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Originally Posted by ransom
So to you, a woman draping themselves naked over you, whispering all sorts of things into your ear, is not leading someone on? Seriously? I mean, seriously? Don't forget she never said no to Mike at all, she only wanted nothing from him after she'd gotten cozy with Lorenzo and it had clicked he was actually a very wealthy man.
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Right for one if we are going to have this conversation dont mix my extreme example up with real facts then apply them in some twisted way to what happened.
I was using the naked thing as an example. Ultimately if I had a female friend, who told me NOTHING was ever going to happen cause she had a boyfriend (Which she did indeed tell Mike repeatedly) even if she paraded around nude in front of me or cuddled me, or whatever I have been told NO so that means NO.
If I then chose to ignore those words and assume she wanted me anyway thats because my male ego cant accept she doesn't want me. Its cause I would be tricking myself into believing I had a chance despite being told otherwise. Its assuming that the things women say are somehow coded or designed to confuse us as men... THIS IS THE EXACT same thinking that leads to the inherent sexism in society and also to so many cases of date/friend rape, which are actually far more common than stranger rape. You mention they are only committed by dregs of society, you'd be surprised how many 'normal' men with good jobs, no criminal records rape friends or work colleagues cause of this sick 'mixed signals' bulls**t excuse, and often get away with it. No sorry rape is sadly much more commonplace than you think it is. And its usually people who you'd least expect who do it.
As for the last bit its again assumptions which are skirting around the issue I was bringing and largely irrelevent. However Id contest that she was probably clever enough on Day 1 Minute 1 to realise a man called PRINCE lorenzo was quite wealthy, and secondly she did indeed tell Mike many times she had a boyfriend, was happy and nothing would happen, what show where you watching?
She liked Lorenzo (he got it spot on) cause he acts like an adult/mature man who can be friends with a girl, even one hes attracted to and not expect anything else or get hurt or act like a whiny bitch when she doesn't deliver what he wants. Hes a grown up basically where as Mike, Harv and Ash are like bloody teenagers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ransom
They are not in any way similar. One is a crime, a very serious one. A crime that is only carried out by the most horrible dregs of our society. The other is a play made by an incredibly good looking woman to a wealthy man (something she has plenty of previous for) and he committed no crime. Did nothing wrong. She said no (after starting up the showmance with Lorenzo) and he did nothing. He was gutted but nothing more. They are not similar in any way, and it is not a similar thought process for any decent human being. Maybe for the scum who actually commit these crimes.
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What are you going on about?? Forget the actual house for a moment, do you even understand what Im getting at? Im not comparing the two situations like for like, im saying the underlying opinions and emotions that drive the two situations are inherently linked... namely
1) That women trick and use men
2) That men are innocents or at worst fools who cant control their emotions
3) That women who are flirtatious or highly sexual somehow must be 'leading men on'
4) That men dealing with the above somehow have their behaviour and reactions excused because they are 'hurt' or feel cheated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ransom
She does lead men on. Simple as that. She takes advantage of the stupidity, and in some cases, loneliness, of men to get what she wants. She's very bloody good at it too. She's well equipped for it physically and mentally. There are men out there who do it to women too. It's not some anomaly that is only present in women.
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Im well aware of this. I dont think its fair to say takes advantage. Thats like saying dating sites 'take advantage' of loneliness to earn money, I could make 100s of other similar examples. She provides a service for lonely men who want to chat to a good looking woman and maybe for a short time feel connected to someone. If you think thats taking advantage then you must judge 100s of other jobs and careers as equally odious?
If she promised sex, or physical meetings then never delivered that would be taking advantage. As it is all the men involved know they will never even meet her let alone go on a date with her.
If some of those men stupidly believe otherwise thats THEIR fault not hers. She just provides a service. Just like people who model for NUTS do, or dancers, or strippers, or barmwomen who flirt with customers to sell more beer, or those girls with shot glasses who lure stupid kids into bars by wearing very little.
I dont particularly agree with her career choice, and indeed its a shame as shes pretty smart and could alot more, but its not immoral. Mike wasn't 'led on' indeed hes barely mentioned her since she left... odd that considering how besotted with her he professed to be.
Anyone who sees Mike as some victim is a mug, hes a reality show star whos had PR/Media training, he knows the score, he knew him being a poor victim in a love triangle would get him to the final.
Funny how only he saw it as a love triangle, Prince and Danica maintain there was no such thing. Prince knew it was ridiculous to even call it that, and it was.