There is only, and will only ever be two genders, male and female, that's reality. In fantasy, you can be whatever you want.

You're free to live your life in a World of fantasy if you wish, but when you start to believe fantasies are realities, and demanding people to also accept your fantasies as realities, then you're gonna get opposed.

But if I'm not a trans woman what else would I be?.....

Just a woman! There is nothing else :/

Nothing else? Nothing at all? Not even a guess?

Nothing like trying to debate a topic you're not very clued up on is there. :laugh:

I honestly do not see how this is relevant to any conversation anybody has had on this entire thread. Especially the conversation we was having there, so idk why you quoted me in that.

You do know sex and gender aren't the same thing?

Yeah, sex is the reality, gender is the fantasy.

Oh, he's creating his own discussion. :thumbs:

On a forum of all places, the very thought of it.

The sexes are male and female; male is split into men and transwomen, female is split into women and transmen.

Cis women are women too :fist:

Seriously though,I’ve never heard this word used in a real life conversation.

I’d bet it never gets used outside some ‘gender studies’ uni class and on the internet or TV shows that are trying to look all hip.

look at you mocking again...

You are an expert as a man obviously? Busy mansplaining how women should react on any given topic but specifically how women should react to being labeled, as we see here.

should kelly and I be stood together during your hypothetical discussion and she identifies as a trans woman and I as a woman, as opposed to a trans woman, does that not signal that I was in fact born a woman as opposed to a man?

No, because she is a woman and a transwoman
And you are a woman and a ciswoman

Kellys transfriend Jane may identify as woman, but if I wanted to talk about Kelly and Jane and not you, I would have to use the word trans, and if I wanted to talk about you and not Jane or Kelly, I would have to use the word cis. (Regarding its a discussion directly relating to genders as a group).

Its just a helpful little prefix that separates you from Jane should we need to use it.

What else do you expect when you come out with that?

Cherie already beat you to the misandry there.

I've not told anyone how to react. I'm explaining (that's EXplaining) where they're reacting to something they've completely misunderstood, not understood or don't get at all. I mean most people reacting negatively are actually saying "cis" is a "made up word" so, is it sexist of me to point out that is incorrect? Am I not allowed to point that out because I've got a penis?

But painting it as you being victimised by the big bad patriarchy and distracting the discussion to men telling women how to live is doing wonders for feminism. :thumbs: But you do you.

But if a man has transitioned to a woman or vice versa, then why does the word trans need to be used? surely they are now either just a man or a woman? The trans part doesn't need to be added, that was just the process of changing sex.

Nope, if someone transitions, they are a transwoman or transman. Respect their pronouns[*] and treat them right, but they're still biologically their birth sex and always will be.
[*]as long as those pronouns are he or she, not any of the ridiculous ones.

But, then people who were born as women don't like having the same identifier as someone who wasn't born that way and doesn't have the history and the "baggage" of it.

Basically, they're damned if they do and damned if they don't.

It doesn’t need to be added, I would sooner call Luke A a man than a transman, and I’d sooner call Luke S a man than a cisman.. and I think the majority of the country would too.

But sometimes situations will arise where people may need or want to talk about men who have transistioned from females and the word ‘man’ on its own would not be helpful in that scenario... and vice versa.

Exactly. Just the same as straight, gay and bisexual only come out when needing to differentiate. Otherwise, they're all just people.

Trans as you stated means you were previously something other.... A woman wasn't, ergo if you are not a trans woman you are simply a woman. there is no need for any prefix

Well if you read the bit you bolded properly, you’d see the flaw in that logic

Kellie Maloney is male,but a transwoman.
Kizzy is female, and a woman.

Wrong, but that is helpful, I was wondering why we were going around in circles.

Not quite, but I'd have to ask Kellie.

Has Kellie had a full transition? change of genitalia is what I mean and what ever hormone things they take?

The Kellie in Big Brother as far as I was concerned was just a cross-dresser.

She was pre-op in CBB. She transitioned after the show.