Quote:
Originally Posted by MTVN
I don't know, I think that view is more a product of recent history and the surge for Scottish independence. It doesn't make sense to see the Empire as an 'English' phenomenon because a lot of the most enthusiastic Empire builders were Scots and the whole thing permeated through Scotland just as much as it did England.
I don't really think that patriotism differs that much across different countries, some might think they have better reason to feel 'pride' in their country than others but its still essentially the same phenomenon.
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Having lived here for a bit longer than the "recent surge for independence", I can confirm that you are wrong. The empire was indeed a product of Scotland as much as England but that's not relevant as the empire is over; meaning that we now "pick and choose" (loosely, obviously we're talking about sweeping social choice here not conscious individual choice) which parts of culture and history form the overall basis of national identity.
England, whilst it does have a lot of REGIONAL culture and many strong - but notably, distinct - regional identities... It really has no overall unifying sense of national identity OTHER than empire.
It would probably be more accurate to say that there really isn't any strongly defined sense of English culture or English patriotism. Essentially, there is British culture, Scottish/Welsh/Northern Irish culture, and then a whole array of various regional English identities ("Londoner", "Yorkshireman", "Geordie" etc) and when English people talk about patriotism, what they really are referring to is British patriotism rather than English patriotism, whilst in Scotland, there are plenty of both Scottish patriots AND British patriots but they do not mean the same thing... And it is British patriotism that is rooted in Empire / Global strength.
Really this is reflective of the overall perception of Britain / British, though. For example, when filling in a form, English people are much more likely to use the terms "English" and "British" interchangeably whereas "Scottish" and "British" and certainly "Irish" and "British", are more distinct descriptions.