because theres far more to these religions and churchesthat simply what you choose to hate about them

Who said I hate anyone/anything? :conf:

If a church is completely against you as a person, says who you are is wrong then why would you worship or want to have your relationship celebrated there when your relationship is the very thing the church is against?

we were discussing whether men had suffered you totally missed the point of course

I'm confused....

about?

agree with this

some gay people are religious

That's in the other thread my dear. Double check the thread title you made, we're discussing churches and gay marriage.

thanks my dear. another pedantic tricial point though as the subjects clearly overlap. then again you ignore the deaths of 70 million and choose to get angry about trivial stuff

:joker:

you can see who is baiting and throwing chepa verbal abuse, marsh yet again. moderators its up to you.

and?

if so, they should get married in church they are allowed to be openly gay. but if the church is against it then fair enough

I've said this before in a thread of this kind, but here goes again... I wasn't allowed to marry in a synagogue, even though I would have liked to, because my husband wasn't Jewish. I didn't feel like a victim, I didn't feel ostracised from my fellow Jews because I know that's the rule. I didn't think they should be made to marry us.

If someone's gay and also religious, they'll have their own take on this and either accept it as a rule, marry in a civil service and have a blessing afterwards, or they'll perhaps know a friendly cleric who will perform the ceremony. If the people involved are not religious, I don't see that it would matter much to them anyway.

More irrelevance.

You misunderstand me, what I'm saying is that a church that charges for their services shouldn't be allowed to discriminate. So if they're happy enough taking money from straight non believers who just want a church wedding for the sake of it then they'll have to take on gay clients too if they want to continue making money at all.

As for your second point why would non-religious people want a church wedding? it's because it's part of the typical wedding fantasy. Why is it okay for these people to have Church Weddings when they aren't religious but not gays?

I never said it was "okay".

But the straight couples aren't having their entire life/relationship completely nullified by that religion.

It's like "forcing" the ku klux klan to share a house with immigrants. Why would the immigrants even want to in the first place?

Because it's part of the wedding fantasy like I mentioned before.

if you think about weddings they are kind of gay anyway. I think hetro males should refuse to get married as weddings are too gay and unless they man them up a little we are saying NO

I mean the fecking outfits, bridesmaids, napkins, tables of relatives all making small talk, a vicar in a frock, Come on Eileen followed by Shalimar "Take that to the bank", the cars

This madness must stop - its like religious Carnival. Its way, way too fierce

That's not a valid enough reason IMO.

Wanting to be married in a church even though you're not religious because it's pretty is one thing.

Wanting to be married in a church even though you're not religious and the church you're marrying in is completely against you and your life is quite another.

Only if you have a bride intent on having and loving those things.

My sister got married in a simple service, no over the top dresses etc. Had a party afterwards, went on holiday, that was it. :laugh:

And then started married life without a £30,000 debt for one day of extravagance you don't really need.

Why should the reason matter? I may be wrong with the number but I think there's a total of 8 references to gay people in the bible, I'm willing to bet the number of references to non believers being hellbound is a lot more prevalent yet they aren't ostracised in the same way.

No they shouldnt be forced to wed anyone they don't want to. Its still acceptable to refuse to perform ceremonies for divorced people on basically no grounds besides 'we dont agree with it'..so I dont really see the difference.

Personally though, I would think any vicar that refuses to carry out a wedding either to a gay couple, or a divorced one, or any thing else (legal) is a bit of a douche, but its their choice to be a douche :shrug:

Edit. After reading this I see niamh already made the divorce point...and also I agree with the why would you want to get married in a place that had to be forced to do it argument.

Well I have known couples get married in Church who never go to Church and don't have any belief either.
They just want a 'show' wedding,sometimes just to please Parents/Family.
So Churches marry people they maybe ought not to as to male/female marriages.

The sad thing is Churches are hypocritical anyway in their standards.
Having said that I don't think they should be forced to conduct gay marriages although I wouldn't be surprised,if the 'price' was right, for a relaxation of that attitude sometime in the future by some of them.
The Church is in its own little world anyway.

So no,I don't think they should be or could be even forced into conducting gay marriages.
Equally I don't think they are right to oppose gay marriage and I cannot see why 2 people who really love each other and want to commit for life to each other, should be denied having full recognition of that and the marriage they want.
Especially when it is not against any law in this Country now.

Not religious or not much of a church goer doesn't necessarily denote "non believer".