I wouldn't stand for that, Toy Soldier. He's done you up like a kipper there.

Not TS getting exposed for being a closet right-winger disguised as a "centrist"

:omgno:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/MOM_nE-k3qo/maxresdefault.jpg
The good Doctor is laughing

I just can't get ahead around you, of all people, chastising people for thinking that "any opposing views can't be valid" when you are literally the worst for that very thing on this forum and frankly one of the worst for it I've ever encountered. I take on all sorts of views on this forum; you brand anyone who doesn't hold the same views as you as either stupid, a bigot, or disingenuous. You're an aggressive zealot Dezzy and it's basically impossible for anyone to engage with in any meaningful way - and that's why no one really even tries at this point. I could try to engage with why I think race and gender are inherently different - because gender itself is a social construct, and one founded in oppression of women - but I know there's little if any point.

I don't make out that "both sides are beneath me" and I frequently take a side, I'm just willing to listen to moderate views on both. I'm not interested in dogma and extremism "on either side" because, yes, it's anti-intellectualism and a waste of everyone's time.

I've never once said your views aren't valid, I've never even said the same even to the likes of LT, whose opinions are basically whoever's videos he's watching at the time. You're confusing my opposition for me saying your views aren't valid and that's entirely on you. Kind of like how you're making out that I'm an extreme zealot for not buying into your own hype. Shall we talk about extremes, shall we?

The GCs very recently had a rally, lead by Posie Parker that saw nazis stand with them, doing nazi salutes for the cameras. To me, siding with nazis is extreme. If Nazis began to support something I believed in, I'd probably reconsider my position and truly assess if I was in the right, it's the shame the GC crowd are too extreme and radicalised to do the same.

But no, I'm the extreme one for not thinking the sun shines out your arse.

Who are the GCs?

Has Gemma Collins got her own political movement going?

See I am perfectly aware of that and have talked about the far right and religious evangelical hijacking of women's concerns in the gender ideology landscape. I've talked about it on here. Recently.

I just don't believe that seeing and accepting that right wing opportunists using the debate to their own ends - as they will with anythibg they can - automatically means that the inverse stance must automatically be 100% correct. Because that isn't rational, or anything even approaching rational. It's reactionary.

"if you're 21 and not a Liberal, then you don't have a heart. If you're 40 and not a Conservative, then you don't have a brain"

I think that was Winnie who sad that.

Maybe TS is going through a transitional period?

Gammon control?

Does that have pink hair?

Well he did take a break from the forum because he was becoming that way.

:joker:

Led by nosey Posie Parker

Do you expect a bunch of middle-aged women to forcibly remove a bunch of violent males from a public place? Just because the "GCs" had someone glomping onto their event, doesn't mean they support one another.

Because no demonstration ever has had others jumping on board to promote their own agendas....

Can you elaborate what GC stands for, I googled it but all I could get was Glasgow Coma....

Gender Critical, aka people (usually women) who think that gender is a social construct, and shouldn't trump biological sex when it comes to dictating sex-based rights.

Look up the event, you had GCs taking pictures with the nazis, and not all GCs are women. There's a deeply ironic photo of a male GC with their hands on a woman's throat in front of a sign that says something like 'let women speak', which doesn't apply to all women it seems....

There was also a heavy police presence so making out that the GCs were a bunch of 'helpless women' doesn't make your point stand up. Nazis showed up to support the GC agenda and the GCs didn't mind it until after the event when it went viral and it made them look bad rubbing shoulders with nazis.

Again, if nazis show up in support of your beliefs, that alone should be enough to maybe reconsider your views. It's not the first time that GC and Nazi ideology has overlapped and it won't be the last.

I googled it aswell , But i got something called 'Google classroom' instead .

Cheers Oliver

I've not been following Posie as closely as you, was this while she was in America?

so, adults in other words

Posie Parker has distinct Nazi vibes and happily flirts with the far-right, there's really no denying that. She's a liability.

Any mob gathering demonstration is going to be hijacked by extremists though - that's an inevitability... the double standard is rather interesting though... I vividly remember that when the BLM marches and demonstrations were used as a cover for mindless violence and looting, there was a clear understanding that those people were not a genuine part of the original demonstration, and were there for their own ends and thus it shouldn't take away from the genuine message of real BLM protesters. When "M.A.P" paedophiles corrupt and use the language of LGBT oppression to attempt to legitimise themselves, we must all understand that they are a fringe extreme and that most people don't agree with those abhorrent views. I agree with ALL of this, by the way.

And yet when the Nazis turn up to piggyback on women's genuine concerns, "everyone should reconsider what they're supporting"? No everyone should be aware of and call out the extremists who want to disingenuously hijack a movement for their own purposes.

There is literally no difference between saying "If nazis show up in support of your beliefs, that alone should be enough to maybe reconsider your views" and "If paedophiles show up in support of your beliefs, that alone should be enough to maybe reconsider your views". Which many people do - completely wrongly.

So no.

We should just accept that the Nazis and Paedophiles are opportunistic vultures and not representative.

I'm DEEPLY concerned about the way these things are being leveraged by the far right and the evangelists to pull more people over into their thinking. To the extent that at this point I genuinely think it's the larger concern (because as we know, those people do NOT actually give a stuff about the rights of women or children, and those will be out the window as soon as they've served their purpose).

To put it in simple terms; despite being accused of "my real feelings being clear" as to which side I come down on, take a look at the current SNP situation. I'm worried about who the future leader of scotland will be. I think we have terrible choices. But I would take Humza Yousaf (fully on board the identity politics train) over Kate Forbes (thinly-veiled evangelist nutjob) ANY day of the week.

I just wish there was a better set of options.

Hopefully Kate will win

Yeah? I've seen an odd livestream of hers, she certainly has a certain charisma, but I don't care enough about her specifically to seek her out beyond that.

In your opinion, is she enough of a liability to counteract the positives of shining a light on the women's issue?

On her own no, the overall weight of the alt-right and the bible thumpers unfortunately yes. Like I said, they'll drop women's rights like a cold bag of sick as soon as they've got what they need and flip it right back round.