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-   -   Should Atheists Celebrate Holidays e.g. Christmas? (https://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52962)

:)tom:) 08-02-2008 02:43 PM

the thing is than in this day you dont hear about the religious side of it thats why people call it xmass to take away the christ so its a little religious as possible.i do think people should be allowed to celibrate christmass if they belive or not, its a great day and people should be aloud to enjoy it

:)

Matt10k 08-02-2008 02:48 PM

I was debating about the "religious" aspect as the first post said, that's why I said the tree has no link with the Christian religion. Sorry if we did have a misunderstood, I was talking in terms of religion, not the winter solistice.
I'm not saying atheists must not celebrate it but as the debate was about the religion, in that point, they should not. But if they got their traditions then good for them.

You're right about the french name but that doesn't mean all french people celebrate christmas only for the winter soltice or for being catholic. They are 2 different aspects.

So I think we were debating but in 2 different ways lol If we talk about the religion side, atheists should not (for me indeed). [/quote]

Ok. Well I don't celebrate it religiously but I do understand the Christian aspects, as do I understand other aspects of it now I have learnt about them.

Maybe we should all just be more tolerant, understand that a celebration hurts no one and celebrate whatever the hell we want!

As Tom says, Christmas is a good time, people give presents, give to charity, spend time together, have time off work etc... so there are other reasons to celebrate Christmas for those who are not Christians.

As a final point though Tom, I think 'Xmas' comes from the letter 'X' used to represent Christ which became popular a few hundred years ago though off the top of my head can't remember exactly when...

Dr43%er 08-02-2008 03:51 PM

Remy, you said
"So I think we were debating but in 2 different ways lol If we talk about the religion side, atheists should not (for me indeed)."

Are you saying an Atheist I can not have a point of view about religion and debate it? My view is just as valid as someone who blindly follows a religion due to "faith"

If fact I have used reason to get to my point. 1 + 2 = 3. With religion you have 1 = 3. You have to have faith that the 2 is there in the equation.

Captain.Remy 08-02-2008 03:55 PM

Quote:

Message original : Dr43%er
Remy, you said
"So I think we were debating but in 2 different ways lol If we talk about the religion side, atheists should not (for me indeed)."

Are you saying an Atheist I can not have a point of view about religion and debate it? My view is just as valid as someone who blindly follows a religion due to "faith"

If fact I have used reason to get to my point. 1 + 2 = 3. With religion you have 1 = 3. You have to have faith that the 2 is there in the equation.
Nah you did not understand my point. I was talking only about religion, so the Christian one. I only made the link between Christmas and the Christian Religion and if the atheist should celebrate it on an important day for a religion. I respected what the first post said. So matt & I were in 2 different debates. :wink:

Dr43%er 08-02-2008 03:57 PM

Ok.

Dr43%er 08-02-2008 04:07 PM

Just to put where I stand across.

I celebrate Christmas. But not as a religious festival. Yes it has it's origin in the Christian faith. But I have taken the bits I like and I can apply to me, and I use them. Eating, drinking, gifts, all with family and friends. I don't bother with the whole "God" bit as I don't believe in it. This is no difference to Christians who took what applied to them from the Pegan festival and left the bits they did not want. So I am just as justified to celebrate my Christmas as you are yours.

cujo-man 08-02-2008 04:07 PM

Hell yea!

Captain.Remy 08-02-2008 04:10 PM

Quote:

Message original : Dr43%er
Just to put where I stand across.

I celebrate Christmas. But not as a religious festival. Yes it has it's origin in the Christian faith. But I have taken the bits I like and I can apply to me, and I use them. Eating, drinking, gifts, all with family and friends. I don't bother with the whole "God" bit as I don't believe in it. This is no difference to Christians who took what applied to them from the Pegan festival and left the bits they did not want. So I am just as justified to celebrate my Christmas as you are yours.
Of course you are but if we take the subject on a religious side, it's not fair for us because it's our day.
But on the overall term, you do what you want with the traditions you want of course.

Dr43%er 08-02-2008 05:07 PM

"Of course you are but if we take the subject on a religious side, it's not fair for us because it's our day."

But I won't be taking it on the religious side. I won't be going to church, saying prayers or the like. I don't believe. That is not what my Christmas is about. If it is not fair of me then equally it is not fair of you to the Pegans. You have no divine right over any other group and I find that view quite arrogant.

Captain.Remy 08-02-2008 05:12 PM

Quote:

Message original : Dr43%er
"Of course you are but if we take the subject on a religious side, it's not fair for us because it's our day."

But I won't be taking it on the religious side. I won't be going to church, saying prayers or the like. I don't believe. That is not what my Christmas is about. If it is not fair of me then equally it is not fair of you to the Pegans. You have no divine right over any other group and I find that view quite arrogant.
Don't take it on the religious side then. I'm just answering to the question on the first post. Nothing more, nothing less.
And read my previous posts, it would help because so far, I still don't understand what I am saying, maybe I should try in an other language lol

cujo-man 08-02-2008 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tom_
For quite a while this is something which has annoyed me but came to light yesterday. Atheists claim that there is no God, and they don't go to church, don't give anything up for Lent etc but are hypocritical when it comes to holidays such as Christmas and Easter. I know its turned into more of a commercial thing than an actual religious holiday, but the origins still go back to religion and in my view, atheists should not be hypocritical and take the holidays which suit them because they enjoy it. In my view, to celebrate something like Christmas shows you cannot be a true Atheist, because if you was you wouldn't be celebrating it. Other religions don't dip in and out of other religions as it suits them, and as Atheists are classed as a religion, they should not dip in and out of Christianity.

Some Atheists are born into Christian families which I am aware of, and as its more of a British tradition these days rather than an actual religious holiday but a lot of these families as a whole are Atheists. So the question is, should Atheists celebrate certain holidays such as Christmas?
You're right - I'm convinced I'm going down the wrong route here . . . . NAT!

Dr43%er 08-02-2008 05:28 PM

Trust me, your English is a joy to read compared to some on here.

The first question was:

"Should Atheists Celebrate Holidays e.g. Christmas?"

Well an Atheist won't, by default take the religious side. They are Atheists. I think this point is linked inextricably with the whole conversation.

With regards as to whether a non religious person should join in. This Christmas a local church with the tag line "A Christian church for everyone" came to my local pub to do a carol service. They brought a brass section with them. The pub was full to the brim. They started with their version of Oh come all ye faithful. It went like this.

Oh hum all ye faithful
Doubtful and neglectful
Oh hum ye
Oh hum ye
The words ye don't know
Hum and forget them
Christmas song and sentiments.

And hum it very quietly
And hum it slightly louder
Now hum it out with gusto
The tune bit ye know.


Now, they knew they were preaching to the inconvertible. That did not mater. We all had a good laugh, a few beers and left holding up a drunk vicar. That is how it should be. Or would you think that was unfair and I should not have joined in?

FictitiousHouse 08-02-2008 06:08 PM

Christmas is about putting up a xmas tree and decorations, buying cards and presents for those who you care about...whether friends or family, it is about making someone happy. If you are an Atheist it makes no difference. It has absolutely nothing to do with xmas, easter or any other religious holiday throughout the year. Almost everyone celebrates it regardless of their religious beliefs.

If somebody chooses not to celebrate a religious holiday then they are just selfish or stupid or mean imo :shocked:

Tom 08-02-2008 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FictitiousHouse
Christmas is about putting up a xmas tree and decorations, buying cards and presents for those who you care about...whether friends or family, it is about making someone happy. If you are an Atheist it makes no difference. It has absolutely nothing to do with xmas, easter or any other religious holiday throughout the year. Almost everyone celebrates it regardless of their religious beliefs.

If somebody chooses not to celebrate a religious holiday then they are just selfish or stupid or mean imo :shocked:
Not everyone celebrates it at all :shocked: In fact far from it. I know a lot of people from other backgrounds and people who aren't Christians who dont celebrate it.

FictitiousHouse 08-02-2008 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tom_
Quote:

Originally posted by FictitiousHouse
Christmas is about putting up a xmas tree and decorations, buying cards and presents for those who you care about...whether friends or family, it is about making someone happy. If you are an Atheist it makes no difference. It has absolutely nothing to do with xmas, easter or any other religious holiday throughout the year. Almost everyone celebrates it regardless of their religious beliefs.

If somebody chooses not to celebrate a religious holiday then they are just selfish or stupid or mean imo :shocked:
Not everyone celebrates it at all :shocked: In fact far from it. I know a lot of people from other backgrounds and people who aren't Christians who dont celebrate it.
I didnt say everyone, I said <almost> everyone. Plus the question was 'Should Atheists celebrate holidays e.g. xmas' meaning...if a christian or a person from a different background like you suggested wished to celebrate xmas then I dont see a problem. Do you see a problem with freedom of choice :puzzled: even if Atheist

Stu 08-02-2008 06:27 PM

Some of the views in this thread are absurd. Of course atheists should be able to celebrate christmas. It has evolved well beyond just being a religious holiday. Everybody should be allowed make of it what they will.

Im all for people indulging in chocolate and booze. Im all for giving. Im all for human beings being happy , so yes , I am all for atheist christmas!!!


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