[Beso]

Hamas dont want a 2 state solution, they want all jews expelled and all land returned to the Palestinians. Until they get that, if given the chance to regroup, all we will see is more oct 7ths.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Hamas dont want a 2 state solution, they want all jews expelled and all land returned to the Palestinians. Until they get that, if given the chance to regroup, all we will see is more oct 7ths.

Probably but the same is true of Israel (they do not realistically want a 2 state solution either, and never have) which is why the 1948 plan was doomed to failure from the outset, and all of this violence was always coming.

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

Probably but the same is true of Israel (they do not realistically want a 2 state solution either, and never have) which is why the 1948 plan was doomed to failure from the outset, and all of this violence was always coming.

They know it wouldnt work because of hamas..so they get rid of Hamas first.. then take it from there..

But hamas has to go for it to have a chance..that is fact.

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Hamas dont want a 2 state solution, they want all jews expelled and all land returned to the Palestinians. Until they get that, if given the chance to regroup, all we will see is more oct 7ths.

Israel doesn't want a two state solution either so it's unlikely to ever happen. You claim that Hamas want all Jews expelled from Israel. Do you have definitive proof of this?

[Livia]

Both Israel and Palestine want Jerusalem as their capital. Can't see two states ever working.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by parmnion

They know it wouldnt work because of hamas..so they get rid of Hamas first.. then take it from there..

They don't want it though and again never have - Israel has historically been (and may continue to be) more on board with a two-state solution because of international relations, but that's the only reason, in terms of what they want in an ideal world it clearly isn't that. That's not even a judgement particularly - it's just an observation. I judge the way they're currently trying to solve the problem, but I acknowledge that there is a problem ... two-state solution has never been realistic (at the very least, not one that includes Gaza), it's a high concept political idea that's incompatible with the populations.

That was true pre Oct 7th... now, after the events of the last 6+ months, it's 100% off the table... it will NEVER work... it can't even go back to how it was before. Two state solution inclusive of Gaza is dead as an idea.

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

Probably but the same is true of Israel (they do not realistically want a 2 state solution either, and never have) which is why the 1948 plan was doomed to failure from the outset, and all of this violence was always coming.

Israel has never complied or had any intention to comply with resolution 242 (a resolution they adopted in 1967)

[Livia]

Originally Posted by DemRed

Israel doesn't want a two state solution either so it's unlikely to ever happen. You claim that Hamas want all Jews expelled from Israel. Do you have definitive proof of this?

Everything they do and everything they say. From the river to the sea...

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Wow, so you could also claim to be Christian if you wanted, whether or not you believe in God.

Of course and lots of people do, especially when its convenient to do so.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by DemRed

Israel doesn't want a two state solution either so it's unlikely to ever happen. You claim that Hamas want all Jews expelled from Israel. Do you have definitive proof of this?

As with Israel I don't think there's any denying that they would WANT it. In both cases, that's different to it being their actual realistic aim... so they may or may not be trying to make it happen. But if you were to ask either "If you could Thanos snap and the whole of Israel was magically yours no drama, OR snap your fingers and have a perfect and peaceful two-state solution, OR snap your fingers and unfathomably share the country peacefully with equal representation" I think we being realistic all know that the choice - for both - would be the first one. They're both religious populations, they both believe they have a god-given claim on the land. Neither actually wants to share it. That's just what it is.

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by Livia

Everything they do and everything they say. From the river to the sea...

Israel say the same thing and yet, for some reason, its only racist if it comes from one side. I think it's racist from both sides.
What Israel appears to be doing now is ethnic cleansing. I've seen interviews with prominent Zionists about how they were looking forward to all this new real estate in what was once Palestine.

[Livia]

You make large claims with no evidence. Where are these interviews? No one's taking your word...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by DemRed

Israel say the same thing and yet, for some reason, its only racist if it comes from one side. I think it's racist from both sides.
What Israel appears to be doing now is ethnic cleansing. I've seen interviews with prominent Zionists about how they were looking forward to all this new real estate in what was once Palestine.

I find it quite complicated because there's a "They would if they could" element here with Hamas. I do not, personally, believe that if aliens beamed down and gifted Hamas the technology and weaponry to take all of Israel with overwhelming force, that they wouldn't have done it immediately. There is a huge power imbalance between Israel and Palestine, clearly, and that's what results in such an imbalance in terms of the destruction caused, and also what makes it so distasteful I think (as I also don't believe Israel would have gone in as hard as they have if there was any realistic possibility of a meaningful counter-offensive).

As always my sympathies lie with the innocent bystanders whose lives and homes have been devastated, and my ire is directed at those who are seemingly completely careless with collateral damage (and those who would cheer them on gleefully).

The politics on all sides is ****ed. Isn't it always.

[Beso]

Originally Posted by DemRed

Israel doesn't want a two state solution either so it's unlikely to ever happen. You claim that Hamas want all Jews expelled from Israel. Do you have definitive proof of this?

Yes. My cousin is a Hamas operative.

[Crimson Dynamo]

On Sunday, the @IAFsite carried out an intelligence-based precise strike that targeted
senior Hamas terrorists in Tal as Sultan.

Contrary to Hamas' lies and misinformation, the strike did not take place in the Al-
Mawasi Humanitarian Area.

This is the area where the strike actually happened:


https://x.com/IDF/status/1795089873772142873

perhaps certain members may want to row back on their earlier posts regarding this operation

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by Livia

Jewish people consider themselves a race, I consider Judaism to be a race... You can't say "with certainty" that they're not. Stop telling me what a Jew is, you sound like an idiot.

You can only talk for yourself and the people you know. Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro and his thousands of followers believes Jewish people are not a race and so does Rabbi Shais Taub and many other Rabbis, but then you stated some time ago that Orthodox Jews were an odd bunch, so here's a guy who is not Orthodox

Youtube video

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

On Sunday, the @IAFsite carried out an intelligence-based precise strike that targeted
senior Hamas terrorists in Tal as Sultan.

Contrary to Hamas' lies and misinformation, the strike did not take place in the Al-
Mawasi Humanitarian Area.

This is the area where the strike actually happened:


https://x.com/IDF/status/1795089873772142873

perhaps certain members may want to row back on their earlier posts regarding this operation

This is meaningless without an independent source. Note that I'm not saying it's untrue; just that it's meaningless. It's jus the IDF themselves saying "Umm no we didn't trust me bro". ANY other source would be better tbh.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by DemRed

You can only talk for yourself and the people you know. Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro and his thousands of followers believes Jewish people are not a race and so does Rabbi Shais Taub and many other Rabbis, but then you stated some time ago that Orthodox Jews were an odd bunch, so here's a guy who is not Orthodox

Youtube video

I take it back. You don't sound like an idiot, you are an idiot.

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

This is meaningless without an independent source. Note that I'm not saying it's untrue; just that it's meaningless. It's jus the IDF themselves saying "Umm no we didn't trust me bro". ANY other source would be better tbh.

But you accept the Hamas news reels... or at least seem to.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by parmnion

But you accept the Hamas news reels... or at least seem to.

Do I? Where?

[Redway]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Yes. My cousin is a Hamas operative.

I wonder how-many lifetimes would have to pass before I actually believed that.

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I draw the line at someone pretending that one needs anything resembling any sort of decorum to be a member of TiBB. I mean it's never been great but in 2024 it's dominated by a small handful of the literal saddest old bastards I've ever encountered. And I spent 9 years in a bookmakers.

Oh dearly deary me..how ageist...mods..sort this discriminatory rhetoric from the left leaning members out please...

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by Livia

I take it back. You don't sound like an idiot, you are an idiot.

I've often wondered who you really are.... Now I know

[user104658]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Oh dearly deary me..how ageist...mods..sort this discriminatory rhetoric from the left leaning members out please...

Why are you going around looking for posts from days ago to make daft passive-aggressive comments about, like a little piggy snuffling around for truffles? Take the afternoon off Parmy, no one cares least of all the TiBB staff.

[DemRed]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Oh dearly deary me..how ageist...mods..sort this discriminatory rhetoric from the left leaning members out please...

Embrace your age Parmnion. Every wrinkle tells a story. Don't try and cancel people if they lose it with you because it looks so overly woke.