Brexiteers are free marketeers, Fox wants zero import tariffs. That'd wipe out British agriculture and manufacturing.
All these factory workers voting for brexit are like turkeys voting for Christmas.
I'd laugh if it wasn't so tragic
People were conned. Nothing was said about that, only immigration.
And non eu immigration is already soaring.
But that's ok according to Gove bc now we have a democratic control. Bollox. UK always had control over non eu immigration. People were expecting reduction in numbers. One big con.

Well Brexit does allow us to accept chlorinated chicken where previously the EU barred it. Whether we want to or not is our own decision but I find it odd that it can excite passions so much when people very rarely look into the background of the food they eat, when they'd probably never known about this aspect of farming before now and when it's not exactly had disastrous effects in the US

Imo this is a completely trivial issue which has become a lightning rod for anti Brexit campaigners

It is an issue because as the USA is indicating trade deals with the USA could have some reliance on accepting these meats.

Which our governments have refused to do in line with EU guidelines on the issue.
If we do start breaking down our standards as to any food, just to acquire new trading deals.
What does that really say about us.

It's actually quite an issue, a choice too, however it is an issue relating to possible welfare of those pro or anti brexit who eat these types of meat.

No one has made much noise of even wanting USA imports of these meats before.
Being content with the standards we already have and not liking much the USA standards at all.
So is clearly an issue, for all meat eaters.

Yes but people act as if we'd be adopting some barbaric practice which will be disastrous for our food quality which is all just hyperbole. The US would strongly disagree with the EU that it lowers food standards so its within our gift to approach the issue independently and make our own decision now rather than being bound by what the EU had decided. If you actually read what the US ambassador said its quite reasonable:

Well that is certainly a spin on we are in control....

its very patronising to say the British consumer is not conscious of where their food comes from, since the BSE scandal consumers are very keen know where their food comes

Its all very well saying consumers will have a choice of what to buy, but this food will find its way into school dinners, hospitals and care homes where cost is the bottom line

The Americans saving the environment by pumping their cattle with hormones, wow that's some claim, I assume everyone washes their own vegetables before they eat them? so what they were previously washed in is immaterial? The advice is never to wash chicken before cooking

Good for you Joey,you soon get used to it,they have some lovely veggie foods now.

The reason for that, though, is that it invariably leads to "splashback" spreading the bacteria from raw chicken to the sink area / any nearby dishes or cutlery and that's where contamination occurs whereas if chicken is in date and properly cooked through there shouldn't really be any risk of food poisoning. Although a lot of people undercook chicken.

As you know Cherie I'm firmly anti-Brexit but I think this particular issue is a red herring; I have some concerns about American farming METHODS such as overuse of pesticide / use of pesticides banned here but that's an environmental concern. I honestly don't think there's anything at all wrong with the quality of US produced fresh food. The American health crisis (just like our own) is down to what's done with those products afterwards... i.e. their processed foods, which are full of vast quantities of high fructose corn syrup, MSG, hydrogenated fats and other chemical additives. That "extra-specially fat American" image that you see, that seems to be far less common across the rest of the world, is largely down to snacks full of corn syrup and hydrogenated fats being widely available and very cheap.

Should we not be learning from our past mistakes? Obesity in Britain is down to our love and import of many things American in particular their fast food chains, in this new dawn, and when 'we are in control of our own trade deals' the brave thing to do would be to pick and choose what we import, I don't know why you are saying its a red herring I was just listening to Liam Fox talking about this, and the alternative to not taking this type of product is to import more American organic but of course that wont be a money spinner now will it and won't be taken up by our Acadamys, hospitals and care homes, and again I reiterate not sure why everyone is foccused on chlorination when the other two issues are a far grimmer prospect

I disagree Cherie; obesity / diabetes crisis is caused by a combination of abundantly available processed food in supermarkets (which didn't used to be available), and poor mental health (which has always been a thing but is increasing). Emotionally healthy people don't become obese no matter what food is available. It's not the food.

Fox also agreed that it's not a safety issue, even if this food did start being used in schools and care homes etc I'm not sure it's any worse than the current cheapest alternatives that they use now. And with an ageing and growing population I think it's legitimate to look at how different methods could help with that. The obesity link is a bit tenuous imo, agree with TS that there are much more important other factors

Fox was suggesting that we probably wouldn't accept these methods anyway and that it was standard stuff for the US to request at the start of a negotiation but not necessarily a major sticking point

Who’s saying US meat is “sub standard” though?

Different farming methods to the EU doesn’t automatically mean bad.
If anything you’d think chlorine washed chicken would be safer than just water washed chicken?

As for growth hormone,Is there any evidence that it gets passed on to humans through consumption and if so that it’s in any way harmful?

Maybe the US’ farming techniques are actually ahead of the curve?

Maybe all countries will adopt these practices soon enough anyway?

Alot of this stuff to me seems like project fear 3.0 tbh.

British farmers are getting jumpy because they have been protected for decades in the EU. The biggest concern will be that they get priced out the market

thats alot of ifs and buts, will you be feeding your children the beef full of hormones?

also how do you feel about American dictating the terms of the deal because that is how its looking from where I am sitting

The obesity link is tenuous :joker:

Well yeah the only place I've seen the two linked is on here, what's the evidence that these methods contribute to obesity?

Read and digest (pardon the pun) what I have actually posted, I never said these methods contribute to obesity, I said we should learn from what we have already imported from the US...ie Mc Donalds, KFC, hotdogs, doughnuts...etc.............ect.........etc......

what I actually posted, not sure why this wasn't clear to you?

Should we not be learning from our past mistakes? Obesity in Britain is down to our love and import of many things American in particular their fast food chains

The "supersize" obesity problem in the US is down to hydrogenated fats, HFCS and the culture of the food service industry supplying huge portions as standard. Oh and the weird tenancy to add sugar to products that don't need it, like bread and milk. There's not really any mystery around it, these things are already known. But sugar has always been an abundant and cheap energy source in the US so it's sort of baked into ( :hehe: ) their culture.

we wont learn from that though will we, we NEED a trade deal, so lets just bring even more ****ty stuff in so we can stretch the health service even more, then we can buy even more of their over priced pharmaceuticals and privatise the NHS because the state wont be able to cope. YAY!

Stuff the whole world has imported, its not really relevant to this particular issue of farming methods so yeah it still seems pretty tenuous to me..

Should we never import anything from the US ever again because some families got fat from eating McDonald's every day :shrug:

This is a stretch. We have junk food and would have junk food regardless of if American franchises can sell their own junk food over here.

Most of it tastes and is made differently to how it is done in the US anyway so there is no connection to the type of thing they're proposing now.

Tbqfh good ol' British fish & chips are far worse than most meals from KFC or McDonald's... And things like Chinese and Indian take-aways aren't much better.

I just think this argument is off the mark simply because it misunderstands the reasons for bad relationships with food and related health / weight problems. People overeat for comfort and eat badly because of lifestyle. The type of food and where it came from is largely irrelevant.

The only slightly relevant factor is the price and availability; there is an issue in the US with huge portion sizes being expected for a reasonable price. But... Let's be honest here... No matter what else happens with Brexit, I don't think food getting CHEAPER is a realistic outcome. We'll in fact be very lucky if it doesn't become significantly more expensive.

You are missing my point, obesity is a huge drain on the NHS and a leading cause of cancer, whats the point of leaving one Union where we are dictated only to replace it by another even worse dictator, these foods are banned for a reason and not available in the EU, I thought the whole point of leaving the EU was so we could make our own deals, be in charge of our own destiny yadda yadda …..

also I have to laugh at all the...well I won't be buying it posts and the consumer will have the choice......there is a serious hint of I'm alright Jack raising its head there

Yes and when the deals with India and China include sending banned foods or drugs to the UK I will raise it, I don't know what argument you are trying to make as you keep going off in non relatable tangents

The only way the UK will benefit economically from leaving the EU is by reducing standards in order to reduce production costs. Give those outside of the EU the cheap **** they crave. This lowering of standards works both ways though in that we will be over run with complete tosh. You pay your money and you take your choice. I'm sure euro goods will still be available, just a lot more expensive.

just seen this blog from DR and she has put it much better than I ever will....hope you don't mind me reproducing it here..

rexit was described by US Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross as a “God-given opportunity” to take business from the UK, while Britain is facing a “period of confusion”.

We have outsourced ourselves for decades to the EU and subsequently have very little experience on how to make good trade deals and because of the imbalance of market size, that puts us in a terrible bargaining position. This could well end up as a game of bullying and when it comes to bullying, the larger guy usually wins.

What we are going to end up with is American rabid free traders because most people won’t be willing to pay for expensive cuts of British meat and dairy products. Our own prices will cripple the economic sustainability of large parts of our farming and that’s why the American food chain will move in with ease. The more we are forced to close down, the more unaffordable our meat and dairy products will become.

Remember what happened when Thatcher removed the tariffs from imported coal? This is going to be the same story again and again and for what… for some short term gain to a small number of people at the top.

And for those worried about chlorinated chicken (and so you should be), its not just food. Food labelling, in fact any labelling will have to be deregulated. Changes in our NHS system will almost certainly happen. Undermining our already crippled NHS by charging for pharmaceutical products more in line with America will ensure our NHS fails. It means changing our laws, our standards. Compromising our environment, giving up more and more control to the big boy.

Should we be scared, I mean could we be cleaned out like Wilbur Ross is so gleefully suggesting? As far as I can see it, we are jumping from one union straight into another… out of the frying pan into the fire. Its like we have nothing to gain and everything to lose.

The Duchess of Sussex has entered the post-Brexit trade deal row over chlorine-washed chicken from America.
Californian-born Meghan yesterday expressed her clear unease about ‘industrial US food systems’ and how ‘badly wrong the US food systems are’.

Of course she would

well she is better placed than most of us to comment :suspect:

:nono: Has no one told her yet that the Royals aren't supposed to take political sides? Maybe after she has her baby she'll learn how to look pretty and stay quiet :hmph:. Harry needs to get his house in order and Kate needs to ramp up the Stepford lessons, this is unacceptable loud-mouthery.

will someone tell her to play by the rules :worry:

I know Cherie! These Americans, coming in here, taking our princes, loudly stating their opinions. Chlorinating our chicken and Momo'ing our children:fist:

:joker:

No one cares what Meghan thinks. Actresses are just there to say the words written by more intelligent people.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...exit-standards

actopamine
Ractopamine is a growth hormone used to promote leanness in animals by shifting nutrients into muscle and away from fat deposition. It is administered in the days leading up to slaughter.

It is banned by the EU, mainland China, Russia and almost 160 other countries but not in the US, Japan or North Korea. According to the European parliament, “the substance is widely used: according to some estimates, in the rearing of 60-80% of all pigs produced” in the US.

In swine, the drug is linked to several adverse effects including hyperactivity, broken limbs and trembling.


Banned in Russia and China.....:idc: that doesn't sound very promising now does it?

To be fair, of that list, the heavy use of antibiotics in farming does concern me quite a bit. It's also one that affects all of us, no matter what we choose to eat.