Originally Posted by Lostie! (Post 9793429)

Pretty ridiculous that any vegetarian related topic on here has to descend into juvenile mud slinging

Originally Posted by Jessica. (Post 9793325)

Also, I worry for anyone who can't put a meal together without animal or something like quorn in it.

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9793430)

Aliens though. :hehe:

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9793311)

Not aliens. :laugh2:

If that was part of evolution then so be it.

But we're a bit different from pigs as a species. Obviously.

Originally Posted by ginkgo (Post 9793466)

Aliens are more plausible than god tho and many believe in god, so that simple though experiment shouldn't be so ridiculous

Originally Posted by ginkgo (Post 9793471)

If it's part of evolution then are wars fair enough because if you can dominate others, you should? Don't get how evolution means you have to dominate.
Pigs arent far off from small children.

Originally Posted by Jessica. (Post 9793325)

We're not better than other animals. They are helpless, they don't deserve what humans put them through. We can make choices that either contribute to these innocent creatures with brains and hearts being hurt or we can decide not to.

Also, I worry for anyone who can't put a meal together without animal or something like quorn in it.

Originally Posted by Jessica. (Post 9793235)

You might think it's natural to eat meat because you were raised on that idea, but not everything that's natural is the right way. Also, we are able to rationalise doing less harm and being less cruel. None can be 100% cruelty free in this day and age, but at least we can make a little bit of effort to do what we're able to. Right now, it's not convenient for me to stop eating animals, but I'm able to and that makes a difference to me and my conscience, as well as all of the animals I'm not going to eat. Am I wrong for this?

Originally Posted by Jamie89 (Post 9793606)

It's an interesting point, something being the normal way of doing things doesn't mean it's natural, if you think about wearing clothes for example I think most people would agree it's not because it's natural... I mean we call people who don't 'naturists' :laugh: yet how long have humans worn clothes for?
I think social norms probably play a big part in all of this actually, because where comparisons between us and other animals and the food chain etc (when it comes to whether or not meat eating is natural/instinctive) are concerned, it's ignoring that we're very different to most other animals in the extent to which we're effected by social conditioning, and I can only speak for myself but I'm pretty sure I don't feel instinctive urges to eat animals. If you think about the meat we eat and our urges towards it and how much we enjoy it etc we think of how it looks and tastes after cooking... not many of us would be happy eating raw animal flesh and it can also be dangerous for us to do so... we literally have to turn it into something unrecognisable for it to be appealing to us and for it to be safe, and that doesn't seem 'natural' to me? I think it's very possible that similar to the clothes example we may have started eating meat through necessity, and it developed into a social norm from there.
The more I think about it the more I think there's definitely an argument for vegetarianism as being more natural.

Originally Posted by Jamie89 (Post 9793606)

It's an interesting point, something being the normal way of doing things doesn't mean it's natural, if you think about wearing clothes for example I think most people would agree it's not because it's natural... I mean we call people who don't 'naturists' [emoji23] yet how long have humans worn clothes for?
I think social norms probably play a big part in all of this actually, because where comparisons between us and other animals and the food chain etc (when it comes to whether or not meat eating is natural/instinctive) are concerned, it's ignoring that we're very different to most other animals in the extent to which we're effected by social conditioning, and I can only speak for myself but I'm pretty sure I don't feel instinctive urges to eat animals. If you think about the meat we eat and our urges towards it and how much we enjoy it etc we think of how it looks and tastes after cooking... not many of us would be happy eating raw animal flesh and it can also be dangerous for us to do so... we literally have to turn it into something unrecognisable for it to be appealing to us and for it to be safe, and that doesn't seem 'natural' to me? I think it's very possible that similar to the clothes example we may have started eating meat through necessity, and it developed into a social norm from there.
The more I think about it the more I think there's definitely an argument for vegetarianism as being more natural.

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9793697)

And 90% of these other things Will, more often than not, come from an animal.

Originally Posted by caprimint (Post 9794533)

Well vegans survive :idc:

Originally Posted by y.winter (Post 9793822)

I do find it a nice thing the increase of pro-veg posts in this thread in comparison to previous discussions where people used to mock veganism, yet lose their mind on a "man kicks dog in the street and uploads it to facebook" threads.

It's always a good time to face the consequences of what we do, look it in the eye and ask ourselves if it's really necessary and if this is what we stand for. Watch a documentary, read facts, see pictures, don't just stand there so confident about how you would like to believe things are (and many people think they know, buy it would shock you how much you don't). At least face the reality you're funding. There are always ways to improve, I'm not saying that once you go vegan you're perfect, but it doesn't mean that you don't even try. I know I always try. It doesn't hurt.

You know, people make changes. Most vegetarians weren't born vegetarians, they just adjusted to it after being meat eaters (for me it was 4 years ago, at the "late" age of 22). It's not like you're either born to to being one or you're not. You eat meat, you stop - this is the whole drill.

Originally Posted by caprimint (Post 9794533)

Well vegans survive :idc:

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9794833)

It's not about whether you can survive. [emoji23]

It's about making choices to avoid harm to animals. Does it extend beyond meat eating to other foods, and across cosmetic products, medicines etc etc.

Originally Posted by Jessica. (Post 9794840)

That's what a vegan lifestyle is all about, it's not just about eating animal products, it's about not having any animal products in your life, like not wearing leather or using anything tested on animals or with animal ingredients or animal secretions like eggs or wearing wool etc..

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9794852)

*eyes your leather jacket*

You have some work to do missy.

Originally Posted by Jessica. (Post 9794868)

I am not vegan and I don't have a leather jacket.

Originally Posted by Marsh. (Post 9794833)

It's not about whether you can survive. [emoji23]

It's about making choices to avoid harm to animals. Does it extend beyond meat eating to other foods, and across cosmetic products, medicines etc etc.