[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

Huh. I'm asking which of these options do you believe to be true? No need to read back I'm trying to get you to actually make a point regarding your stance on this matter. Why do you keep mentioning the nurses who covered it up? Do you think they are actually guilty of a crime? You're the one who needs to read back.

I will redirect you to post 481. I've already stated a possible discussion point regarding what you are asking.

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

quite some difference in the totals - ranging from 20 to hundreds to thousands having taken into account some of the comments regarding the numbers invovled (throughout the thread).


Girth: the point I am focusing on is those, (by your own admission) that there will ''Obviously be some embellishment''..... for whatever reason.

That is the very thing that is likely to damage this investigation - and tarnish it. I do believe there may indeed may be something untoward: but the more embellishment that is taking place; the more harmful that may be to any truth behind all of this and will suffice in only damaging the investigations - THAT is my very point.

i agree wit that. People need to let the police handle it. And the papers aren't helping either.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

I think there's some truth to the allegations. Police say that there could be between 20/25 victims. All young teenage girls.

I do too, but to what degree, to what level of seriousness, and how accurate the memory may be after 'x' amount of years, as well as the possible weight on 'allegations being made and type' - I'm very aware that those factors may also have an effect on what these people may be remembering for 30/40 years ago when they were children.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

quite some difference in the totals - ranging from 20 to hundreds to thousands having taken into account some of the comments regarding the numbers invovled (throughout the thread).


Girth: the point I am focusing on is those, (by your own admission) that there will ''Obviously be some embellishment''..... for whatever reason.

That is the very thing that is likely to damage this investigation - and tarnish it. I do believe there may indeed may be something untoward: but the more embellishment that is taking place; the more harmful that may be to any truth behind all of this and will suffice in only damaging the investigations - THAT is my very point.

I've always said 30 so I've no idea what you're on about here. Direct your post to the person you're referring to but you'll find - if you read back - that I have always said 30.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Try reading back a few posts Girth.

Where is the proof that these nurses were instrumental in some cover up merely to secure funding?
Without evidence your comments are as invaid as girths hoax imo.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

i agree wit that. People need to let the police handle it. And the papers aren't helping either.

That is exactly how I feel about it. The media are not helping. The gossip mongers are not helping.

Let this be investigated fully and in entirety - with only the hard facts with evidence being presented before people find others guilty - it's trial by media, by people with nothing better to do, with people with grudges against the man / the BBC or a.n. other organisations.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

I will redirect you to post 481. I've already stated a possible discussion point regarding what you are asking.

In post 481 you mention perverting the course of justice. How does someone pervert the course of justice if no one has been accused of a crime?

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by kizzy

Where is the proof that these nurses were instrumental in some cover up merely to secure funding?
Without evidence your comments are as invaid as girths hoax imo.

If you look back Kizzy you will find that I posed my thoughts as a question: not as factual.

It's a point for discussion: I did not take it as being absolute.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

In post 481 you mention perverting the course of justice. How does someone pervert the course of justice if no one has been accused of a crime?

By being aware of what these supposely nurses are allegedly stating as reported in the media: that they were aware of what JS was doing and of the crime/s / abuse he was alleging committing that they claim they were aware of : to the point that they are now declaring they knew about this type of behaviour from him .

I'd have thought that was perfectly transparent tbh.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

I've always said 30 so I've no idea what you're on about here. Direct your post to the person you're referring to but you'll find - if you read back - that I have always said 30.

Read back on my post re this.

I also quoted another poster as well as your comment...... Cassieparis has earlier quoted 'thousands'.... the media a few days ago was quoting 'hundreds'.

if you've been following the thread from the beginning; you will have known that.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

By being aware of what these supposely nurses are allegedly stating as reported in the media: that they were aware of what JS was doing and of the crime/s / abuse he was alleging committing that they claim they were aware of : to the point that they are now declaring they knew about this type of behaviour from him .

I'd have thought that was perfectly transparent tbh.

You might want to rephrase the first bit. It makes no sense what so ever. I think when you write alleging you actually mean alleged or allegedly.

[Omah]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

I do believe there may indeed may be something untoward.

Really?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

I do too, but to what degree, to what level of seriousness, and how accurate the memory may be after 'x' amount of years, as well as the possible weight on 'allegations being made and type' - I'm very aware that those factors may also have an effect on what these people may be remembering for 30/40 years ago when they were children.

I would hope this is dealt with great seriousness.
I was a long time ago yes, but if you could try to envisage what it would be like to be assaulted as a child you may begin to understand it is not something you are likely to forget or ever fades from your memory.

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

By being aware of what these supposely nurses are allegedly stating as reported in the media: that they were aware of what JS was doing and of the crime/s / abuse he was alleging committing that they claim they were aware of : to the point that they are now declaring they knew about this type of behaviour from him .

I'd have thought that was perfectly transparent tbh.

It looks like the bbc is also guilty of this. I can't believe that no one working there noticed anything. Someone surely saw something?

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Read back on my post re this.

I also quoted another poster as well as your comment...... Cassieparis has earlier quoted 'thousands'.... the media a few days ago was quoting 'hundreds'.

if you've been following the thread from the beginning; you will have known that.

Refer your comment to the poster but in the post I'm referring to you directly mention me. Don't specifically put my name in a post then tell me to read the whole thread. I'm responding to your post directly please respond to mine directly. In all of my posts I've said 30 if that is not the case then please point out the discrepancy.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by kizzy

I would hope this is dealt with great seriousness.
I was a long time ago yes, but if you could try to envisage what it would be like to be assaulted as a child you may begin to understand it is not something you are likely to forget or ever fades from your memory.

There's definitely truth in this which is why I have no sympathy at all for him, he deserves all the bad press and jokes at his expense that he gets. I have no sympathy for paedophiles

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

By being aware of what these supposely nurses are allegedly stating as reported in the media: that they were aware of what JS was doing and of the crime/s / abuse he was alleging committing that they claim they were aware of : to the point that they are now declaring they knew about this type of behaviour from him .

I'd have thought that was perfectly transparent tbh.

Transparent?

supposedly... allegedly, this hypothetical of yours is getting more and more confusing pyra.
It's as clear as mud what you are trying to accuse the nursing staff of...
We could all throw a load of what ifs in the mix, I thought we were more interested in the truth and facts though?

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

You might want to rephrase the first bit. It makes no sense what so ever. I think when you write alleging you actually mean alleged or allegedly.

Nah, I think it is more than clear what I meant, if you want to pick up on spelling errors as the best you can do to strengthen your own argument: be my guest, I'm more interested in the story that of daft errors on a keyboard.

Originally Posted by Omah

Really?

Yes, really. And I'm able to discuss that without the use of sarcastic smileys.

Originally Posted by kizzy

I would hope this is dealt with great seriousness.
I was a long time ago yes, but if you could try to envisage what it would be like to be assaulted as a child you may begin to understand it is not something you are likely to forget or ever fades from your memory.

Absolutely agree with you there: it SHOULD be dealt with in all seriousness: yes, it was a long time ago, but given the 'amount of people who were in the know' (supposedly) - there appears to be enough to be looking at that would allow a full investigation to be conducted with evidence - that's all I think is needed - rather than 'people' all over the place jumping the gun.

I'm also conscious that some may recall things exactly: as much as I am aware that memories may be distorted (and subsequently) be affected by what is now being reported: I'm trying to be very balanced but it is something that needs investigated properly, without bias - and I am glad that both the Police and the BBC are now doing so. Let this be done in the correct manner....that's all I'm alluding to. I don't believe that all this 'trial by media, and taking what every person is saying as gospel' is ever going to help a fair investigation.

Originally Posted by Vanessa

It looks like the bbc is also guilty of this. I can't believe that no one working there noticed anything. Someone surely saw something?

That's what I struggle with - and if there HAS / WAS any cover up / deliberate pushing aside; then those persons too, imo, should also be held accountable. If there were people who were (proven) to have known what was going on: then they too (imo) have a degree of 'guilt' and something to answer to also. There are more than any possible victims here: there is the possibility that people 'hid' what was going on: and that could have prevented decade of further abuse continuing: IF there is truth to any of this.

[GiRTh]

Even after correcting the spelling errors it makes no sense. Turning a blind eye is not the same as perverting the course of justice - Your words BTW. Would you like to rephrase your first post?

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Nah, I think it is more than clear what I meant, if you want to pick up on spelling errors as the best you can do to strengthen your own argument: be my guest, I'm more interested in the story that of daft errors on a keyboard.





Yes, really. And I'm able to discuss that without the use of sarcastic smileys.




Absolutely agree with you there: it SHOULD be dealt with in all seriousness: yes, it was a long time ago, but given the 'amount of people who were in the know' (supposedly) - there appears to be enough to be looking at that would allow a full investigation to be conducted with evidence - that's all I think is needed - rather than 'people' all over the place jumping the gun.

I'm also conscious that some may recall things exactly: as much as I am aware that memories may be distorted (and subsequently) be affected by what is now being reported: I'm trying to be very balanced but it is something that needs investigated properly, without bias - and I am glad that both the Police and the BBC are now doing so. Let this be done in the correct manner....that's all I'm alluding to. I don't believe that all this 'trial by media, and taking what every person is saying as gospel' is ever going to help a fair investigation.




That's what I struggle with - and if there HAS / WAS any cover up / deliberate pushing aside; then those persons too, imo, should also be held accountable. If there were people who were (proven) to have known what was going on: then they too (imo) have a degree of 'guilt' and something to answer to also. There are more than any possible victims here: there is the possibility that people 'hid' what was going on: and that could have prevented decade of further abuse continuing: IF there is truth to any of this.

I couldn't agree more, Pyra. I think he could have been stopped before, but instead it's been covered up. It makes me so mad!

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

There's definitely truth in this which is why I have no sympathy at all for him, he deserves all the bad press and jokes at his expense that he gets. I have no sympathy for paedophiles

Neither do I but I also believe in avoidance of trial by media.

Originally Posted by kizzy

Transparent?

supposedly... allegedly, this hypothetical of yours is getting more and more confusing pyra.
It's as clear as mud what you are trying to accuse the nursing staff of...
We could all throw a load of what ifs in the mix, I thought we were more interested in the truth and facts though?

Cannot see what is confusing.

I'm not prepared to 'hang a dead man' based on people based on heresay only.

you say 'I thought we were more intrested in the truth and facts'.

If you show me hard evidence of unrefuted truth and facts, I'll be more than happy to discuss. Proven and unrefued truth and fact......

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

Even after correcting the spelling errors it makes no sense. Turning a blind eye is not the same as perverting the course of justice - Your words BTW. Would you like to rephrase your first post?

according to you then, turning a blind eye to child abuse is acceptable.

Interesting theory, not one I happen to agree with. Especially when it concerns child abuse.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

according to you then, turning a blind eye to child abuse is acceptable.

Interesting theory, not one I happen to agree with. Especially when it concerns child abuse.

No No no. Nice try. I never said anything was acceptable. Its your turn to read back.

Turning a blind eye to a crime is not and will never be the same as perverting the course of justice. Again, it was you who bought this phrase into the discussion.

[Kizzy]

Hmmm, you condem trial by media and yet have acted as judge, juror and executioner for the nurses in Stoke?
Seems a tad contradictory to me. The police from many forces up and down the country have i'm sure many victim and witness statements, it is an unusual case but an important one for many.

[Omah]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*
I do believe there may indeed may be something untoward .

Originally Posted by Omah

Really?

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Yes, really. And I'm able to discuss that without the use of sarcastic smileys.

IMO, the use of the phrase "something untoward" to refer to alleged serial sex crimes against children required a laconic response .....