Cecil the Lion and a dead Sudanese Migrant?
 

Do you feel more remorse for the elongated death of Cecil the Lion than you do for the dead migrant in Calais?

if so why and so you feel any guilt about this?



http://cbsnews2.cbsistatic.com/hub/i...stapelkamp.jpg

I don't feel remorse for any of it as I had nothing to do with it.
Both situations are sad, however, Cecil had no choice in the situation, the migrant did.:shrug:

Cecil in a heartbeat as he was not aware of the cruelty of man,the migrant took his chances and lost but was fully aware of what could happen.

I personally am not going to lose any sleep over either of them, but I expect most people will feel worse for Mr Lion, because we live in a society that personifies animals and dehumanises foreigners. Especially poor ones.

Do you think a human life is more important than an animal one?

Depends what human,some yes definitely animals are more important.

Depends on the human, but in the absence of other evidence, yes.

cecil was hunted - the immigrants are desperate and so unhappy with there lifes they risk losing there life to try and create a better one.

as you see 2 different arguments.

Yeah, everyone anthropomorphises animals and dehumanises foreigners. Except you... right TS? You're just here to point out the error of our ways.

I don't have sympathy for the migrants in Calais because, as I've said, like, a squillion times, they crossed so many safe countries to get to Calais because they've heard about our benefits free-for-all. If you think they crossed those safe countries to try to come here for any other reason, you're dreaming.

Some of the wildlife in Africa has been almost wiped out by people who regard themselves as human - the dickless moron who shot the lion, for instance. I wouldn't want to anthropomorphise animals because humans generally, while being higher up the evolutionary chain, scrape the bottom when it comes to evil.

"most people" =/= "everyone" Livia. I'm starting to think you've been out of education for too long, might be worth a refresher course of some sort? Rusty Rusty creaky creak.

And you're right, clearly Cecil hasn't been anthropomorphed. Cecil. Cecil, Livia. Cecil the Lion has not been given any human qualities for the sake of endearment at all. Cecil.

... Anyway, Lions (and all cats) actually have a quite strong tendency to "play with" and torture their kills until they get bored and eat it. They specifically keep it alive, for fun. Most creatures are pretty evil :shrug:.

Your jibes at my education and intelligence genuinely make me laugh.

Calling something by a name does not equate to anthropomorphisation. My car had a name. Do I think I saw any human qualities in it? No I did not. Mountains have names. Lakes have names. Oceans have names. Countries have names...

There aren't that many animals in the world that kill for fun with no intention of eating their prey and by far the sickest of them all is the human race.

I don't mean any offence but I don't feel any remorse for either, I didn't know the lion up until the news broke and and loads of migrants die? I don't know either personally, I try not to get too attached to the news. I know people will have altering opinions, but this is just my view.

Yeah, sad things happen, but I don't know the people/animals personally, I feel sad for a second but move on with my day...

I may sound stupid saying that, but honestly, people die everyday. Bad things happen in the news everyday, it's just life surely? idk.

its nice to have compassion for others.

I'm sure they're transcendent or something. I was only worried because you read - even quoted - one phrase ("most people") and misinterpreted it as another ("everyone"). However, given your supreme intellect and the wealth of letters both before and after your name, I can only assume that you were being disingenuous rather than simply stupid.

They do indeed. None of them are "Cecil" or anything approaching Cecil. Cecil. Cecil, the Lion. Errhhhhhh.

There are plenty of animals that do actually, though it could be argued that they do so instinctually as a form of practice. Then again, along the same lines you could argue that humans are instinctually driven to do the same, as we are after all omnivorous animals when you strip it right back.

I'm not going to disagree that humans can be the most capable of cruelty and depravity of any animal. Like I also said, "it depends on the human", there are plenty of human lives I'd gladly see traded for poor noble Cecil's. Serial killers, Child abusers, Iain Duncan Smith, etc... However, there is absolutely no evidence at all that this unfortunate, faceless, NAMELESS immigrant at Calais was any of those things, or anything more than a desperate person hopelessly seeking a better life. So yeah. It's worse than a lion.

I don't understand why people care so much about this. Humans are ****ing weird.

Preach!

I can see some similarities in hunted animals and refugees, both are killed as trophies for some, as beasts to be controlled or eradicated by others.

The migrant is Illegal

Me and Cecil pay no heed to your petty Human laws.

Yes around 50,000 humans die each day and around 20,000 are children

How did you feel when 7/7 happened?

Is 7/7 highlighted because it happened in Britain? When refugees are regarded as cockroaches I think it's safe to say that many can easily distance themselves emotionally from issues facing those overseas.

When refugees are regarded as cockroaches

Perhaps you would care to elaborate here and say who regards them as such?

Katie Hopkins for one, I'm sure she's not alone however.

Sad for the people, but then I moved on. I hate to sound heartless or anything, but bad things like ISIS are happening all of the time, it would be stupid to let any of it get to you, in my opinion, when you have so much going on within your own life to stress about, The people who know someone who has been hurt/was part of any of these big news events will of course feel something a lot more intense, as would I. But I can't say I was left sad for days, it's more of a case of reading a sad news story and feeling sad for a second before moving onto the next story.

Idk how this is coming across but I'm not heartless or s/t, I'm just used to it now? idk.

I'd say it was healthy, you were empathic and then continued with your day.. dwelling on situations beyond your control wouldn't do much good for your mental health.

You know, you could have had a wealth of letters after your name too. It's not my fault you haven't.

1) You said "we live in a society that personifies animals and dehumanises foreigners". You didn't refer to "part" of that society, you referred to society itself.

2) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cecil_Lake

3) Still waiting for someone to tell me regarding these unfortunate faceless (not nameless, they all have names) tide of immigrants at Calais... how many "safe" countries did they pass through to get to Calais and why do they want to come here?

i honestly don't care about either. but maybe i'm desensitized from watching too many hollywood movies, and listening to too much popular music, and playing too many video games.

I'm not jealous of you Livia? Are you bragging? I'm not sure what you think is going on here, but it wasn't me getting uppity about someone "questioning my intelligence". I'm quite secure without the letters, frankly.

That would surely suggest "society at large", a majority (or, "most"?) or the general status quo. Again it in no way infers that I think anything at all about "everyone" or being unique in my thinking. There are people on this tiny forum who roughly share many of my opinions so I would assume that there might be a few more globally :shrug:.

Touche... That's an even worse name for a lake than it is for a lion, though.

If they all have names then why are they rarely if ever named by the press? You can argue "names unknown" but, being realistic, let's not pretend that the journalists (or the readers) have made or are even vaguely interested in making any attempt to find out those names.

I'm also not sure why them having passed through other safe countries to come here is relevant, in any way, to whether or not they deserve to die.

I think you also want the answer to be "benefits" but that is in fact not the answer at all, it's much more commonly because Britain has an absolutely thriving off-the-books shadow economy where these people can find work (often for less than half of minimum wage) and can stay off the radar. A shadow economy that is growing rapidly thanks to Tory cuts, actually.

TS, I don't think you're jealous of me. It's just that at every opportunity you refer to my education so please, don't infer that I started this. I never refer to your education and only did today because your first comment said maybe I've been out of education too long and I'm creaky and rusty. You do it a lot... and I'm bored with it.

Now we're down to arguing semantics. I've said my piece on this. We disagree. Full stop.

That was a jibe about your age, not your education. All this arguing over a simple misunderstanding!

I am a 21 year old.


With 14 years more experience.

Not for any particular reason but I was more upset at the news of the lion being killed. Possibly because I found it more shocking that a man would pay a lot of money to kill a creature, or because it was a purposeful death whereas the migrant dying was an accident (I think anyway)

I guess those are good points really, at least Robert the Migrant (I have named him. His name was Robert Paulson.) wasn't hunted so there is a difference fundamentally there.

And the fact that this guy paid a five figure sum to kill a lion is completely obscene. An amount that an entire family could live on comfortably for a year in the UK and for a hell of a lot longer in Africa. That's a whole different thread about the effects of capitalism, consumerism and decadence though.

I think we should start hunting dentists

vile overcharging money grabbings bastards

the whole lot of em

If my maths is right, you're a good decade younger than I thought :joker:

:clap1::clap1:

I think the loss of a human life is worse

worse why?

Because I am a human and human life is more important to me, not in 100% of cases but in general

As a human should we not realise that all life is equal and that no hierarchy exists

all life is in fact worthless and a result of time, chemicals, minerals and gravity