[JoshBB]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2...ism-so-common/

Now, I'm not the kind of person who likes to make generalisations on those who side politically left or right (though some of you may disagree with my self-analysis), and it is no secret that I lean towards the left.. however I thought I would share this article because it provoked thought and I found it interesting.

This paragraph in particular changed my thoughts slightly too:

Part of the problem, I think, is the Left’s power-centric analysis of discrimination. Following the work of social scientist Patricia Bidol-Padva, it has become increasingly popular to define racism, sexism and other similar "isms" as “prejudice plus power”. This approach denies the possibility of anti-male sexism, for example, because men are not a discriminated against group. The goal is to discourage false equivalence in conflicts between oppressed and dominant groups. However, it’s an orthodoxy that can leave adherents with some odd blind spots.

My personal view on why anti-semitism may have a slight boost on the left compared to previously, is the fact that the whole 'Israel vs Palestine' scenario has left people to hate Israelis - which they associate with being Jewish - and therefore hating Jews. This is ridiculous because there are even jewish people who believe the israeli government are breaking human rights laws. That is however where I believe the hatred & ignorance comes from, although it is thankfully a minority opinion by far.

Interested to hear others' opinions on this because I found it interesting and hopefully you guys will too

[lostalex]

The right is just as anti-semitic just in a different way. it's a case of an enemy of my enemy is my friend. the same way the right bashes muslims for their treatment of women, but the right doesn't really care about women. the right bashes muslim for their treatment of gays but the right doesn't care about gays. The right supports jews only because they want to bash muslim, but behind closed doors the right doesn't care about jews at all.

[arista]

Yes JoshBB
Labour have some Nasty Jewish Haters.
Who write it all online or in papers


All Sensible Labour MP's want these Nasty ones
removed forever

Its been debated on the Daily Politics(BBC2HD),
Ch4HD News and SkyNewsHD
some weeks back.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2...ism-so-common/

Now, I'm not the kind of person who likes to make generalisations on those who side politically left or right (though some of you may disagree with my self-analysis), and it is no secret that I lean towards the left.. however I thought I would share this article because it provoked thought and I found it interesting.

This paragraph in particular changed my thoughts slightly too:

My personal view on why anti-semitism may have a slight boost on the left compared to previously, is the fact that the whole 'Israel vs Palestine' scenario has left people to hate Israelis - which they associate with being Jewish - and therefore hating Jews. This is ridiculous because there are even jewish people who believe the israeli government are breaking human rights laws. That is however where I believe the hatred & ignorance comes from, although it is thankfully a minority opinion by far.

Interested to hear others' opinions on this because I found it interesting and hopefully you guys will too

Six million Jews were gassed long before Israel became a State. If people equate Jews with being Israeli it's just the same as considering all Muslims to be terrorists. Using the Israel/Palestine question in my opinion is making excuses for bigots who probably couldn't point to Israel on a map. Jews have been persecuted for centuries... millennia... but since 1947 there has been an excuse for it.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by Livia

Six million Jews were gassed long before Israel became a State. If people equate Jews with being Israeli it's just the same as considering all Muslims to be terrorists. Using the Israel/Palestine question in my opinion is making excuses for bigots who probably couldn't point to Israel on a map. Jews have been persecuted for centuries... millennia... but since 1947 there has been an excuse for it.

Yeah that's the point I was trying to get at, you've said it much better. I feel like a lot of racists use the Israeli state as a way to incite hatred towards Jews which is entirely unacceptable but that's the reason why it persists on the left possibly? Because of the only one-sided sympathy thing?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

Yeah that's the point I was trying to get at, you've said it much better. I feel like a lot of racists use the Israeli state as a way to incite hatred towards Jews which is entirely unacceptable but that's the reason why it persists on the left possibly? Because of the only one-sided sympathy thing?

Hitler wasn't a leftie... he was as far from being a leftie as you can get. I don't think any one group of people are particularly prone to anti-Semitism, unless you count stupid, ignorant people as being one group. I've had heated discussions about Israel and I do see things differently, probably, because I visit Israel often, I know the history and I am a Jew. But that doesn't mean I sympathise with the Israeli government because I don't, and neither do many Jews... nor Israelis, come to that. So yes, while people use Israel as an excuse to bash the Jews, before the State of Israel, they found other reasons to hate us.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

Hitler wasn't a leftie... he was as far from being a leftie as you can get. I don't think any one group of people are particularly prone to anti-Semitism, unless you count stupid, ignorant people as being one group. I've had heated discussions about Israel and I do see things differently, probably, because I visit Israel often, I know the history and I am a Jew. But that doesn't mean I sympathise with the Israeli government because I don't, and neither do many Jews... nor Israelis, come to that. So yes, while people use Israel as an excuse to bash the Jews, before the State of Israel, they found other reasons to hate us.

I always bow to your vast knowledge on this.
I have Jewish friends and they generally say much the same as you do.

I wish you would do a sort of blog on the issue really, it would be a fascinating, educating and insightful read for me, for one.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by Livia

Hitler wasn't a leftie... he was as far from being a leftie as you can get. I don't think any one group of people are particularly prone to anti-Semitism, unless you count stupid, ignorant people as being one group. I've had heated discussions about Israel and I do see things differently, probably, because I visit Israel often, I know the history and I am a Jew. But that doesn't mean I sympathise with the Israeli government because I don't, and neither do many Jews... nor Israelis, come to that. So yes, while people use Israel as an excuse to bash the Jews, before the State of Israel, they found other reasons to hate us.

I mean don't get me wrong, I do feel like anti-semitism is more aligned to the far-right than those on the far-left, however it is one element of racism that seems to have at least a tiny amount of backing on the left whereas the left tends to reject every other form of racism. I'd find it really interesting if you did a longer post on what you think about the whole Israel scenario too like Kizzy said, with your knowledge & experiences it would be really insightful to read.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

Yeah that's the point I was trying to get at, you've said it much better. I feel like a lot of racists use the Israeli state as a way to incite hatred towards Jews which is entirely unacceptable but that's the reason why it persists on the left possibly? Because of the only one-sided sympathy thing?

I think the reason that the left has such an issue with Jewish people is because a lot of Jewish people are business minded so are more likely to be right wing, hence why I think some of the left has an issue with Jewish people.

And also there are your racist left (which I know isn't very common) but it does exist, but I think as the secondry thing to the usual right versus left scenario.

What can be ironic with the left though is that they probably defend one of the most right wing organizations out there.

And btw I'm on about in their day to day lives, not with terrorism.

[letmein]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

I think the reason that the left has such an issue with Jewish people is because a lot of Jewish people are business minded so are more likely to be right wing, hence why I think some of the left has an issue with Jewish people.

And also there are your racist left (which I know isn't very common) but it does exist, but I think as the secondry thing to the usual right versus left scenario.

What can be ironic with the left though is that they probably defend one of the most right wing organizations out there.

And btw I'm on about in their day to day lives, not with terrorism.

Jews are overwhelmingly left-wing.

[bots]

Originally Posted by letmein

Jews are overwhelmingly left-wing.

Livia, our voice from the left

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

Yeah that's the point I was trying to get at, you've said it much better. I feel like a lot of racists use the Israeli state as a way to incite hatred towards Jews which is entirely unacceptable but that's the reason why it persists on the left possibly? Because of the only one-sided sympathy thing?

You are correct about 'One-sided sympathy' Josh, but a much better phrase would be 'WRONG sided sympathy', because the greater majority who have sympathy for the Palestinians and who detest and blame Israel, are simply swallowing propaganda and do not know the truth or the history.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Livia

Six million Jews were gassed long before Israel became a State. If people equate Jews with being Israeli it's just the same as considering all Muslims to be terrorists. Using the Israel/Palestine question in my opinion is making excuses for bigots who probably couldn't point to Israel on a map. Jews have been persecuted for centuries... millennia... but since 1947 there has been an excuse for it.

To be fair, there is a bias among jews all over the world towards Israel. especially jews in North America.

Probably because of right to return and family pressure to visit "the homeland". there is no doubt Livia that jews all over the world, no matter how far removed from Israel itself, just being jews they do feel a loyalty. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that, but it's silly to deny it exists.

Just like most blacks feel a loyalty to Africa even if they've never been there and have no desire to ever live there, they still have an automatic bias towards what is perceived as "the homeland".

[Ammi]

..I don't see that it could be seen as a 'bias' to see prejudices, no matter where in the world and regardless of whether that place in the world is lived in and no matter who is seeing those prejudices...surely we all see a connection to 'wrongs' and prejudice etc, simply because we're humans...

[Kizzy]

What happened in 1947?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

What happened in 1947?

Typo.... 1948.

[Crimson Dynamo]

form a club and have some rules and it does not matter if its badminton or religion the hate will come from those who are not in it

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

form a club and have some rules and it does not matter if its badminton or religion the hate will come from those who are not in it

In a nutshell of pure truth.

[Kizzy]

I hate those shuttlecock whacking bastards!

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I hate those shuttlecock whacking bastards!

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I hate those shuttlecock whacking bastards!

[Crimson Dynamo]

balls in skirts?


the bastards

[Kizzy]

I don't think I said that Josh
I would like a run down on 1948 though.

[bots]

For a while, supporting the Palestinian and other equally stupid causes was the trendy thing for left leaning politicians to do. Thankfully, that fad is on the wane now, leaving those such as Corbyn and Galloway the last idiots standing

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

For a while, supporting the Palestinian and other equally stupid causes was the trendy thing for left leaning politicians to do. Thankfully, that fad is on the wane now, leaving those such as Corbyn and Galloway the last idiots standing