[arista]

http://news.sky.com/story/1384714/os...rrowing-target


From 12:30PM today



[Chancellor to deliver last Autumn Statement before the general election
Boasts that the economy and employment are rising faster than expected
But borrowing is still stubbornly high with the Treasury raising less in tax
Osborne to promise billions for roads, housing and flood defences
Review of business rates and banks told to lend more to small firms
Air passenger duty for under-12s scrapped, cutting cost of family holidays]


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz3KpQ8EZQE

[joeysteele]

For me, whatever he says today as to positive things,I will look on with suspicion.

From his whole time as Chancellor apart from the last one, he has had to downgrade and alter negatively near all he has said in previous budgets and Autumn statements.
I can see that probably happening again after the election in 2015,were he to still be Chancellor

This seemingly more positive one comes only 22 weeks before a general election, I have my suspicions that after the election, come another budget, there will be the doom and gloom scenario back.
This Chancellor has failed on almost all fronts, as to the deficit reduction, as to losing the growth in place when he took over, for the loss of the recovery that was evident when he took over and he and this govt, have presided over near chaos as to the NHS,not lifting a finger to support it until this very late stage.

I would generally take the view better late than never, however after witnessing the unfairness, heartlessness,arrogance,incompetence and constant failure of this govt to reach any of its targets,my view is solidly enough is enough and I for one, hope this is the last Autumn statement and also any form of budget statement from this failure of a Chancellor and indeed from this present govt.

[arista]

[For me, whatever he says today as to positive things,I will look on with suspicion.]

Yes Joey
fair enough

[arista]

Osborne Announces Historic Stamp Duty Reform

http://news.sky.com/story/1385011/os...mp-duty-reform

[The Chancellor said he was abolishing
the "slab rate" of stamp duty - which means huge increases
in tax when house values enter a new band.
In future, he said, the tax would apply progressively
to the part of the property in each band, like income tax.
The new rates will see house-buyers pay 0% on the first
£125,000 then 2% on the portion up to £250,000, 5% up
to £925,000, 10% up to £1.5m and 12% on anything above that.]



[An extra £2billion-a-year to the 'frontline of the National Health Service'
4,000 jobless EU migrants deported if they have no prospect of work
'Teletubbie tax break' to encourage more children's TV to be made in UK]

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz3KqLBfz2a


Link for Kizzy
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...ercent-deficit

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by arista

Osborne Announces Historic Stamp Duty Reform

http://news.sky.com/story/1385011/os...mp-duty-reform

[The Chancellor said he was abolishing
the "slab rate" of stamp duty - which means huge increases
in tax when house values enter a new band.
In future, he said, the tax would apply progressively
to the part of the property in each band, like income tax.
The new rates will see house-buyers pay 0% on the first
£125,000 then 2% on the portion up to £250,000, 5% up
to £925,000, 10% up to £1.5m and 12% on anything above that.]



[An extra £2billion-a-year to the 'frontline of the National Health Service'
4,000 jobless EU migrants deported if they have no prospect of work
'Teletubbie tax break' to encourage more children's TV to be made in UK]

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz3KqLBfz2a


Link for Kizzy
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...ercent-deficit

So he is in effect doubling the stamp duty for the majority of House buyers buying anything much more than a little flat, unless of course you live in a rather cheap area. Big help then.
Better than a mansion tax though I suppose.



Aaaaargh, I might have jumped the gun. About as clear as mud.
So now you only pay 2% on the second half of £250 grand..as against 1% on all of it.
Figure fiddling I believe.

[arista]

Its Great News for First Time Buyers


Even Labour back that

[Kizzy]

£56,000 on houses over 2 million though... who's going to tell Myleen?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by arista

[For me, whatever he says today as to positive things,I will look on with suspicion.]

Yes Joey
fair enough

You have to give people the chance though,to prove what they say,and deliver,if they don't ,fair enough,ditch them next time,seems to me we are going upwards at the moment,hope we don't get a great big fall at the election.I can see that happening.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

You have to give people the chance though,to prove what they say,and deliver,if they don't ,fair enough,ditch them next time,seems to me we are going upwards at the moment,hope we don't get a great big fall at the election.I can see that happening.

I would agree with that and in fact that is what I did myself in 2010. Although it was Lib Dem I voted, it is a Conservative led coalition we have and when I first came on here I was a supporter of the coalition and its targets and policies in the main.
Although I feared the detail,especially to the NHS and as to secure protection for those who are the most vulnerable.

I moderately supported the coalitions aim of clearing the deficit in 5 years,of ensuring the recovery in place when they took power stayed in place and that growth was strengthened year on year.

Then it all went haywire,they never achieved their targets, they lost the recovery that was in place when they took over, they lost all the growth too and for 3 years we bounced along on a flatline growth figure.
Inflation rose and outstripped earnings leaving the vast majority worse off, and they still are despite green shoots starting to show again as to the economy.
The deficit it is at best cut by one third rather than cleared altogether and for me all that constitutes massive failure on the Chancellor's and this coalition govts. part.

The unbelievable scenario of them now coming to the voters in 2015, asking for virtually the same time to do the same things, make more cuts and then clear this deficit,they said would be gone now.
That fills me with massive doubt they are on the right path in any way at all.

I am also suspicious of these so called better times really only appearing a few months before the general election is due.
Yet with still more severe cuts to services and likely against the most vulnerable again too still to come in the next 3 to 5 years were this lot to win in 2015.

Not all he said in this Autumn statement is bad and it shows he can do some things right,however I believe as to the NHS,this is a one off,it will be further run down if these win again and for me I will never trust either of these parties with it now.

As has been the case for the first 3 years of this govt, all they have said as to positive things as to the economy have not happened,they have missed target after target and I really feel it is more likely than not,that after the 2015 election if these won it.
We would then hear soon after, more downgrading of the state of the economy and targets regularly missed again.
As has been the case near all through this govts.time in power, with missed targets after near every budget and Autumn statements.

That for me, is failure on a grand scale, no more chances from me. They have had the last 5 years to prove they can and will do what they say and in fact we are only marginally better then we were in 2010 as to the economy.
However for multi millions of people, in work and out of work they are far worse off than in 2010 due to the cost of living being allowed to go higher for far too long.

None of that reads success for me and so I hope they are gone in 2015.
I can only see massive under investment in the NHS under this govt after 2015 then also with the eurozone having difficulties again.
I can also see this govt after 2015 blaming that for even more severe austerity cuts and a further attack on the most vulnerable,in work and out of work too.
With downgraded and revised targets again being rolled out in budgets and Autumn statements as has been the case for at least 3 years or more of this whole govts time in power.

The Conservatives hinged their cuts and economic policies firmly to the argument they made in 2010 that the sign of success was that the deficit had to be cleared by 2015,otherwise that would be disaster for the UK.
It is why they set out the severe cuts in the first year too rather than plan them better from the 2nd year in power.

They called Labour unambitious and reckless to plan to only half the deficit over 4 years making 20% less cuts and no cuts in the first year of office.
That to me, now actually sounded the better and fairer way to go on the economy and the deficit.

I say and feel that now because all we have had from this coalition govt. on all those fronts are injustice, arrogant and dismissive heartlessness and total failure across the board.

[Kizzy]

Well put joey, it's back to lies and manipulation of figures to make it appear by careful moulding of figures we are doing well.
the NHS need billions? well lets sell off some and cut services and voila they can say they've pledged to help.
In employment jobs are advertised in other countries on 0hr contracts, apprenticeships keep young people trapped on £2ph , workfare has zero chance of getting anyone a job as employers have an endless supply of free labour so why employ anyone?

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I would agree with that and in fact that is what I did myself in 2010. Although it was Lib Dem I voted, it is a Conservative led coalition we have and when I first came on here I was a supporter of the coalition and its targets and policies in the main.
Although I feared the detail,especially to the NHS and as to secure protection for those who are the most vulnerable.

I moderately supported the coalitions aim of clearing the deficit in 5 years,of ensuring the recovery in place when they took power stayed in place and that growth was strengthened year on year.

Then it all went haywire,they never achieved their targets, they lost the recovery that was in place when they took over, they lost all the growth too and for 3 years we bounced along on a flatline growth figure.
Inflation rose and outstripped earnings leaving the vast majority worse off, and they still are despite green shoots starting to show again as to the economy.
The defiit it is at best cut by one thrid rather than cleared altogether and for me all that constitutes massive failure on the Chancellor's and this coalition govts. part.

The unbelievable scenario of them now coming to the voters in 2015, asking for virtually the same time to do the same things, make more cuts and then clear this deficit,they said would be gone now.
That fills me with massive doubt they are on the right path in any way at all.

I am also suspicious of these so called better times really only appearing a few months before the general elction is due.
Yet with still more severe cuts to services and likely against the most vulnerable again too still to come in the next 3 to 5 years were this lot to win in 2015.

Not all he said in this Autumn statement is bad and it shows he can do some things right,however I believe as to the NHS,this is a one off,it will be further run down if these win again and for me I will never trust either of these parties with it now.

As has been the case for the first 3 years of this govt, all they have said as to positive things as to the economy have not happened,they have missed target after target and I really feel it is more likely than not,that after the 2015 election if these won it.
We would then hear soon after, more downgrading of the state of the economy and targets regularly missed again.
As has been the case near all through this govts.time in power, with missed targets after near every budget and Autumn statements.

That for me, is failure on a grand scale, no more chances from me. They have had the last 5 years to prove they can and will do what they say and in fact we are only marginally better then we were in 2010 as to the economy.
However for multi millions of people, in work and out of work they are far worse off than in 2010 due to the cost of living being allowed to go higher for far too long.

None of that reads success for me and so I hope they are gone in 2015.
I can only see massive under investment in the NHS under this govt after 2015 then also with the eurozone having difficulties again.
I can see this govt after 2015 blaming that for even more severe austerity cuts and a further attack on the most vulnerable,in work and out of work too.
With downgraded and revised targets again being rolled out in budgets and Autumn statements as has been the case for at least 3 years or more of this whole govts time in power.

The Conservatives hinged their cuts and economic polices firmly to the argument they made in 2010 that the sign of success was that the deficit had to be cleared by 2015,otherwise that would be disaster for the UK.
It is why they set out the severe cuts in the first year too rather than plan them better from the 2nd year in power.

They called Labour unambitious and reckless to plan to only half the deficit over 4 years making 20% less cuts and no cuts in the first year of office.
That to me, now actually sounded the better and fairer way to go on the economy and the deficit.

I say and feel that that now because all we have had from this coalition govt. on all those fronts are injustice, arrogant and dismissive heartlessness and total failure across the board.

Good post Joey...........I agree that the Conservatives have failed with or without the Lib Dems, failure is failure.

The promises they made, they have not come even close to keeping and as you pointed out the deficits are still there and growing the Public borrowing requirements are growing and to make matters worse the cost of living especially in things like Utilities are rising so most people feel worse off.

The growth I fear is in the casual and zero hours labour markets so this will not be sustained and will not result in any permamnent jobs where the Tax take could be used to help fund the NHS and the welfare state.

Rather the contrary is true, this Cons coalition Govt is now threatening to make SERIOUS cuts in spending so much so that the overall Govt spending across all Govt Depts will take this Country back to Pre War levels which I fear will signal the end of the NHS in it's present form.

I think the Tories are planning to make people take on massive amounts of debt incl Mortgage debt in an effort to breath life into the economy, but this I fear will only lead to another housing bubble then crash.

It is a mess, I fear as a country we are broke and no economic model is working, we are but one small step away from sharing the same fate as the rest of the Eurozone.

what's the answer ? I wish I knew..........





.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

Good post Joey...........I agree that the Conservatives have failed with or without the Lib Dems, failure is failure.

The promises they made, they have not come even close to keeping and as you pointed out the deficits are still there and growing the Public borrowing requirements are growing and to make matters worse the cost of living especially in things like Utilities are rising so most people feel worse off.

The growth I fear is in the casual and zero hours labour markets so this will not be sustained and will not result in any permamnent jobs where the Tax take could be used to help fund the NHS and the welfare state.

Rather the contrary is true, this Cons coalition Govt is now threatening to make SERIOUS cuts in spending so much so that the overall Govt spending across all Govt Depts will take this Country back to Pre War levels which I fear will signal the end of the NHS in it's present form.

I think the Tories are planning to make people take on massive amounts of debt incl Mortgage debt in an effort to breath life into the economy, but this I fear will only lead to another housing bubble then crash.

It is a mess, I fear as a country we are broke and no economic model is working, we are but one small step away from sharing the same fate as the rest of the Eurozone.

what's the answer ? I wish I knew..........





.

I agree with all your post and Kizzy's too, I really feel this Conservative party is now a danger to the UK rather than having the answers to the problems the UK has.

The 2 paragraphs in bold from you I think are likely very prophetic especially as to the NHS. Very good and strong points there that I wholly agree with Nedusa.

As to the answer, I believe strongly in one way of ensuring the NHS stays safe,which is well known on here by now from all I have said before.
As to the economy, I don't see this rush to get the deficit cleared at ther expense of further massive cuts to welfare and services.
As long as it is 'chipped' away at each year then that would seem to me to be the bettter, easier and kinder way to deal with all sectors in society.

One thing I firmly and now 100% believe, the answer to the whole scenario is not to be found in the current Conservative party and with this disastrous,incompetent procrastinating Prime Minister we have.
Nor is it to be found with the Lib Dems, who have shown they will throw anything out to get shared power and a few Ministerial posts.

I really do now see another hung parliament in 2015 but my strong hope is that this time it will be a govt. that does not in any form include the Conservatives.
Not with these, their current heartless and for me wrong policies that even for me are discriminatory and an injustice to those most vulnerable in society.
If the NHS too is really cared about and is felt it needs to be there cradle to grave, free at the point of need for all then the answer is clear to me there too, no way should it be handed to the Conservative party again in 2015.

never mind EU referendum so called pledges or tough talking on immigration while in fact little, and even nothing, has even been done there over the last 5 years.
I hope people search that dark, sinister hidden agenda of the Conservative party's other policies and that people are not fooled by their false pledges and gimmicks again in 2015.

The electorate didn't give the Conservatives an overall majority in 2010, they gave them a cautious ok to govern under probation.
They have failed miserably, despite being given a good working majority by the Lib Dems,to protect and look out for the most vulnerable and invest wisely in the things that they needed to.

They have been able to almost get two thirds of their manifesto in 2010 implemented even to the abuse of power of implementing a top down re-organisation of the NHS that no one was asked to vote for, no one voted for and which neither the Conservatives or Lib Dems had in their manifesto either.

They've had the chance,they have badly failed,as to their targets, if these had been building a house for someone and said it would be built in 5 years and all would be fine.
This lot would not as yet have the ground floor even laid let alone the building completed.
Yet these have the audacity to say they need the same time to set out to do the same things making even more severe cuts.

They are absolute failures and I believe they will fail again,I just really hope the electorate now give them firm marching orders and say goodbye to their heartlessness and massive failure across the board.