Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589046)

My main thing that I'm not happy about with Chris's win is that he won for reasons that were away from genuine fan popularity or dancing quality, he won because of his disability which ruined the Show right from the start, as there were loads of the audience that were going to vote for him regardless of anything that he said or his performances.

And anyone that had a remote chance at gaining support as the numbers got lower were removed before they were given that chance.

Imo as Rose and Chris (and a myriad of other disabled contestants have shown over the years on Strictly) there needs to be one of three solutions offered to the table imo.

1. The BBC creates a spin-off dancing contest for disabled contestants, so they're all competing on an equal turf to each other, thus no advantages in the vote towards one disabled contestant amongst non-disabled contestants.

2. The judges and the public learn to treat the disabled contestants the same as every other contestant on the Show, something that after all of these years still hasn't been mastered by either group.

Or 3. If the first two can't be achieved then the disabled contestants need to be banned from taking part on the Show, because it is meant to be an equal competition for every contestant to have a shot at winning the Show, and it's been clear to see this year that it was certainly not equal for someone like Shayne or Wynne to compete with Chris in the public vote, regardless of how they came across or danced.

Originally Posted by The Grinch (Post 11589170)

The first one wouldn’t work. All disabilities are different. I mean the Paralympics has different levels and different leagues for disabled people such as sight, missing limps etc so that would just not work at all.


Chris was a great winner, not just for his disability but also his dancing wasn’t bad, he scored in the 30s, that’s great. It’s not like he was getting 18, 19 etc. I did want Sarah to win mind, however, I’m not angry he won at all

Originally Posted by AnnieKristmas (Post 11589202)

You say you're not taking anything away from him but you have suggested that disabled contestants should be banned from participating?? In a world where they are already highly disadvantaged and at times discriminated against, you want them further discriminated in case the public see just how much harder it is for them to attain a level that their able bodied counterparts do? WOW.

I get that you were pissed off Sam was eliminated probably before she should have been....but it's pretty low to suggest that not being able bodied means they shouldn't be allowed to take part

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 11589217)

Some people only vote for someone because they're pretty. Mock liked Sam who definitely wasn't the best dancer by any means. People like who they like. If you're looking for fair judging, maybe follow the national and world championships. If you want to see non-dancers go on a journey and improve every week, and one which us open to a public vote it's Strictly. Had the judges been called on alone to mark it, they'd have chosen Tasha, the beautiful girl with previous dance training which is unfair in itself.

I really am shocked at the response if some people to Chris's win... People I never would have expect to have reacted this way.

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 11589236)

You are very much entitled to your own view. I don't agree... However, I really don't agree with some of the comments Mock has made and I'm truly surprised at him. He is usually so nice and respects everyone. Not in this case though. Disability is strange, it could strike any one if us at any minute. I'd like to think people wouldn't want me to withdraw from the world if it happened to me.

Originally Posted by jet (Post 11589279)

How do you feel then about those who have had a lot/some/no dance training whatsoever competing in the same contest? Tasha had a LOT of dance experience, JB had quite a lot, I don’t know about Sarah but we know Chris had absolutely none. The participants on Strictly have never been competing on an ‘equal turf’.
Given that, do you think there should be different shows for those with dance training and those with none at all?

I’m in absolute awe at how he managed to dance without getting his feet entangled with Diane’s; his footwork and positioning were exceptional, as the judges pointed out and marked accordingly.
How Diane taught him all the different moves and how he carried them out so well is astounding. I just don’t know how they did it!
I’d agree with you if he was crap and getting low marks every week, but far from it.
A remarkable achievement and an absolutely worthy winner!

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589336)

I meant that I'm not taking the quality of dances that he achieved away from him, which were impressive for a blind person to achieve, I am not going to slam Chris just for the sake of it.

But I stand by my opinion that if the competition is going to keep being destroyed by a contingent of the fandom constantly trying to push disabled contestants towards the top 5 every single year nowadays, then yes there does need to be rules amended about their participation in the competition.

And I have warned Liam about this when he accused me of being "Misogynistic" about Ali during the last BB, I don't appreciate being accused of discriminating against contestants because I have certain issues with them on the program.

Sam has nothing to do with this as she was never going to win, my main issues would be with JB, Tasha, Montell, and Shayne if that were the case, considering they were all less popular than Sam with the public at the time.

My issue with disabled contestants on Strictly (not just Chris) is that they're guaranteed to get to the second half of the competition, just because they're disabled.

I mean when has disabled person ever gone in the first three rounds of voting?

Originally Posted by AnnieKristmas (Post 11589349)

You absolutely are discriminating against them by saying they should be banned though :shrug:

Can you imagine saying any other demographic should be banned?

It's an entertainment show....Chris entertained millions each week.

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589355)

I said it should be up for discussion if for whatever reason the spin-off idea is out of the question.

And if the Show can't treat them like actual Human Beings by treating them equally, then yes a ban would need to be up for consideration by that point

Because what would be your solution to the fact that the disabled contestants are guaranteed to be get past the first three rounds of the competition?

Originally Posted by AnnieKristmas (Post 11589357)

My solution is to leave it as it is. Those with disabilities have as much right on an entertainment show as anyone else. With the **** going on in the world, the last thing I'm going to get bent out of shape about is a famous person not getting through to the next round of what is, essentially, a vanity project because the British public recognised that it's pretty hard to dance with a disability and they might chuck a vote or two at someone facing adversity

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589356)

And what other group is getting treated with kiddie gloves every single year? Because I would have the discussion about them too.

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 11589365)

Being included is not "being treated with kiddie gloves".

Honestly Mock, I'm really surprised at your stance in this.

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589370)

I never said that him being included is him being treated with kiddie gloves?:conf:

My belief is that the judges were giving Chris bonus points because of his disability, which I personally do think is patronizing and is treating him with kiddie gloves.

That's just my opinion on the topic.

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 11589374)

I didn't see any unfair voting. His footwork was right, his frame was right, his timing was immaculate, he rarely went wrong... Kid gloves didn't come into it. But hey... Your opinion is your opinion and you're entitled to it. Even if it's wrong.

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589346)

The ringers don't have an advantage in the public vote, which is where my complaint lies.

Originally Posted by jet (Post 11589378)

I'm not getting what you mean here Mock. Could you exlpain further? :shrug:

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589377)

Chris by the final was being scored similar to the other three.

That is highly questionable imo.

Originally Posted by Santa Goth (Post 11589384)

The ringers tend to do poorly in the public votes on average, so if anything they're disadvantaged in the competition where it counts.

Originally Posted by jet (Post 11589389)

Why? What did you find wrong in his footwork, his positioning, the lifts, his frame? They were all excellent.

He obviously couldn't perform really tricky moves like some of the others did which are exciting and impressive to look at but don't add anything to the score board marks. :shrug:

Originally Posted by jet (Post 11589390)

Not usually a disadvantage ……These past winners all had a lot of or some previous dance experience.

Alesha Dixon
Kara Tointon
Tom Chambers
Abbey Clancy
Caroline Flack
Jay McGuiness
Kelvin Fletcher
Bill Bailey

I'm not sure if the average casual viewer even thinks about/knows who has previous dance experience and who hasn't, they likely just consider how well they are progressing from week 1 onwards and base their opinions on that.

Originally Posted by jet (Post 11589390)

Not usually a disadvantage ……These past winners all had a lot of or some previous dance experience.

Alesha Dixon
Kara Tointon
Tom Chambers
Abbey Clancy
Caroline Flack
Jay McGuiness
Kelvin Fletcher
Bill Bailey

I'm not sure if the average casual viewer even thinks about/knows who has previous dance experience and who hasn't, they likely just consider how well they are progressing from week 1 onwards and base their opinions on that.