No, you're right it's not just women opting out, there is a definite shift in attitudes towards having children, which I for one welcome - I think far too many people had kids without giving actual proper thought about it and those choosing not to tend to give it way more thought and weight up the pros and cons.

However, the studies to do it's still more men than women want kids, and I think in part that's due to women not being satisfied with the disparity within the home.

Would love to get other stats/studies showing alternative opinions! Open to learning. I can just go by what stats tend to say and the rhetoric I hear from the men and women I speak to and read about. :)

Reminds me of when we had the referendum for abortion here in Ireland a few years back, the most vocal people on the against side that I came across personally were men and in particular men who I knew for a fact had been pretty uninvolved in the raising of their own children or didn't have any children. It was very much a stance of wanting babies to be born but obviously someone else(some woman) would have to look after them. - Anecdotal of course but it was my experience at the time

…yeah I have to say that I spend a lot of time on a few American forums that are general chat forums and much of their take anything US political is so much different to any vein on this site…which I think seems to be very media driven that has crossed a whole ocean and maybe much lost in translation…

…in having children in today’s world…?..I think that any shifts also have to look at the financial aspect…they’re extremely expensive little people and I think that’s a huge consideration because there are so many opportunities available for many young people but so much more restricted with the cost of having a family…

Indeed.

Of course the same doesn't apply to everyone and with what I've said further up, it comes with caveats and some generalisations of course, but a lot of generalisations are rooted in truth. I don't know of many women in my life who would say the unevenness of the mental load isn't something that gets to them.

Absolutely, money has a lot to do with it too. There are many reasons, I am just saying I do think for women, knowing that the majority of the raising of a child, the graft and the real hard parts will fall to her if another.

I do have to put my hand up here now though and say my own husband is and has always been great, children and home wise but yeah generally speaking I would say the majority of women feel an imbalance there

…yeah, it really does feel quite regressive that, that mindset is still so commonplace…obviously not with all, my son and his partner both share childcare absolutely equally and have both reduced their working hours to accommodate that …which is lovely because they both get their own bonding time with him as well as that which they all share together…that is also very much the way with many of his friendship groups also, that it’s very much a shared and equal arrangement …I do think though that it’s becoming less and less the ‘society roles’ of parenting of it falling to women, though…I see that in schools/in the playground drop offs/collections etc of the parent eho attends school events if only one parent is able to…I do think there is a shift thre as well which I hope doesn’t regress and continues as it appears to be, right now…

…yes, I’m raising my hand as far up as I can and saying I’m rubbish cook for a start and there are so many things that the they’ve both gone to dad for…they do have specifics that they’ve always come to me for as well…we have definite roles which have always been equal in value in parenting…

Thank you! That’s so nice to hear! You don’t often have people say nice things about Americans but I’ve always felt more accepted and loved here than anywhere else

Divorced guys be one court hearing away from watching Jordan Peterson clips and voting Trump.

…(…I think …)…because of the vein of the forum we are in terms of the things we discuss as well…?..it tends to be very media led and very negative and very click-British as well and just quite inaccurate in terms of balance because it all does have a very political and divisive vein…but when we’re chatting to Americans, it’s just not the same conversations that we’re having…it’s everyday stuff and the type of things we all chat about in our family and friend circles and yeah, many very accepting people as you say with the same gripes and groans as us in the UK only with a funny accent…

Television and feminist propaganda on it, destroyed women's role in nature.

Now most are selling their bodies online or living alone with their cats.

What they realy want is to have a family they can nurture. They want a man who provides security and in return, she will look after him and the family. Used to be a fair trade, until they let the ugly, angry, envious feminists on the television.

It's leftie politics that destroyed women's role in nature.

Men are fine. We'll always find something to do. We can just put the playstation on and be happy.

It’s almost as if women don’t deserve men huh.

Women don’t need men.

"Living alone with their cats" don't threaten me with a good time :hee:

But you're much happier living with your kids and family than you would be living with cats.

Am I right? I'm not wrong.

Men are killing themselves. Men are not fine.

Imagine replying to what I said calling it rubbish and then coming out with that.

Perhaps listen to women.

I listen to women everyday. They just bitch about other women. Who wants to listen to that sh!te by choice? I'd rather have a quiet pint thanks all the same.

Ah yes, the guy with no woman, and zero self-awareness telling women what their “duty” is. Always a treat. It’s wild how confidently you speak about women when the closest you’ve gotten to one is arguing with women online. Maybe instead of preaching about what women should do, try figuring out why none of them are choosing you. Start there, champ.

I figured it out years ago. I'm at peace with it.

Ah, makes sense. Acceptance is the final stage, right? Glad you’ve made peace with being loudly opinionated about women from the sidelines. It’s giving “didn’t get picked, so burned the rulebook.” Stay serene, king.

Will do. Thank you.

You go out and vote for people to control our lives, who are far more opinionated than me.

You yourself are more opinionated than me. There isn't any topic of conversation on here that you don't have an opinion on.

The difference is I actually live in the real world, where people listen, engage, and sometimes even agree. You’re just posting manifesto drafts from a recliner, bitter at a world that never gave you the control you think you deserved. No one’s scared of your opinions—they’re just not worth the time. That’s why you’re at “peace,” right? It’s easier to pretend you’ve chosen solitude than admit you were never invited.

Then why give my opinions the time? I'm not forcing you to.

You have an ignore button. You are able to use it if you wanted to.

I think it's because you have the hots for me.

I don’t need the ignore button. Watching you talk in circles trying to sound wise is actually fascinating. You post to be noticed, then pretend you don’t care when you are. It’s not that your opinions bother me—they just confirm exactly why you’re still having this conversation alone.
And now it’s because I secretly fancy you? That’s adorable. When the arguments run out, flirt with your critic—bold strategy. Truth is, I respond for the same reason people slow down at a car crash. Morbid curiosity. You’re not being ignored because you’re “too real”—you’re being humoured because it’s honestly a bit tragic.

A very spot on assessment.

You're wiser than I thought you were.

No ****

It's giving incel.

It's giving communist

It's giving Antifa

Anne Tifa is my drag name, yaaaas.

Good choice, it fits you well.

In all seriousness, I would say I am a communist - I believe in a free market economy, and would say I am more a Libertarian.

You do know that communism makes facism look a picnic when it comes to genocide?

It definitely comes across that way to me.

Not with AI around the corner to do the work for everyone.

Oh dear, that was a typo ! I meant to say I am NOT a communist, hence why I believe in a free market economy. :laugh: