[jet]

Originally Posted by Pincho Paxton

But you just mentioned half a dozen other names.

Yes, about their treatment of Gary, one of the subjects of this thread.

[Pincho Paxton]

Originally Posted by jet

Yes, about their treatment of Gary, one of the subjects of this thread.

James treatment of other housemates is the other subject of the thread, same thing.

[jet]

Originally Posted by Pincho Paxton

James treatment of other housemates is the other subject of the thread, same thing.

The subject of the thread and the OP is about James and Gary.

[Pincho Paxton]

Originally Posted by jet

The subject of the thread and the OP is about James and Gary.

You mentioned all of the other names. I followed your reply with all of the other names. That's how conversations work. I replied to you. You said that the other names don't get mentioned, I said that they do. I said that the reason James gets threads is because he acts aggressive to everyone. If you don't want to hear a reply to your own post, then don't post it.

[jet]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..I don't think the others do 'get away with it' Jet or even if their part is diluted in any way because it is equally discussed whenever their has been a particular incident and the 'pack thing' and 'bullying' have been referred to in many posts which includes them all...I think that James is discussed more in general because he's extremely pompous and self important..(I personally think that comes from extreme insecurities..)...but we all talk about the ones 'we love to hate' more than the ones that are actually ok just because it creates 'lively conversations'.....I also think that maybe James was criticised a bit more at the beginning because he was the first one to seem to 'create' a situation with Gary that need not have happened in the first place but then seemed to also portray that he calmed that situation as well..and also maybe because he does seem to take some time with Gary and more than others then immediately mocks/laughs or is mean about him to someone else immediately after, which is not something anyone else does so much... it just adds an extra layer od how duplicitous he has been with Gary because he's constantly telling him that he's being his friend, you know..?..

James is a pompous twat but I guess I'm just tired of coming on here and seeing over half the threads going on about James James James James James did this...did that...over and over and over.
It's reached the point where every little thing he does is picked up on and talked about to death and some of the others behaviour towards Gary is sometimes overlooked or given lip service in the midst of the James hate fest (and I can't blame anyone for hating him by the way, but really!.)
I am more interested in the dynamics of the relationship between Gary and James - why James is fascinated with him yet so frustrated and angry with him etc. and why Gary still hangs out with him, asks him to do some things for him, and tolerates him. I tried to talk about this earlier on in the series but just got the 'James is horrible' stuff. So it's pointless really.

I wish James was up for eviction this week and gone Wednesday because him and his twatness (is that a word?) is dominating the forum and it's personally boring me no end. JMO.

[jet]

Originally Posted by Pincho Paxton

You mentioned all of the other names. I followed your reply with all of the other names. That's how conversations work. I replied to you. You said that the other names don't get mentioned, I said that they do. I said that the reason James gets threads is because he acts aggressive to everyone. If you don't want to hear a reply to your own post, then don't post it.

This is getting confusing but it's not that important to me anyway.

[Creggle]

Love him or hate him he's an amazing villain.

(I hate him)

[jet]

Originally Posted by Creggle

Love him or hate him he's an amazing villain.

(I hate him)

I agree, which is why I wanted him kept in to the end - but the forum is so obsessed with him maybe it would be better around here and friendlier if he was booted?

[Creggle]

Originally Posted by jet

I agree, which is why I wanted him kept in to the end - but the forum is so obsessed with him maybe it would be better around here and friendlier if he was booted?

Heh maybe, wouldn't be worth him getting the boot though, Gary can MORE than handle whatever James throws at him, and he's making for some brilliant TV. I've never loved to hate someone this much before.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by jet

James is a pompous twat but I guess I'm just tired of coming on here and seeing over half the threads going on about James James James James James did this...did that...over and over and over.
It's reached the point where every little thing he does is picked up on and talked about to death and some of the others behaviour towards Gary is sometimes overlooked or given lip service in the midst of the James hate fest (and I can't blame anyone for hating him by the way, but really!.)
I am more interested in the dynamics of the relationship between Gary and James - why James is fascinated with him yet so frustrated and angry with him etc. and why Gary still hangs out with him, asks him to do some things for him, and tolerates him. I tried to talk about this earlier on in the series but just got the 'James is horrible' stuff. So it's pointless really.

I wish James was up for eviction this week and gone Wednesday because him and his twatness (is that a word?) is dominating the forum and it's personally boring me to distraction. JMO.

..it's a good word and fairly much covers his personality so it's now officially a BB word anyway.....hmmmm, I understand what you're saying..I think BB with the HL shows create much less of a balance than they used to so there is more of a 'villain and victim' type thing/storyline and James in this show is being portrayed as the 'villain' and will endlessly be talked about...?....I don't think Gary is a 'victim' though as such but just being subjected to a general group intolerance thing and being treated meanly, almost as if he's 'less than'/not respected at all as a person..?....I think that might be because there are things about him that are extremely annoying to live with as well which I understand but with someone else, another housemate, they would maybe have been handled with more patience and tolerance because Gary is just not liked or 'popular'...I find that interesting..(and worrying..)..that empathy is lost for someone if it's someone who is quite unpopular..?...


..I'm not sure James is fascinated with Gary, I don't see any interest there in him at all...he isn't interested in anything Gary has to say or any of his thoughts/beliefs etc...I think James has to feel 'important' ..has to prove himself somehow and it's interesting that the two people he has clashed with most in the house are the most 'vulnerable' with Gary and his impairment which causes him to become frustrating to the other housemates..?..so someone James can easily very much feel importance over by 'feeding' the dislike of the other housemates by constantly criticising Gary because he knows his actions and words will have 'popularity' with the others..therefore enforcing his feeling of 'Alpha' by treating Gary badly but yet also being the one to occasionally do things for him, which he constantly then points out so all are aware including Gary himself...

..and then there is also Audley, who is very much an 'Alpha' figure and by his size as well as his personality so James has 'preened his feathers' there and told him quite early on how he's not scared of him......(he will be really otherwise he would be dumb/have you seen the size of Audley...)..but he has to 'prove' outwardly to the others (and viewers..) that he isn't...it's so important for him to be the 'leader'/the Alpha...?...he has to tell us all and the housemates that he's intelligent/top of his game etc a real leader..?......interesting....also very insecure because he's the least comfortable with who he is than any of them I think...also interesting that (I think), he was fine with Kellie until more and more of Kellie's 'male' emerged in her aggression as well...maybe then started seeing her as a challenge to his 'Alpha'...?....

..maybe his relationship with Gary also started the way it did because he originally saw Gary is an Alpha but then it wasn't so, so he became the 'old alpha' that Gary didn't have much respect for but had to throw scraps of kindness to now and again....


..I'm making it up as I go along.....

[jet]

Originally Posted by Creggle

Heh maybe, wouldn't be worth him getting the boot though, Gary can MORE than handle whatever James throws at him, and he's making for some brilliant TV. I've never loved to hate someone this much before.

I was like that with Jim Davidson, whereas with Helen I just hated her without any enjoyment.

[the truth]

hes a boring nasty shallow twat who is making the show infinitely worse. he may be paid by bb to be a twat or he may just be a twat 24/7 either way its boring. get rid lets have some fun

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by jet

James is a pompous twat but I guess I'm just tired of coming on here and seeing over half the threads going on about James James James James James did this...did that...over and over and over.
It's reached the point where every little thing he does is picked up on and talked about to death and some of the others behaviour towards Gary is sometimes overlooked or given lip service in the midst of the James hate fest (and I can't blame anyone for hating him by the way, but really!.)
I am more interested in the dynamics of the relationship between Gary and James - why James is fascinated with him yet so frustrated and angry with him etc. and why Gary still hangs out with him, asks him to do some things for him, and tolerates him. I tried to talk about this earlier on in the series but just got the 'James is horrible' stuff. So it's pointless really.

I wish James was up for eviction this week and gone Wednesday because him and his twatness (is that a word?) is dominating the forum and it's personally boring me no end. JMO.

I think it's because James keep giving us new fodder to be disgusted about. He is relentless in his hideousness.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Creggle

Heh maybe, wouldn't be worth him getting the boot though, Gary can MORE than handle whatever James throws at him, and he's making for some brilliant TV. I've never loved to hate someone this much before.

..yeah I think that's it as well, it's because Gary is so laid back and doesn't get involved in 'house politics' and a lot washes over him ...on the whole I think he's enjoying himself ..(although very confused sometimes....)..so it's a bit more of a 'fun to hate' situation...James is the JR Ewing of CBB.....

[Creggle]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..yeah I think that's it as well, it's because Gary is so laid back and doesn't get involved in 'house politics' and a lot washes over him ...on the whole I think he's enjoying himself ..(although very confused sometimes....)..so it's a bit more of a 'fun to hate' situation...James is the JR Ewing of CBB.....

Exactly! Like he could give two sh!ts what people likes James and Stephanie say to him, he's no victim (which makes him so much more likeable, I can't stand victims in BB) all Gary is doing is showing the riff raff for who they are and giving us characters like James who are brilliant villains, without making us feel awkward (imo). Never watched Dallas though.

Originally Posted by jet

I was like that with Jim Davidson, whereas with Helen I just hated her without any enjoyment.

Not gonna lie, Helen was a guilty pleasure, she was brilliant to watch (in a kind of laugh at them way) but had her moments where she was likeable! She was an actual bully in the first few weeks though.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..yeah I think that's it as well, it's because Gary is so laid back and doesn't get involved in 'house politics' and a lot washes over him ...on the whole I think he's enjoying himself ..(although very confused sometimes....)..so it's a bit more of a 'fun to hate' situation...James is the JR Ewing of CBB.....

I liked JR.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by jaxie

I liked JR.

Spoiler:

..so did I/he was my favourite character......

..and I would like James to stay until the end although I'm now thinking about what Jet said and maybe the house dynamics would take on a different interest if he were to go...

[jet]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..it's a good word and fairly much covers his personality so it's now officially a BB word anyway.....hmmmm, I understand what you're saying..I think BB with the HL shows create much less of a balance than they used to so there is more of a 'villain and victim' type thing/storyline and James in this show is being portrayed as the 'villain' and will endlessly be talked about...?....I don't think Gary is a 'victim' though as such but just being subjected to a general group intolerance thing and being treated meanly, almost as if he's 'less than'/not respected at all as a person..?....I think that might be because there are things about him that are extremely annoying to live with as well which I understand but with someone else, another housemate, they would maybe have been handled with more patience and tolerance because Gary is just not liked or 'popular'...I find that interesting..(and worrying..)..that empathy is lost for someone if it's someone who is quite unpopular..?...


..I'm not sure James is fascinated with Gary, I don't see any interest there in him at all...he isn't interested in anything Gary has to say or any of his thoughts/beliefs etc...I think James has to feel 'important' ..has to prove himself somehow and it's interesting that the two people he has clashed with most in the house are the most 'vulnerable' with Gary and his impairment which causes him to become frustrating to the other housemates..?..so someone James can easily very much feel importance over by 'feeding' the dislike of the other housemates by constantly criticising Gary because he knows his actions and words will have 'popularity' with the others..therefore enforcing his feeling of 'Alpha' by treating Gary badly but yet also being the one to occasionally do things for him, which he constantly then points out so all are aware including Gary himself...

..and then there is also Audley, who is very much an 'Alpha' figure and by his size as well as his personality so James has 'preened his feathers' there and told him quite early on how he's not scared of him......(he will be really otherwise he would be dumb/have you seen the size of Audley...)..but he has to 'prove' outwardly to the others (and viewers..) that he isn't...it's so important for him to be the 'leader'/the Alpha...?...he has to tell us all and the housemates that he's intelligent/top of his game etc a real leader..?......interesting....also very insecure because he's the least comfortable with who he is than any of them I think...also interesting that (I think), he was fine with Kellie until more and more of Kellie's 'male' emerged in her aggression as well...maybe then started seeing her as a challenge to his 'Alpha'...?....

..maybe his relationship with Gary also started the way it did because he originally saw Gary is an Alpha but then it wasn't so, so he became the 'old alpha' that Gary didn't have much respect for but had to throw scraps of kindness to now and again....


..I'm making it up as I go along.....

Some thoughts that were prompted by what you posted Ammi...

I wonder WHY Gary is disliked by so many. If he was behaving like he did on some other shows, then I could sort of understand it more, but he seems very amiable and tolerant, though I suspect he is winding them up to some extent. I don't think it's to do with his hearing either, because if they liked him they would make more of an effort surely...so we have to accept to some degree that Gary isn't easy to relate or annoys most of them, though that doesn't excuse in any way their behaviour towards him ...and of course he's the most intriguing HM in there by a long way which is great for us viewers.

James: He has said several times that Gary fascinates him and I've seen him looking at him sometimes with complete bemusement as if he's trying to get inside his head to get the answer to the puzzle lol
I think he has probably been mocked for being a dancer all his life and he isn't sure enough about his own masculinity to be able to brush it off. Now, I'm not thinking he's gay, because everyone has a right to self - identify and I don't think he is anyway. I just think whatever mocking he has had probably in his younger years makes him need to be seen as an alpha male and he has a naturally big ego which has currently taken a severe bruising with being dismissed from Strictly.

He's not a very inward looking person that examines his own behaviour but instead sees other people as the problem and not himself. Maybe Gary wasn't what he is now in his 30's either....James certainly has a lot of evolving to do but I'm fairly sure he isn't as bad in real life as the lovely Ola has been married to him for 9 years and happily by all accounts, so being in the BB house is probably bringing out his insecurities and showing him at his very worst....I don't like what I'm seeing of him in there, but he's an interesting HM....

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by jet

Some thoughts that were prompted by what you posted Ammi...

I wonder WHY Gary is disliked by so many. If he was behaving like he did on some other shows, then I could sort of understand it more, but he seems very amiable and tolerant, though I suspect he is winding them up to some extent. I don't think it's to do with his hearing either, because if they liked him they would make more of an effort surely...so we have to accept to some degree that Gary isn't easy to relate or annoys most of them, though that doesn't excuse in any way their behaviour towards him ...and of course he's the most intriguing HM in there by a long way which is great for us viewers.

James: He has said several times that Gary fascinates him and I've seen him looking at him sometimes with complete bemusement as if he's trying to get inside his head to get the answer to the puzzle lol
I think he has probably been mocked for being a dancer all his life and he isn't sure enough about his own masculinity to be able to brush it off. Now, I'm not thinking he's gay, because everyone has a right to self - identify and I don't think he is anyway. I just think whatever mocking he has had probably in his younger years makes him need to be seen as an alpha male and he has a naturally big ego which has currently taken a severe bruising with being dismissed from Strictly.

He's not a very inward looking person that examines his own behaviour but instead sees other people as the problem and not himself. Maybe Gary wasn't what he is now in his 30's either....James certainly has a lot of evolving to do but I'm fairly sure he isn't as bad in real life as the lovely Ola has been married to him for 9 years and happily by all accounts, so being in the BB house is probably bringing out his insecurities and showing him at his very worst....I don't like what I'm seeing of him in there, but he's an interesting HM....

...hmmm I think as well it’s interesting how Frenchy is with Gary because she’s probably one of the most difficult housemates for him to understand with her accent and how quickly she talks... and she often doesn’t look directly at him when she speaks/ has to repeat herself several times yet seems much less frustrated or irritated than the other housemates are...but I think maybe that’s because she does like him more or he bothers her in other ways much less ...for Stephanie, I think she’s a germaphobe, I read somewhere...so I think his hygiene and probably things like talking while he’s eating are things she hates....?..with Dee she seemed more tolerant at first but I think they’re just complete opposites in the things they like to converse about to the point that she finds him annoying...with Leslie, he felt Gary was rude and ‘butted’ in which he probably does because he has difficulties with different levels of conversations and voices going on and multiple conversations etc..so there are probably all in all lots of things that would annoy about living with him and in a confined environment like that when there are no feelings of friendship toward him in the first place, I think it all must build into intense dislike...part of it is just sniping and mocking him as well..I think these things can often just become an acceptable ‘pastime’ but are building up negative feelings toward that person all the time...so yeah, I think it probably has been hard to find a level of relating to him but it’s become a ‘pack’ thing in how intolerant they’ve been with him ..it’s seemed ok to them because it’s Gary and no one particularly bonds with Gary so few have questioned it...it’s how they’ve become used to thinking about him and treating him and it hasn’t been on a level of him being even ‘equal’ I don’t think, let alone making any allowances for his hearing impairment .. there have though been some occasions of patience and help with him as well, I agree...it’s just that when they’ve happened, they’re are almost thrown back at him immediately with ...’look what I did for you/no one else spent that time....and you didn’t say thank you..’..do they always say thank you..we all should, we know but sometimes it doesn’t always happen ..so more intolerances with their ‘help’....anyway yeah I just think for several reasons a dislike of one person can build up but it’s nothing they intentionally do and certainly don’t mean to offend .....


..with James..?..yeah I did think about him maybe having a ‘crisis’ in his career and possibly personally as well because of the loss of his place on Strictly ..he does seem to feel the need to ‘prove himself’...and it was interesting he said he didn’t care what anyone else/the public thought so long as Ola was proud of him and Ola felt he had behaved well and was ok with how he had been in the house...hmmm, I’m sure I’ve heard him talk about things/values he has and was brought up to believe in ...basic politeness/respect etc so maybe it’s Ola he’s trying to ‘prove’ something to and not the public or the housemates but that he feels a sense of not being a ‘provider/protector’ atm with his loss of work..(I don’t know if he has anything else/other opportunities going on with that..)...but maybe he feels generally in life a bit ‘demasculinised’ ..?...his ‘fascination’ with Gary, could be that he sees Gary as a very masculine guy but very at ease with it, very laid back..?...maybe that’s what he would like to feel but doesn’t atm....


...I don’t know really....I tend to overthink and analyse things and my OH would just say..don’t think about it, he’s just an idiot...or some such similar word....

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Josy

I don't think he should be warned. What would the warning be for anyway, being a grade A tosser?

Nah Gary can handle him.