I think it's been clear for a while now this conversation is not longer about Mickey Rouke.

I don't recall seeing those posts or responding positively to them. That's bad too...?

The conversation is about what we want it to be about and I am choosing to use Mickey as an example.


I didn't say anyone responded positively to them. I said they were not called out and those that said it were not called to be banned from the forum. I wasn't talking specifically about you.

I am disappointed though that you missed me saying, "You are 100% correct. It should be called out and challenged. And if it was said on CBB it of course would be. Robustly and at great length. It could easily be argued that the conversation coming from a person saying those things and the mass rejection of that as an idea is actually a really valuable teaching point that would reach way beyond the show itself."

Okay? :laugh: Well I'm done talking about Mickey so I am choosing to opt out of this conversation.

Okay.

OK, let's not talk about CBB on a forum about CBB. Makes sense. :shrug:

I feel that you are using that as an excuse to swerve the points actually being made, but you do you ofc.

I do 100% agree with you on this actually.

Because that kind of language is definitely inciting the weirdos in our society to act out their violent urges against a community that they don't like.

Basically I am with you on incitement.

That's awful.

I honestly can't believe that it has happened in Bournemouth too, I thought that they were a fairly liberal area.

:) It's also important to remember that it's not necessary to literally call for action to embolden people to take physical measures.

All humans need is the idea something is a threat to them, their loved ones, their way of life, and many will act accordingly. And LGBT have been framed as a threat throughout their existence.

- We've been framed as a threat to traditional family values (so did not have the same legal rights within relationships)

- We've been framed as a threat to public health (so could not give blood up until 2021 if we were sexually active - to the point where myself, in a 12-year monogamous relationship could not give blood but my friend who was straight and sleeping with a new girl every weekend could)

- We've been framed as a threat to the sanctity of marriage.

- We've been framed as a threat to children. (Lawrence Fox recently stated that the plus in LGBT+ was a symbol for pedophiles. It wasn't a direct call for action, but it was definitely posing LGBT people as a threat to peoples children.)

People don't need anyone to say "gays are gross, get 'em" they just need to imply gays are a threat, unfounded and without evidence or data. That's enough. Which is why not challenging or persecuting certain levels of hate speech is so dangerous.

I'm not talking about Mickey's 'I'm voting off the lesbian' or jokes made my comedians on stage. Context and intent matter hugely and no, nobody is going to watch Big Brother and see Mickey call JoJo a fag and then go and punch a lesbian, but there is a need for a certain level of 'freedom' allowed before people are reprimanded for what they say. It's the same with everything in society.

Fair points tbf, and I can agree with most of it.

And just to go to Lawrence Fox for a minute, how anybody agrees with anything that this dude says is probably the biggest mystery in Politics at the moment.

The guy makes Trump and Andrew Tate seem reasonable imo, and that takes some doing.