[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Perhaps we could alter this scenario. Scotland, like eastern Ukraine has its own distinctive culture and outlook within the UK. Those for independence argue that London is distant to them, it does not represent or care for them and has no interest for Scottish needs. That is how the rebels feel about Kiev. How about instead of devolving powers to Scotland as Westminster has, and instead of promising further powers to keep them within the Union, the Tory government instead said: nah, we're the government and you have to accept it, you are not allowed any autonomy or control over your own issues, all power resides with us. Would the Scots accept that the way the eastern Ukrainian rebels are supposed to? We could even take this further and imagine that there was a Prime Minister who was sympathetic to Scottish devolutionists and sought to promote their interests, he was democratically elected and yet suddenly violent protests erupt in London, the Prime Minister has to flee, in comes a government completely opposed to Scottish interests and suddenly starts clamping down on their autonomy. Would that be accepted?

My issue with your argument is that you don't seem to have any recognition for the genuine grievances and aims of eastern Ukrainians. Most of them don't want the country to break up but they are very unhappy and disillusioned with the conduct of the Kiev regime which exercises so much centralised power. That article you linked says it all where it dismisses the rebels as "bandits and terrorists". That is the same tactic used by every government in history to try and de-legitimise opposition movements. This is not simply Ukraine vs Russia, the rebels are not merely Russians in disguise, all anti-Kiev government is not controlled from the barrel of a gun. Simplify the conflict into binaries and there never will be a satisfactory agreement. The more it is seen as Russia vs Ukraine, or Russia vs the West, and the more it is seen as a new 'cold war' the worse the situation is going to get.

We have been known to disagree, but I cannot fault one point made in this. And brilliantly written.