I cured, no. I'm still depressed and anxious. Sometimes I can't face the outside world. But according to them, I'm good to go.
I was persistent because I wanted to save myself for those I love. Others may not have enough strength to battle the system.

Geez, I'm giving Maru run for her money with the length of this post

You've highlighted so many of the very real problems that exist in your post, Twosugars. You are showing that even someone desperately seeking help can fail to receive anything truly meaningful, and that's a massive issue.

No-one would choose suicide if there seemed to be another way out- it must be the most frightening thing in the world.

I hope you know that you are not alone, Twosugars, and that there are always people on here willing to listen and provide support, should you ever need it.