This is something I debate in my head a lot, in terms of morality, as the parent of a child with learning disabilities. I know there are tech companies currently developing under-the-skin GPS implants that have a battery life of years before needing replaced. On the one hand, I think there are some big moral questions around "chipping" a human being. On the other, I know my daughter is very vulnerable and is likely to go on to be a vulnerable teen and adult. On balance, for her safety I can't rule it out as something that I'd consider.

I would definitely give her a pocket GPS though.

True, but how many parents would never of dreamed that their child would kill them selves.

I think gps has a place in this ever changing world.
Not much difference to wearing a medical alert bracelet or necklace.

Most have smart phones they can be located? I don't think chipping is the answer, all children are vulnerable, do we chip all children? People with dementia are vulnerable do we chip them?

Some elderly people wear a button they they can press if they get into difficulties.

If it’s a another way of keeping loved ones safe then it’s up to those who are responsible for those with vulnerable people to use it.

Smart phones can be left behind or lost.

I would never advocate it under normal circumstances but, not to be blunt, unless you have a child with significant non-physical disabilities it's unlikely that you'll be able to understand why it's so different, or just how many extra considerations there are.

Terrible tragedy :(

The fact she was probably roaming the jungle for days in such close proximity to people searching for her <\3

I wouldn’t oppose being chipped tbh.

Can you imagine how scarey that would be, I hope she didn't suffer too much,poor girl. I think some sort of tracking would be ok too.

If the child or persons safety is at stake then I would be in favour of chipping.
Having had a mil with dementia who loved to go walkabout at all hours through the night it would have come in handy.
Our biggest fear was that she would walk off the end of the pier.

yes my nan of dad's side has one of those for a few years now, after she fell and lay on the ground for quite some hours before help finally arrived, and now she has that button and when she presses that help arrives a lot faster

So because im not directly affected I can't understand?
That's a cop out response, there's lots of things I don't have experience of it doesn't stop me having a considered opinion on chipping.

This is not something I'm willing to bicker with you about, it's far too close to home. You're entitled to your opinion but it's not something that I'm going to be entering into a back and forth over so I'll leave the thread.

Considering you said most have smart phones I don’t think you understand the meaning of a vulnerable child or adult.

Some have no road sense and would just walk out into the road let alone working a smart phone.

If the girl in question was not abducted it means she walking into the jungle wearing only underwear. So hence a smart phone would be no use.

Most people have mobiles. . That's all I was commenting on.
I still don't feel chipping vulnerable people is an answer.

If the girl in this thread had a chip she would have located dead or alive within a matter of hours..

If something can give those that need it a better chance in life it should be considered.

This is so awful. That poor, poor girl. RIP sweetheart. :sad:

Think about it... There's millions of vulnerable people, it's just not feasible, workable or ethical

People with dementia wear gps wrist trackers when in hospital. It's far too easy for them to go unnoticed and walk off of the wards otherwise, as someone that's been through the worry of my father being in that situation a few times I think the trackers in that case are a brilliant addition and would also be a huge help for families that have vulnerable children.

Chips under the skin though is too far imo.

Thats a great idea I'm all for that and those trackers could be fashioned into a peice of jewellery for teens. I'm sure I remember a few years ago backpacks coming out for kids with trackers in...

..Microchipping of humans would only work over short distances...I’m just reading up on it and it’s not something atm that would be developed enough to be able to consider in this context...there would also be factors like the terrain...it was very dense forest..and that would have meant the effectiveness of the chip would have been very limited, if effective at all...also that she was over 1 mile away from the resort...it is something to be given thought to though for families in care of vulnerable adults...thoughts of her being alive for around a week and dying of prolonged starvation and stress...:sad:...unbearable thought...

I think under the skin trackers are a thing for the future, also I think chips under the skin that contain medical information may be introduced in thisever changing world.

We are being constantly tracked now, look for something on the internet suddenly that item is popping up in your in box or on Facebook.

For those that think they are going about Un tracked if you have a smart phone your were abouts can be found if you receive or make calls in an area you will leave a Permanent marker that can me accessed.

The ethics of it are where my questions lie but that's where it gets very complicated. In general, I would be against tracking devices because of rights to privacy, autonomy, etc - and those things should be preserved as far as ossible for all individuals whether they have a disability or not - but when it comes to people who can't safely be unsupervised anyway is it maybe different? If there is literally NO circumstance where they could safely be outdoors without being accompanied, then those considerations become somewhat moot? It's a situation that applies to my daughter and may well apply for her entire life... She is at very real, immediate risk the second she steps out the door if she isn't with someone. There is no prospect of her being able to go off anywhere on her own (outside of the house) anyway. And so the autonomy aspects of "being tracked" just don't really come into play.

I'd never advocate forced tracking of the majority of teenagers for example because yes, whilst we might worry about them and they might go places we don't like, they are generally MOSTLY safe to have that freedom and autonomy. They can find their way home, they're aware of traffic and physical dangers... If they do get totally lost (in an area with people) they can ask for help, make a phone call, tell the police their name and where they live. When it's a vulnerable person who can't do any of those things I can't help but think it is just different.

In response to Ammi: I know the technology isn't quite there yet anyway but I've also read that there are currently various tech companies working on things like this.

The last lines of this post really hits home.

Listening to the results of the autopsy was distressing for me to hear.
For those who knew her and for her family this is beyond any kind of imagining the crushing devastation they must feel now.

Starving to death is horrible to the extreme.
To think a meal, water would have avoided this torture and excruciatingly pain filled loss.

It's awful, just thinking about it.
Horrible.

Another addition to this story

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...cid=spartandhp

...the cause of her death is known...but it’s now to try to put the pieces together of how she got to that place, when her family are stating they don’t feel she wandered off alone...and had severe mobility difficulties...still so may questions which have no answers...

Here is another,who knows what is true so many twists to this story.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...cid=spartandhp

I must admit I find it odd she wasn't found in the initial search, and barefoot over that terrain does seem strange, but then on the other hand she was sharing a bedroom so would she not have screamed if abducted and the abductor would have to be very stealthy, and they had only just arrived so it would have been very opportunistic, I just dont know what to think, I do think they should have UK postmorten to ease their concerns though

if the parents say that she was unable to get to that location by natural means, i believe them. Anyone that knows her intimately would know that too. It's not something they could make up

But as she was on Magical Holiday
and she knew the waterfall was near
so she became brave and left her room
via the window.
Sadly died near the water.

The Parents needed locked windows

Locked windows carry more of a risk Arista, I'd imagine it would be against fire safety regulations

https://extra.ie/2020/01/05/news/iri...-parents-suing

Nora’s parents have alleged that there were no CCTV cameras in the resort and that the windows in their room were not secure.
In legal documents, the Quoirins claim that Nora’s death and disappearance ‘were caused directly by the defendant’s negligence and/or recklessness both by way of act or conduct and omission’.
Nora Quoirin’s body was found in the Malaysian jungle 10 days after she initially vanished from the resort on August 4.

Sankara Nair, a lawyer for Nora’s parents Meabh and Sebastien Quoirin, said the family strongly believed Nora was abducted as she has mental and physical disabilities and could not have wandered off on her own.
The lawsuit says a cottage window was found ajar, with its latch broken, on the morning she disappeared.
The resort gate was left open at all times without any security and there was no surveillance camera except for the reception area, the legal papers said.
Nora had poor motor skills and needed help to walk, and her mental age was about five or six years old, her parents said in the claim.

The Problem
for the Parents is the
Case is Closed.
They can do no more

Nóra Quoirin: Site of Malaysian body find 'searched several times'...




A London schoolgirl who vanished from a Malaysian jungle resort may have been "alive and moving" during early searches for her, an inquest has heard.
The body of Nóra Quoirin, 15, was found after a huge hunt through dense rainforest last August.
A policeman told the hearing that the location where Nóra was eventually discovered had already been searched several times but nothing was found.
This suggested she was "not there" when search teams were, the court was told.
Nóra was first reported missing a day after she and her family arrived Dusan eco-resort near Seremban, about 40 miles (65 km) south of Kuala Lumpur, on 3 August.
Her body was found on 13 August by a group of civilian search volunteers in a hilly part of a palm-oil plantation about 1.5 miles from the holiday home.
'Not there'
At the inquest, deputy public prosecutor Muhamad Iskandar Ahmad asked Supt Mohamad Nor Marzukee Besar how many times had the police searched the exact location of the body find.
Mr Besar answered: "Three times. The fourth day, the fifth day, and the sixth day [of the search]."
Mr Ahmad asked Mr Besar what assumptions he could draw from this.
"We can assume that when the search team was in the area, the missing person was still alive and moving," Mr Besar said.
"So it is possible that when we were there, the missing person was not there."
According to Mr Besar, police last searched the area where Nóra was found on 9 August.


Mr Besar also told the inquest that police had performed a further search after Nóra's family told them she had last been seen wearing underwear.
He said that her body was found naked, and this raised the question of where her clothing had ended up.
Despite the extra search, Nóra's underwear was never found, the inquest heard.
Mr Besar also said police believed Nóra had left through an open window in the resort house where her family was staying.
Nóra's family have always insisted it was highly unlikely their daughter - who was born with holoprosencephaly, a disorder which affects brain development - would have wandered off alone.
Mr Besar said CCTV footage from Kuala Lumpur Airport, screened in the courtroom, had shown Nóra walking "normally".
Based on this, he said, police had assumed it was possible for her "to go towards the mountain".



Nóra's mother Meabh, 46, and father Sebastian, 48, are following the inquest via videolink due to the coronavirus pandemic.
They disagree with local police, who believe there was no foul play involved in their daughter's death, and have pushed for the inquest being held in the city of Seremban.
The inquest is scheduled to last until 18 September.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53919837


...so her underwear was the only clothing not found, is how I read it...