[Smithy]

CENTENNIAL —Hundrds of students fled in terror and many others huddled in the corners of locked-down classrooms on Friday after a gunman opened fire at Arapahoe High School.

Students who fled the school said at least two students were shot by another student in the cafeteria, but that could not immediately be confirmed. Police SWAT teams swarmed the school, which is at the corner of South University Boulevard and Dry Creek Road in Centennial. Bomb squads were also called to the scene.

The shooting began about 12:30 p.m.

Parents of Arapahoe High School students were asked to go to Shepherd of the Hills church, at 7691 S. University Boulevard, to reunite with their children.

"I was scared and shaking," one student said.

Arapahoe High School shooting
Students wait outside Arapahoe High School on December 13, 2013. (Ryan Parker, The Denver Post)
She said she heard, "bang, bang, bang" and by the third shot she was on the ground.

Students said they hid in the corners of dark classrooms until they were led out of classrooms. Adam Jones, whose sister goes to high school, said students are still locked in rooms about an hour after the shooting began and were "very scared."

A teacher wrote in a text message from inside the school: "lockdown-super scary."

The manager of a Subway across the street from the high school said Friday afternoon that the area is swamped with police cars and ambulance and fire trucks. She wasn't aware of what was happening at the school. An employee at the King Soopers in the shopping center also said there were many students at the scene.

Nearby Shepherd of the Hills Lutheran Church School is on lockdown.

"We saw some kids running on the south side of our parking lot," a secretary with the school said.

All schools in the Douglas County School District are on "lockout" status. No one is allowed into schools. Law enforcement has increased patrols in the Douglas County area.

Becky O'Guin, a spokeswoman with South Metro Fire Rescue, said firefighters were called out to the school at 12:30 p.m. on reports of a fire.

"We're on the scene with fire units and medics," O'Guin said.

Reporters are on the way to the scene, this story will be updated.

again

[Shaun]

Colorado again... it always seems to be that state :/ (Columbine and the Aurora cinema shootings there)

[Vicky.]

Bout time they tightened up the gun laws properly isnt it...

I know the odd thing like this would still happen, but if kids weren't allowed guns in the first place, it would be rarer.

[Drew.]

No deaths yet which is a surprise considering the amount of people in there (apart from the gun man)

[arista]

Suspect has died

[fingers]

Apparently shooter dead of self-inflicted gunshot wound, 1 other person in critical condition,

[Z]

I have a great number of problems with the United States of America and its supposed freedoms and my number one complaint is that guns are allowed in that country and that people are brought up in certain parts of America fully believing that it is their God given right to own and use guns whenever they feel like it. It's lunacy.

[Samm]

Thank god no one was killed,I just don't understand there's got to be some evil people out there

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Bout time they tightened up the gun laws properly isnt it...

I know the odd thing like this would still happen, but if kids weren't allowed guns in the first place, it would be rarer.

Kids aren't allowed guns, it's 18 for rifles and shotguns and 21 for handguns (most commonly used in these sorts of shootings because they can be hidden)...

For that reason, a change in the law would make very little difference. The guns are "out there" and obtainable (most criminals who own guns are not licensed to own them in the first place, making it illegal would make zero difference) and the incidents of high school shootings are a cultural phemomenon... in the sense that "it happened, so it will continue to happen". Essentially, some messed up kid did it and it got a huge amount of media attention, so now any messed up / angry kid with a death wish who wants to go out in a "blaze of glory" in the US has that image culturally imprinted in his mind.

I'm not saying that I agree with the fairly easy availability of firearms in the US, per se... the number of accidental deaths with them makes a good case for stronger restrictions... just that I don't think it would alter the "high school shooting" situation at all. If someone wanted to get hold of one, it would still be easy enough (it's not THAT hard in the UK, if you have the cash and know who to ask) and let's face it... someone who's planning to shoot up their school and then turn the gun on themselves isn't going to suddenly stop and say "Oh no, it would be illegal for me to have a gun! Back to the drawing board..."

[Z]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Kids aren't allowed guns, it's 18 for rifles and shotguns and 21 for handguns (most commonly used in these sorts of shootings because they can be hidden)...

For that reason, a change in the law would make very little difference. The guns are "out there" and obtainable (most criminals who own guns are not licensed to own them in the first place, making it illegal would make zero difference) and the incidents of high school shootings are a cultural phemomenon... in the sense that "it happened, so it will continue to happen". Essentially, some messed up kid did it and it got a huge amount of media attention, so now any messed up / angry kid with a death wish who wants to go out in a "blaze of glory" in the US has that image culturally imprinted in his mind.

I'm not saying that I agree with the fairly easy availability of firearms in the US, per se... the number of accidental deaths with them makes a good case for stronger restrictions... just that I don't think it would alter the "high school shooting" situation at all. If someone wanted to get hold of one, it would still be easy enough (it's not THAT hard in the UK, if you have the cash and know who to ask) and let's face it... someone who's planning to shoot up their school and then turn the gun on themselves isn't going to suddenly stop and say "Oh no, it would be illegal for me to have a gun! Back to the drawing board..."

I actually disagree, I think most of these kids are often bullied or feel left out in some way and often lack the social skills to integrate with their fellow students which is usually what leads to them taking their anger out on the school/college. If they can't readily buy a gun from a store, they're not gonna have the balls to try get one illegally, nine times out of ten I'd reckon.

I think if they outlawed guns in every state in the USA, and all police forces were told that their number one objective is to confiscate weapons, I think it would eradicate gun ownership down to the levels that they exist in most other Western countries. Of course some people will have them but it is just sheer stupidity to continue to allow anyone of the age of consent to just buy one. People buy them to kill other people; so people buy them to defend themselves. It's a never ending cycle that can only be ended if they just get rid of them. I get through my day perfectly fine without owning a gun, future generations of Americans won't miss something they never had but I'm sure plenty of gun toting egomaniacs would protest it until the day they died if the US government ever took that long awaited action to write it out of the constitution.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by The baby Zeesus

I actually disagree, I think most of these kids are often bullied or feel left out in some way and often lack the social skills to integrate with their fellow students which is usually what leads to them taking their anger out on the school/college. If they can't readily buy a gun from a store, they're not gonna have the balls to try get one illegally, nine times out of ten I'd reckon.

I think if they outlawed guns in every state in the USA, and all police forces were told that their number one objective is to confiscate weapons, I think it would eradicate gun ownership down to the levels that they exist in most other Western countries. Of course some people will have them but it is just sheer stupidity to continue to allow anyone of the age of consent to just buy one. People buy them to kill other people; so people buy them to defend themselves. It's a never ending cycle that can only be ended if they just get rid of them. I get through my day perfectly fine without owning a gun, future generations of Americans won't miss something they never had but I'm sure plenty of gun toting egomaniacs would protest it until the day they died if the US government ever took that long awaited action to write it out of the constitution.

School aged kids can't readily buy a gun from a store, though... like I said, 18 for a rifle 21 for a handgun. However you look at it, the guns they are using are not their own ... yes, they're often taken from family members, but like I said, it's far from being difficult to get your hands on one.

As for eradication... it's a difficult issue, in my opinion. Other western nations haven't had the same widespread firearm ownership that the US has had, it's hard to put the cork back in the bottle after it's been popped. The main reason being, the hardest people to take the guns away from will be the criminals. If you have a large proportion of even petty criminals being armed, then the police force has to be armed. And having an as-standard armed police force whilst making it illegal for civilians to also be armed, doesn't sit well with me. The reason it "works" here is that, on the whole, the police force is not armed. There are armed response units, but your average police officer is not packing a handgun on his hip. You can't tell a nation to give up its' guns and then continue to have an armed cop on every corner... and you can't disarm the police force when criminals are still likely to be armed for decades to come. The only way to do it would be to have a gradual disarming of the population AND the police force through very slowly tightening controls... it would take generations.

I would also point out that it's not massively difficult to get a license for a shotgun or rifle (even a high-powered one) in the UK... harder than the US, yes, but only handguns have massive outright restrictions. So long as you don't have a violent criminal record, you can get a rifle license, and own a gun.

The reason that far fewer people in the UK actually own rifles or shotguns than in the US is purely cultural, not legal. We *can*, we just *don't*.

I'd also point out that you could do just as much damage walking into a school with a hunting crossbow or composite bow as with a handgun... and those aren't difficult to get hold of at all. You can get one on eBay. Or to go one further - you can make a grenade out of crap you can buy at ASDA.

Like I said... the cultural anomaly of the "US high school massacre" has very little to do with the availability of weapons and more to do with the spectacle, or, I guess it could even be called "tradition"? If firearms were unavailable, a kid who wanted to add his name to the growing list would just find another way to kill.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Kids aren't allowed guns, it's 18 for rifles and shotguns and 21 for handguns (most commonly used in these sorts of shootings because they can be hidden)...

For that reason, a change in the law would make very little difference. The guns are "out there" and obtainable (most criminals who own guns are not licensed to own them in the first place, making it illegal would make zero difference) and the incidents of high school shootings are a cultural phemomenon... in the sense that "it happened, so it will continue to happen". Essentially, some messed up kid did it and it got a huge amount of media attention, so now any messed up / angry kid with a death wish who wants to go out in a "blaze of glory" in the US has that image culturally imprinted in his mind.

I'm not saying that I agree with the fairly easy availability of firearms in the US, per se... the number of accidental deaths with them makes a good case for stronger restrictions... just that I don't think it would alter the "high school shooting" situation at all. If someone wanted to get hold of one, it would still be easy enough (it's not THAT hard in the UK, if you have the cash and know who to ask) and let's face it... someone who's planning to shoot up their school and then turn the gun on themselves isn't going to suddenly stop and say "Oh no, it would be illegal for me to have a gun! Back to the drawing board..."

Argh. I worded it quite wrongly. Mind I thought the license age was 16 for some reason

But sooo many kids grow up with guns in their house, due to their parents having one. If there wasnt a gun in pretty much every home, these children would find it hard to get hold of them

Its not that hard in the uk you say...but how often do you hear of a shooting here compared to america?

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Argh. I worded it quite wrongly. Mind I thought the license age was 16 for some reason

But sooo many kids grow up with guns in their house, due to their parents having one. If there wasnt a gun in pretty much every home, these children would find it hard to get hold of them

Its not that hard in the uk you say...but how often do you hear of a shooting here compared to america?

America is a really weird place, and gun paranoia is fueled by the right and the NRA, who just basically lie about government conspiracies etc.

In terms of guns in the US, the number of individuals owning guns is actually decreasing, but the people that own guns, are actually buying more and more guns.

[arista]

Originally Posted by The Baby Jesus

America is a really weird place, and gun paranoia is fueled by the right and the NRA, who just basically lie about government conspiracies etc.

In terms of guns in the US, the number of individuals owning guns is actually decreasing, but the people that own guns, are actually buying more and more guns.

Yes True
as they fear soon they can no longer buy them.


America was built by Shooting the British out
they should have left us there in control of the North.

Originally Posted by arista

Yes True
as they fear soon they can no longer buy them.


America was built by Shooting the British out
they should have left us there in control of the North.

Because of people like Glenn Beck/Wayne LaPierre who tell them the government wants to come and take them away from them.

[arista]

Originally Posted by The Baby Jesus

Because of people like Glenn Beck/Wayne LaPierre who tell them the government wants to come and take them away from them.

True again

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Its not that hard in the uk you say...but how often do you hear of a shooting here compared to america?

Well that was actually the point of half of my post... that it's a cultural issue rather than an issue regarding the legality of owning guns. You (almost) never hear about these things happening in the UK, because a very small number of people in the UK own guns. But this isn't because it's illegal to own one. Maybe there's a misconception that it is... I don't know... but it simply isn't, gun ownership (besides handguns) in the UK is perfectly legal and obtaining a license isn't a difficult process (for those without a criminal record)... and yet, not many UK households do so compared to the US. That is why making firearm ownership illegal in the US wouldn't "fix" the issue... because legal ownership isn't the issue in the first place. "High School Massacres" are a cultural phenomenon unique to the US in their frequency, and would continue to be so even if every single civilian-owned firearm in the entire country was seized and destroyed. The firearm is the tool... a tool that is available in countless other countries that don't have this problem... the *problem* is the mindset.

[Drew.]

One of the teenagers shot has died in hospital

[Scream]

I would never feel safe in England if I knew almost everyone was carrying a gun...strange.

[Verbal]

Originally Posted by Scream

I would never feel safe in England if I knew almost everyone was carrying a gun...strange.

Its crazy that you can walk down the street in a lot of America holding a gun and its perfectly legal. Can't even imagine that.