[arista]

Told you Joey


http://www.thisislancashire.co.uk/ne...fects_to_UKIP/



More to come

[joeysteele]

A 'former' Labour Mayor, hardly the prize catch like the one of an MP,(as has ocurred twice with the Conservatives), or even a potential MP standing as a current candidate.

When an MP defects,I may have more interest and I still don't see that happening at all.

[arista]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

A 'former' Labour Mayor, hardly the prize catch like the one of an MP,(as has ocurred twice with the Conservatives), or even a potential MP standing as a current candidate.

When an MP defects,I may have more interest and I still don't see that happening at all.

Sure Joey not a MP
but soon

[kirklancaster]

I am not surprised, nor by his very telling reasons for defecting.

I was challenged on here when I said that immigration above all other issues is what is troubling the great British public and that such is the reason that Farage is attracting support because the Tories are impotent on the subject and Labour have been ordered not to even talk about it.

Well, it is no surprise that this 25 year veteran Labour politician lives in one of the most densely populated immigrant locations outside of London, and that he cites the very same immigration/multiculturism/terrorist issues as I have stated concerns about, as his reasons for defecting.

[Livia]

Local politicians are just as important as national politicians. It's not just disgruntled Tories who are defecting and the blame for this has to be laid squarely at the feet of Labour, the Tories and to some degree the LibDems who have taken it in turns to **** up monumentally

[GiRTh]

A couple of quotes from the ex Mayor.

I believe that Ukip is now the party of the working class.

It caused the development of parallel communities by the promotion of multiculturalism.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Great news

more to come

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

A couple of quotes from the ex Mayor.

get real

ITS HAPPENING

[joeysteele]

I would prefer no one to defect to UKIP, and further help them and give publicity to them with their also exaggerrated claims as to immigration.
Always talking about hundreds of millions of people who can come to the UK while not expressing only a tiny proportion will in fact do so.

That kind of nonsense and scaremongering is not 'responsible' politics.

I actually agree with Livia that all the main parties have made a mess of dealing with immigration, that is why I wish it was removed from the political football scenario it holds at present.
That a concensus between the 2/3 main parties as to a firm but fair immmigration policy becomes the norm and is allowed continuity ,no matter what colour govt. gets elected.

However,the claim has always been that Labour MPs will defect and I see no likelihood of that happening, not to UKIP, there is nothing at all about UKIP that the general Labour voter or Labour politician should, in my view, be comfortable with.
Indeed there is nothing there either for the many decent Conservative MPs too.

So again, no, I am not going to worry at this local politician and former mayor defecting to UKIP, I dare bet in fact that the Conservative party wish instead of 2 of its MPs defecting to UKIP,that in fact only 2 councillors or former Mayors had.

All UKIP can do is bang on about immigration, making it sound ugly and a main contribution to anything that goes wrong in the UK.
That is a false representation as to immigration in my view and it is time UKIP were exposed for the dangers they will bring to many in society were they ever to get any great foothold in Westminster.

Scapegoating should not be any part of decent politics, it is time all the main parties, admitted great mistakes they have all made, Labour in their 13 years in power and now this Coalition failing to reach anything like the targets they themselves set.
So for goodness sake Cameron and Miliband realise neither of you have the right idea as to this issue on your own and work things out better.

Set out to ignore UKIP, who can only use immigration to frighten and divide Briton against immigrant.
A truly shocking way to behave for any party in the 21st century in the UK.

Both the main parties and their leaders should stop being frightened by UKIP and take them on,exposing every rotten thing about them and as to what likely the bulk of them really think and want to see done too.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I would prefer no one to defect to UKIP, and further help them and give publicity to them with their also exaggerrated claims as to immigration.
Always talking about hundreds of millions of people who can come to the UK while not expressing only a tiny proportion will in fact do so.

That kind of nonsense and scaremongering is not 'responsible' politics.

I actually agree with Livia that all the main parties have made a mess of dealing with immigration, that is why I wish it was removed from the political football scenario it holds at present.
That a concensus between the 2/3 main parties as to a firm but fair immmigration policy becomes the norm and is allowed continuity ,no matter what colour govt. gets elected.

However,the claim has always been that Labour MPs will defect and I see no likelihood of that happening, not to UKIP, there is nothing at all about UKIP that the general Labour voter or Labour politician should, in my view, be comfortable with.
Indeed there is nothing there either for the many decent Conservative MPs too.

So again, no, I am not going to worry at this local politician and former mayor defecting to UKIP, I dare bet in fact that the Conservative party wish instead of 2 of its MPs defecting to UKIP,that in fact only 2 councillors or former Mayors had.

All UKIP can do is bang on about immigration, making it sound ugly and a main contribution to anything that goes wrong in the UK.
That is a false representation as to immigration in my view and it is time UKIP were exposed for the dangers they will bring to many in society were they ever to get any great foothold in Westminster.

Scapegoating should not be any part of decent politics, it is time all the main parties, admitted great mistakes they have all made, Labour in their 13 years in power and now this Coalition failing to reach anything like the targets they themselves set.
So for goodness sake Cameron and Miliband realise neither of you have the right idea as to this issue on your own and work things out better.

Set out to ignore UKIP, who can only use immigration to frighten and divide Briton against immigrant.
A truly shocking way to behave for any party in the 21st century in the UK.

Both the main parties and their leaders should stop being frightened by UKIP and take them on,exposing every rotten thing about them and as to what likely the bulk of them really think and want to see done too.

Preach

[the truth]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I would prefer no one to defect to UKIP, and further help them and give publicity to them with their also exaggerrated claims as to immigration.
Always talking about hundreds of millions of people who can come to the UK while not expressing only a tiny proportion will in fact do so.

That kind of nonsense and scaremongering is not 'responsible' politics.

I actually agree with Livia that all the main parties have made a mess of dealing with immigration, that is why I wish it was removed from the political football scenario it holds at present.
That a concensus between the 2/3 main parties as to a firm but fair immmigration policy becomes the norm and is allowed continuity ,no matter what colour govt. gets elected.

However,the claim has always been that Labour MPs will defect and I see no likelihood of that happening, not to UKIP, there is nothing at all about UKIP that the general Labour voter or Labour politician should, in my view, be comfortable with.
Indeed there is nothing there either for the many decent Conservative MPs too.

So again, no, I am not going to worry at this local politician and former mayor defecting to UKIP, I dare bet in fact that the Conservative party wish instead of 2 of its MPs defecting to UKIP,that in fact only 2 councillors or former Mayors had.

All UKIP can do is bang on about immigration, making it sound ugly and a main contribution to anything that goes wrong in the UK.
That is a false representation as to immigration in my view and it is time UKIP were exposed for the dangers they will bring to many in society were they ever to get any great foothold in Westminster.

Scapegoating should not be any part of decent politics, it is time all the main parties, admitted great mistakes they have all made, Labour in their 13 years in power and now this Coalition failing to reach anything like the targets they themselves set.
So for goodness sake Cameron and Miliband realise neither of you have the right idea as to this issue on your own and work things out better.

Set out to ignore UKIP, who can only use immigration to frighten and divide Briton against immigrant.
A truly shocking way to behave for any party in the 21st century in the UK.

Both the main parties and their leaders should stop being frightened by UKIP and take them on,exposing every rotten thing about them and as to what likely the bulk of them really think and want to see done too.

where are your FACTS? WHEN YOU WRONGLY CLAIM UKIP EXAGGERATE IMMIGRATION? would YOU put a numbers limit or are you too ducking the question like these spineless politicians? ukip exist simply to illustrate the failure of all parties. when the parties finally address the problems honestly with long term policies then ukip will gladly disappear. they know theyre not a long term party. farage has said so. hes here to shake things up in the uk and in europe and hes doing a fantastic job of it too

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

where are your FACTS? WHEN YOU WRONGLY CLAIM UKIP EXAGGERATE IMMIGRATION? would YOU put a numbers limit or are you too ducking the question like these spineless politicians? ukip exist simply to illustrate the failure of all parties. when the parties finally address the problems honestly with long term policies then ukip will gladly disappear. they know theyre not a long term party. farage has said so. hes here to shake things up in the uk and in europe and hes doing a fantastic job of it too

If you want facts go find them, taking the word of some fly by night party isn't wise is it?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by ArchAngel

If you want facts go find them, taking the word of some fly by night party isn't wise is it?

i know the facts you clearly dont

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

i know the facts you clearly dont

Good for you.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by ArchAngel

Good for you.

bad for you

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by the truth

where are your FACTS? WHEN YOU WRONGLY CLAIM UKIP EXAGGERATE IMMIGRATION? would YOU put a numbers limit or are you too ducking the question like these spineless politicians? ukip exist simply to illustrate the failure of all parties. when the parties finally address the problems honestly with long term policies then ukip will gladly disappear. they know theyre not a long term party. farage has said so. hes here to shake things up in the uk and in europe and hes doing a fantastic job of it too

What are you on about, there is a fact in my post, that they harp on about the hundreds of millions than can now come to the UK but never stress the 'fact' that only a very tiny proportion will in fact likely do so.

They always exaggerrate the worst and impossible scenario, as if all those people living in those EU countries would ever,the whole lot of them, jump up and move to the UK.

Nigel Farage made that same statement again on a recent Question Time and was challenged on that point that not all of those people he was saying could come would.
He never backtracks and sticks to that scaremongering and frightening over exaggerration of a ridiculous statement.

A number cannot be put on the flow of immigration from the EU,also more to the point, if we were not in the EU and still wanted the best trading agreements with them, we would still have to allow free movement of EU citizens,or likely not get that trade agreement.
That is another fact that UKIP brush aside.

I am not a politician, I myself feel immigration works overall good for the UK as I am sure the British who go into the EU countries, aslo overall benefit those Countries.
I think it wrong to debate immigration in a negative sense all the time as UKIP set out to do.
The failures of Labour and the Conservatives as to immigration have allowed UKIP to make strides as to the issue but they are not really telling the truth about it and because of that, those who have genuine concerns as to immigration are being 'led' by UKIP to see immigration as the enemy of the UK and one of the reasons the UK is doing badly.

That is the problem, the way UKIP discuss immigration makes it near impossible for the truth as to how it really overall benefits the UK,not getting stressed and made known to those listening.
So people get a distorted representation of the issue by UKIP, then we get the other 2 main parties, seemingly trying to outdo UKIP as to it and no one gets anywhere in the end.
Which is why I would prefer to see immigration removed form the political arena and have at least the 2 main parties come up with a policy they both would implement and stick to.

Then afterwards, get the debate as to immigration into and out of the UK back onto a positive footing and not be led by UKIPs scaremongering as to the issue.

That is my view, I am not a politician but if you think UKIP don't over exaggerrate the numbers they are saying will come here then I don't get that at all.
To listen to UKIP you would think all the peoples of the World and likely everything else in it was hellbent on coming to take over the UK.

However to end on a positive note, I agree with you in your last paragraph as to UKIP shaking things up, I agree the main parties have failed as to calming concerns as to immigration due to their failures.
As for UKIP being not a long term party,I think that was the case but I think it will continue.
It will be a very long road to any even possible EU exit, I cannot see big business in the UK supporting leaving the EU.
UKIPs aim is for that to happen,there will be no referendum on the EU in the next 5 to 10 years that I can see, so UKIP will be around a good while yet.

I also would say that Nigel Farage does get though to people where the other 2 leaders currently seemingly cannot.
However it is what he is getting through to people with that worries me, if his arguments were balanced with the positives and negatives that would be fine.
Going about the 'negatives only'all the time, distorts the debate and the sensitive issue in question.
That is what I dislike about UKIP.

I agree wholly however, he and UKIP have shaken things up and made the main parties take notice of this issue.
For me, separately they cannot come up with a good immigration policy, they need to do that together to ensure stabilty and continuity of policy when either of them are in power or lead the Government of the day.

In answer to your question then, no I would not put a numbers limit on immigration because we cannot in all reality, however that doesn't mean that other things cannot be looked at as to how we encourage and guide immigration to the UK by responsible and positive debate and negotiation.

UKIP has been given a massive boost from this govt. due to it failing in a massive way to have immigration in the tens of thousands rather than hundreds of thousands.
That was folly on David Cameron's part and extremely poor leadership to ever even suggest he could do that and that failure, along with the heavy failures of the previous Labour govt too, to deal with said issue, has allowed UKIP to set the agenda.
Setting the agenda however does not eman winning the argument,I hope the 2 main party leaders see that and hopefully come together with a sensible immigration policy,if not before the election then for sure very soon afterwards.

I think that will need a new leader of the Conservatives to do that however as I don't see David Cameron as a concensus politician at all.

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I would prefer no one to defect to UKIP, and further help them and give publicity to them with their also exaggerrated claims as to immigration.
Always talking about hundreds of millions of people who can come to the UK while not expressing only a tiny proportion will in fact do so.

That kind of nonsense and scaremongering is not 'responsible' politics.

I actually agree with Livia that all the main parties have made a mess of dealing with immigration, that is why I wish it was removed from the political football scenario it holds at present.
That a concensus between the 2/3 main parties as to a firm but fair immmigration policy becomes the norm and is allowed continuity ,no matter what colour govt. gets elected.

However,the claim has always been that Labour MPs will defect and I see no likelihood of that happening, not to UKIP, there is nothing at all about UKIP that the general Labour voter or Labour politician should, in my view, be comfortable with.
Indeed there is nothing there either for the many decent Conservative MPs too.

So again, no, I am not going to worry at this local politician and former mayor defecting to UKIP, I dare bet in fact that the Conservative party wish instead of 2 of its MPs defecting to UKIP,that in fact only 2 councillors or former Mayors had.

All UKIP can do is bang on about immigration, making it sound ugly and a main contribution to anything that goes wrong in the UK.
That is a false representation as to immigration in my view and it is time UKIP were exposed for the dangers they will bring to many in society were they ever to get any great foothold in Westminster.

Scapegoating should not be any part of decent politics, it is time all the main parties, admitted great mistakes they have all made, Labour in their 13 years in power and now this Coalition failing to reach anything like the targets they themselves set.
So for goodness sake Cameron and Miliband realise neither of you have the right idea as to this issue on your own and work things out better.

Set out to ignore UKIP, who can only use immigration to frighten and divide Briton against immigrant.
A truly shocking way to behave for any party in the 21st century in the UK.

Both the main parties and their leaders should stop being frightened by UKIP and take them on,exposing every rotten thing about them and as to what likely the bulk of them really think and want to see done too.

No ... Sorry but uncontrolled immigration is happening and has been happening for years now, just go outside and have a look.

People are not just making this up, it is a real problem , one that has been created by successive govts chasing ever increasing growth.

UKIP are saying enough STOP , that is why people are voting for them.

This is a situation created by the mainstream parties and they wonder now how they have lost our support...????

I hope UKIP can force the major parties to rethink their destructive immigration policies.



.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I would prefer no one to defect to UKIP, and further help them and give publicity to them with their also exaggerrated claims as to immigration.
Always talking about hundreds of millions of people who can come to the UK while not expressing only a tiny proportion will in fact do so./snip

So according to you joey immigration control is not an issue in the UK?

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

No ... Sorry but uncontrolled immigration is happening and has been happening for years now, just go outside and have a look.

People are not just making this up, it is a real problem , one that has been created by successive govts chasing ever increasing growth.

UKIP are saying enough STOP , that is why people are voting for them.

This is a situation created by the mainstream parties and they wonder now how they have lost our support...????

I hope UKIP can force the major parties to rethink their destructive immigration policies.

.

More truth and wisdom.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Scrooge

So according to you joey immigration control is not an issue in the UK?

Now don't twist my words,I have never said that,I outline heavily that a sensible and reasoned debate needs to be had as to immigration and a fair and solid policy as to it that will have stability and continuity.
Of course people are concerned as to numbers coming into the Country but you don't deal with that by scaremongering and throwing out figures of ridiculous size as to the problem.

I feel immigration has been made an issue in the UK in part by the manipulation of those in UKIP and the Conservatives presenting it as a likely large part of the UKs ills.

I prefer to look at plus and minus on everything and there are many positives to immigration to the UK,although from UKIP all we get are the negatives.

I am surprised at your cheaper point at me that you tried to make however LT, as to indicate I thought immigration was not an issue in the UK.
You do me a great disservice there trying that one.

I would not be advocating any immigration policy at all if I thought immigration was not an issue in the UK, so that blows your cheap attempt to 'try' to make me look daft right out the window.

I just believe no one party has the right answer and it is an issue that needs careful consideration and planning from all the main parties particularly.
My view is that immigration does not need to be gone about in the hostile and negative way that UKIP deal with it and also the way the other 2 main parties are now joining the 'bandwagon'.

So the answer to your question that was answered anyway by my wanting a reasoned well planned immigration policy, is 'not so, yes,I do think it is an issue'.
However I would like to see a policy as to it that includes more sensitivity and good reasoning behind any policy as to it.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Now don't twist my words,I have never said that,I outline heavily that a sensible and reasoned debate needs to be had as to immigration and a fair and solid policy as to it that will have stability and continuity.
Of course people are concerned as to numbers coming into the Country but you don't deal with that by scaremongering and throwing out figures of ridiculous size as to the problem.

I feel immigration has been made an issue in the UK in part by the manipulation of those in UKIP and the Conservatives presenting it as a likely large part of the UKs ills.

I prefer to look at plus and minus on everything and there are many positives to immigration to the UK,although from UKIP all we get are the negatives.

I am surprised at your cheaper point at me that you tried to make however LT, as to indicate I thought immigration was not an issue in the UK.
You do me a great disservice there trying that one.

I would not be advocating any immigration policy at all if I thought immigration was not an issue in the UK, so that blows your cheap attempt to 'try' to make me look daft right out the window.

I just believe no one party has the right answer and it is an issue that needs careful consideration and planning from all the main parties particularly.
My view is that immigration does not need to be gone about in the hostile and negative way that UKIP deal with it and also the way the other 2 main parties are now joining the 'bandwagon'.

So the answer to your question that was answered anyway by my wanting a reasoned well planned immigration policy, is 'not so, yes,I do think it is an issue'.
However I would like to see a policy as to it that includes more sensitivity and good reasoning behind any policy as to it.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Now don't twist my words,I have never said that,I outline heavily that a sensible and reasoned debate needs to be had as to immigration and a fair and solid policy as to it that will have stability and continuity.
Of course people are concerned as to numbers coming into the Country but you don't deal with that by scaremongering and throwing out figures of ridiculous size as to the problem.

I feel immigration has been made an issue in the UK in part by the manipulation of those in UKIP and the Conservatives presenting it as a likely large part of the UKs ills.

I prefer to look at plus and minus on everything and there are many positives to immigration to the UK,although from UKIP all we get are the negatives.

I am surprised at your cheaper point at me that you tried to make however LT, as to indicate I thought immigration was not an issue in the UK.
You do me a great disservice there trying that one.

I would not be advocating any immigration policy at all if I thought immigration was not an issue in the UK, so that blows your cheap attempt to 'try' to make me look daft right out the window.

I just believe no one party has the right answer and it is an issue that needs careful consideration and planning from all the main parties particularly.
My view is that immigration does not need to be gone about in the hostile and negative way that UKIP deal with it and also the way the other 2 main parties are now joining the 'bandwagon'.

So the answer to your question that was answered anyway by my wanting a reasoned well planned immigration policy, is 'not so, yes,I do think it is an issue'.
However I would like to see a policy as to it that includes more sensitivity and good reasoning behind any policy as to it.

You keep slurring UKIP "hostile and negative" policy but I have never seen Nigels Farage be this way. Where is your evidence for this constant negative attack on UKIP?

"Always talking about hundreds of millions of people who can come to the UK while not expressing only a tiny proportion will in fact do so."

?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

What are you on about, there is a fact in my post, that they harp on about the hundreds of millions than can now come to the UK but never stress the 'fact' that only a very tiny proportion will in fact likely do so.

They always exaggerrate the worst and impossible scenario, as if all those people living in those EU countries would ever,the whole lot of them, jump up and move to the UK.

Nigel Farage made that same statement again on a recent Question Time and was challenged on that point that not all of those people he was saying could come would.
He never backtracks and sticks to that scaremongering and frightening over exaggerration of a ridiculous statement.

A number cannot be put on the flow of immigration from the EU,also more to the point, if we were not in the EU and still wanted the best trading agreements with them, we would still have to allow free movement of EU citizens,or likely not get that trade agreement.
That is another fact that UKIP brush aside.

I am not a politician, I myself feel immigration works overall good for the UK as I am sure the British who go into the EU countries, aslo overall benefit those Countries.
I think it wrong to debate immigration in a negative sense all the time as UKIP set out to do.
The failures of Labour and the Conservatives as to immigration have allowed UKIP to make strides as to the issue but they are not really telling the truth about it and because of that, those who have genuine concerns as to immigration are being 'led' by UKIP to see immigration as the enemy of the UK and one of the reasons the UK is doing badly.

That is the problem, the way UKIP discuss immigration makes it near impossible for the truth as to how it really overall benefits the UK,not getting stressed and made known to those listening.
So people get a distorted representation of the issue by UKIP, then we get the other 2 main parties, seemingly trying to outdo UKIP as to it and no one gets anywhere in the end.
Which is why I would prefer to see immigration removed form the political arena and have at least the 2 main parties come up with a policy they both would implement and stick to.

Then afterwards, get the debate as to immigration into and out of the UK back onto a positive footing and not be led by UKIPs scaremongering as to the issue.

That is my view, I am not a politician but if you think UKIP don't over exaggerrate the numbers they are saying will come here then I don't get that at all.
To listen to UKIP you would think all the peoples of the World and likely everything else in it was hellbent on coming to take over the UK.

However to end on a positive note, I agree with you in your last paragraph as to UKIP shaking things up, I agree the main parties have failed as to calming concerns as to immigration due to their failures.
As for UKIP being not a long term party,I think that was the case but I think it will continue.
It will be a very long road to any even possible EU exit, I cannot see big business in the UK supporting leaving the EU.
UKIPs aim is for that to happen,there will be no referendum on the EU in the next 5 to 10 years that I can see, so UKIP will be around a good while yet.

I also would say that Nigel Farage does get though to people where the other 2 leaders currently seemingly cannot.
However it is what he is getting through to people with that worries me, if his arguments were balanced with the positives and negatives that would be fine.
Going about the 'negatives only'all the time, distorts the debate and the sensitive issue in question.
That is what I dislike about UKIP.

I agree wholly however, he and UKIP have shaken things up and made the main parties take notice of this issue.
For me, separately they cannot come up with a good immigration policy, they need to do that together to ensure stabilty and continuity of policy when either of them are in power or lead the Government of the day.

In answer to your question then, no I would not put a numbers limit on immigration because we cannot in all reality, however that doesn't mean that other things cannot be looked at as to how we encourage and guide immigration to the UK by responsible and positive debate and negotiation.

UKIP has been given a massive boost from this govt. due to it failing in a massive way to have immigration in the tens of thousands rather than hundreds of thousands.
That was folly on David Cameron's part and extremely poor leadership to ever even suggest he could do that and that failure, along with the heavy failures of the previous Labour govt too, to deal with said issue, has allowed UKIP to set the agenda.
Setting the agenda however does not eman winning the argument,I hope the 2 main party leaders see that and hopefully come together with a sensible immigration policy,if not before the election then for sure very soon afterwards.

I think that will need a new leader of the Conservatives to do that however as I don't see David Cameron as a concensus politician at all.

biased negative drivel lacking all facts
firslty ukip and farage and constantly acknowledged the massive benefits from immigration AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN, YOUVE JUST CHOSEN TO IGNORE THAT IN ORDER TO TRY AND PAINT HIM A BIGOT. THATS PLAIN NASTY DISINGENUOUS POLITICS.

the numbers need to be controlled, you also need to curtail illegal immigration with 1 million+ illlegal immigrants estimated to be in the Uk

farage has said those fleeing persecution etc should be allowed in. but we need checks and balances, this country is falling apart. mainly due to new labours disastrous policies. bankrupting the nation, deregulating banks, wateful billions on nhs administrators, vanity projects, wasteful government departments, uncontrolled housing bubble, failure to sanction the city crooks, fialing to collect corporate taxes etc etc

3600 new european laws in 4 years? ruining all businesses, especially smaller ones, destroying job creation putting unbelievable pressure on all employers.

587 page unreadable european constitution of endless laws
8 million population increase in 20 years?
exploitation of the benefit system
umpteen european countries bankrupt

FACTS. THESE ARE THE FACTS now more and more countries are allowed to come here and there are more due soon...

we need a points system , a limit on numbers, we need to calculate how much NET imigration our country and and our entire system and structures can afford ...this is how ALL OTHER WESTERN DEMOCRACIES OPERATE AND NO ONE CALLS THAT RACIST?

[Crimson Dynamo]

Its seems to be a bandwagon that people are on to just repeat stuff about ukip (mainly re immigration) but having never read or listen to what UKIP say.

Farage constantly says that immigration is needed but needs to be controlled

So lazy people just say "ooh he hates immigrants"

its so boring now, so old

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Scrooge

Its seems to be a bandwagon that people are on to just repeat stuff about ukip (mainly re immigration) but having never read or listen to what UKIP say.

Farage constantly says that immigration is needed but needs to be controlled

So lazy people just say "ooh he hates immigrants"

its so boring now, so old

Yeah. Poor Ukip.