Originally Posted by Toy Soldier (Post 9686544)

It's an interesting concept and I would say certainly valid in cases where people find themselves getting genuinely "offended on behalf of" others, i.e. Really emotionally upset or angry about the issues being discussed. However, like I said I think it's possible to at least explore these issues and think about / empathise with others WITHOUT being emotionally involved. Surely it's possible to appreciate and want to support people who are upset by something, without getting upset at all oneself, or having it affect the rest of one's day in any way?

I would also say that if it is the case, and people's heavy emotional involvement with "offense" is in part down to projection, then surely that must apply both ways? There are people who get very emotionally wound up and certainly very angry on the flips idea of this, too... I guess in this case you could say "outraged on behalf of the festival organisers". It's sort of the same thing; the specifics of the case don't involve them in any way at all unless they are actually from that area or involved, and yet some people are incensed at the idea of it being "affected by PC" etc... So, might there be a similar element of projection there? People aren't actually annoyed by criticisms of the Zulu carnival, they might be projecting their own feelings of having their own expression shut down or invalidated, and be projecting it onto an event / event organisers that have nothing to do with them... Making it exactly the same "fighting for them for me" escape mechanism?

Originally Posted by jet (Post 9686806)

That's why I said SOME people, those who go to extremes...and I also said that people aren't THAT wired to others sufferings as much as they are to their own, not that they don't care at all.
It's human nature and called the survival instinct. How many would go to the extreme of dying for a stranger? Not many. How many would donate all their money and belongings to a cause and starve? Not many. No, their own well being is more important to them, right?

Also, people who have true empathy don't leave it behind when they get behind a computer screen. True empathy isn't reserved for certain groups, it should extent to all. A lot is revealed when people are anonymous, like unkindness and nastiness.
There is empathy and then there is over - zealousness and combativeness.

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 9686827)

I am happy to take 'the Zulus' or Mr Gumedes word for it yes, even though he initially wasn't of course why wouldn't I?



Of course I haven't ever suggested that Mr Gumede is offended on behalf of all Zulu... What a strange thing to insinuate.

Originally Posted by Brillopad (Post 9686810)

You are entitled - just don't try to force it on to me or anyone else who doesn't agree with you.

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier (Post 9686601)

Think his point was that you can't say **** (p-word) but you can say "chinky", showing that one has become a more commonly recognised racial slur.

Originally Posted by jet (Post 9686828)

Sorry, I haven't time to answer this in more depth...
Yes, that’s why I said ‘some people’ - those who take it to extremes and see racism and injustice around every corner. Most of us have a natural empathy for the sufferings of others, but also have a sense of balance and can work out when something is deliberately hurtful or intended to cause conflict and when it isn’t.
We all have a coping instinct in which what we say and do unconsciously ‘feeds’ our minds and emotions to hopefully get us the outcome we need to make us feel better.
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the more dangerous and unpleasant the world becomes as a whole, the more PC many people become.

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9686855)

I think they both are where I'm from.

It's probably that the mods haven't come to the point they need to censor the second as it hasn't come up to be used as a slur.

Originally Posted by Cherie (Post 9686833)

Yet you weren't happy for Livia to not be offended on her own behalf, you insinuated she was speaking for all Jews? you can't have it both ways

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 9687048)

Its so rare that you see Chinese people in general outwith a large city. I never see any anywhere

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9686837)

Where have I done that?

Simply posting my opinion in a thread asking for opinions is forcing you to go along with it?

You really need to get a grip.

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 9687043)

Was waiting for the PC term to raise it's head... Oh someone is agreeing with the offended minority when we want the have 'fun' in the name of 'tradition' we best trot out the tired old worn phrases to diminish their opinion.

We're not being intentionally offensive in our lionskin covered in skulls and horns, and if you're offended tuff.
The motto of the bonfire is they won't be 'druv' meaning (to me) however what we do is perceived let it be known we don't care we're doing it anyway.

Isn't that a sorry state of affairs that the more dangerous the world becomes it's seen as a bad thing to want to resolve it in a 'politically correct' way, what's the alternative... Anarchy?....War?.... Segregation?

Originally Posted by Brillopad (Post 9687061)

It’s not me that’s needs to get a grip. Calling people racist at every opportunity is trying to force your opinions on to others. You are saying that if they don’t agree with your views, think like you, see things your way etc not only are they ‘wrong’ they are ‘bad people’ and you are therefore entitled to call them nasty names. It’s pathetic.

Originally Posted by jet (Post 9687080)

I used the term PC as an observation, not a criticism. I'm fairly PC myself, just not overly so.
Of course people have the right to be offended, and people have the right not to be offended. Why is not accepted that people are all different?
War, Anarchy? No. I think more tolerance is the way to go. Trying to force people to all think alike is very dangerous indeed.

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 9687053)

Are you Livias official spokesperson now?...ok.

I haven't got it both ways...I never requested it both ways.

If you re read my post again you will see that I insinuated very strongly she did not speak for the entire Jewish community.

She was speaking for herself relaying a story in relation to a situation she found herself in that (for me at least) inferred that if there was no intent there was no offence to be taken...That of course is entirely subjective and relies on the circumstances surrounding to two scenarios.

The inference was that is she wasn't offended at that why was Mr Gumede offended at this, how else is her comment to be interpreted?

Originally Posted by Cherie (Post 9687220)

No why do you think that, I responded as it fitted with other points I addressed as you well know, didn't realise we had to keep within certain parameters, anything else you would like to dictate while you are at it?

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 9688216)

It didn't fit though...You completely misinterpreted my post by asking me to clarify a statement I didn't make, and somehow that's my fault :/

Originally Posted by lostalex (Post 9688610)

I remember when Kizzy first came to this place. She's still just as annoying. Hey kizz! nice to see ya!

she loves me too.

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 9687043)

Was waiting for the PC term to raise it's head... Oh someone is agreeing with the offended minority when we want the have 'fun' in the name of 'tradition' we best trot out the tired old worn phrases to diminish their opinion.

We're not being intentionally offensive in our lionskin covered in skulls and horns, and if you're offended tuff.
The motto of the bonfire is they won't be 'druv' meaning (to me) however what we do is perceived let it be known we don't care we're doing it anyway.

Isn't that a sorry state of affairs that the more dangerous the world becomes it's seen as a bad thing to want to resolve it in a 'politically correct' way, what's the alternative... Anarchy?....War?.... Segregation?

Originally Posted by Cherie (Post 9688263)

No I don't believe I did misinterpret your post, if deleted posts were still in evidence it would back that up :hehe:

Originally Posted by Brillopad (Post 9691270)

The irony there being that the left cause much of the anarchy with all their protest marches and attempts to control how others think - both of which often lead to violence. It's akin to baiting.

PC is by it's very definition is controlling - it is designed to be - to deny that is infantile. All these people wanting to see themselves as 'progressive' when I believe that really they fear that not just accepting everyone regardless of the issues involved will lead to the above ie war etc - one could argue that was simply a form of self-interest.

Segregation is very often something minorities do to themselves. Many come to Britain but do very little to integrate - not even to learn the basics such as language - there is never any excuse for that.

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 9691287)

I just went back and checked, there was around 8 posts deleted in this thread none of them were Kizzys though