[the truth]

Rather sad story this about the cricket uber legend ian beefy botham. a man who like many other kids of my generation, was probably my biggest childhood hero.

The man has raised tens of millions for children with leukemia by walking 1000s of miles over 30 years....in addition he was of course the greatest English cricketer of all time..A game I happen to believe is the greatest game on God's earth

However having read his autobiography called "don't tell kath" it appears the great man is something of a flawed hero...in it he talks a lot about the press always trying to entrap him with women and do kiss and tells....and he is always innocent

only a few years after the book is released, beefy is caught having an affair....on piers morgan he admitted he hadn't been a great dad or husband

Now in the past few years we find beefy said he couldn't go and visit his dad who had altzheimers in his last few years and told the rest of the family to stop visiting him and to try and remember him as he was.

He said: ‘I might sound brutal, but I’m just being honest. Unless you’ve watched a loved one being ravaged by this disease, you can’t understand how horrendous it is. I didn’t want my memory of him to be distorted by the illness that robbed him of himself.’

‘There was no point going to see him because he got no comfort from it; he didn’t know who he was never mind who I was

He only realised how serious his father’s condition was on the green at Yeovil Golf Club.


‘My dad seemed fine, but as he stood over the ball, he turned to me and asked “What do I do now?” with genuine bafflement,’ he said.


‘The man taught me to play golf when I was three, but he had forgotten how to play it.’


Sir Ian added: ‘My dad would have been mortified if he had known what sort of humiliation lay ahead.


‘He would have thrown himself off a cliff rather than end up the way he did.’



I helped look after my own dad for 8 years with this dreadful condition and whilst it was heartbreaking it was also rewarding and there were many great moments too. moments of clarity where it was like the good old days. Funnily enough the longer term memory remained pretty good so we could talk about the old stories..and yes he DID recognise me and he did light up and laugh about many things we always found funny and yes he still loved cricket and he still loved his animals....without getting too maudlin , he had a small kitten on his bed 24 hours a day at the end....this little tomcat wouldn't leave the bed, I kid you not....he gave him great comfort and better company than anyone else

I couldn't have done what beefy did, but is it wrong to judge him? were all different, these traumatic things come to us all, so how do we deal with them?


One in 14 Britons over the age of 65 and one in six people over 80 years of age now suffers from some form of dementia.

[joeysteele]

People react to alzheimers in different way,this illness is one of the cruellest there is because it not only removes from the person all they had and knew.
It also leaves those that love them and even need them at times too, powerless and lost as as they realise the person no longer has any idea they are even connected to them in any way.

However, I would still want to see them for the main reason I would always know who they are and what they meant to me,so in that context only they would remain the same person.
Not easy, heartbreaking to do but I would still want to do it and visit them and often too.

This is for me,I would never dream to tell or judge anyone else as to how they should cope with a loved one with alzheimers.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

People react to alzheimers in different way,this illness is one of the cruellest there is because it not only removes from the person all they had and knew.
It also leaves those that love them and even need them at times too, powerless and lost as as they realise the person no longer has any idea they are even connected to them in any way.

However, I would still want to see them for the main reason I would always know who they are and what they meant to me,so in that context only they would remain the same person.
Not easy, heartbreaking to do but I would still want to do it and visit them and often too.

This is for me,I would never dream to tell or judge anyone else as to how they should cope with a loved one with alzheimers.

They say the last thing that leaves you is your hearing

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by the truth

They say the last thing that leaves you is your hearing

It is the most horrible illness to have,it robs the person of all the knowledge of how they ever were and what they had.
Devastating.

[Vicky.]

My gran had alzheimers, its an awful illness. everytime we went to visit her she would ask where my grandad was (he died like 20 years beforehand) and we had to watch the devastation over and over. Eventually my dad started telling her he had just nipped out and would be back later. She also screamed at my sister 'get away from my husband you brazen hussy' when my sis was cuddling my dad one time..

We cut down visits a lot after that as it was too upsetting, and honestly...she didn't know who we were anyway so it didn't upset her when we didn't go

[the truth]

If I hadn't looked after dad for those 8 years he would have died many years earlier. Youre constantly ringing the pharmacist, the doctor and keeping w atchful eye on the carers and nurses. if the family isn't seen to care, why would the medical people?

[arista]

Yes they have made a whole area
even with a shop - special for them to try with a relative
for people with Alzheimer with special nurses
in Europe and USA

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by the truth

If I hadn't looked after dad for those 8 years he would have died many years earlier. Youre constantly ringing the pharmacist, the doctor and keeping w atchful eye on the carers and nurses. if the family isn't seen to care, why would the medical people?

Full respect to you for looking after your Dad.
I do hope if I ever come across this in my family, I would really try to do the same.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Im going to see my dad tomoz. he will be asleep and unlikely will i be able to wake him, he has been like this for weeks now but I still chat away and read him the paper etc and I am sure he can hear me.

I can still see him and remember what it was like before and visit him. 5 years ago we went to the Open in St Andrews together and he was fine, now he is in a care home barely concious.

Thats life i guess.

[AnnieK]

My nan has just been diagnosed and seems to be deteriorating quickly. She lost her daughter (my mum) in December and I think that has accelerated the problem. She thinks we are all trying to rob her....at times she thinks my mum is still alive and is getting cross that she doesn't ring....she doesnt know who her partner is, she thinks he's just staying there. She knows me and my son but can't remember my brother. It's so sad...she is a very strong lady but has a lot of guilt issues over choices she made a long time ago and the loss of my mum seems to have broken her. Such a sad state and a cruel disease.

[joeysteele]

This is one of the really good things I love about tibb.

The posts on here particularly from the truth, who started this thread and his personal info as to his Dad and caring for him.
Then Vicky, LT and also AnnieKs' accounts too, things that have you stop and think and realise the trauma in such situations.

I can only admire all of you for how you have coped with it all,and thank you for sharing what is a really likely painful time for you, with us.

[Kazanne]

I will echo Joeys post,some of the posts here have made me quite emotional,I hope if this disease is ever a factor in my family,that I can be as strong and brave as you people here, I cannot imagine any of my family not knowing who I am,kudos to all of you who have had someone in your life suffer from this.

[smudgie]

Beefy was indeed a flawed man, however when it comes to him not seeing his father it is difficult to judge, if indeed we have any right to judge.
Personally I think it was selfish, or at least weak on his part, his father was ill, he abandoned him in his time of need.
I know from personal experience just how devastating and heartbreaking it is to watch a loved one ravaged by this cruel illness. My lovely mother-in-law suffered for a couple of years before her death. The fact that we could sit and hold her hand gave us more comfort than it probably gave her, but somewhere inside of her maybe she knew who we were or at least that someone cared.

[Vicky.]

It probably is selfish really, I know we didn't make the decision to cut back on visits for my grans sake above all else. Partly though, as she was getting distressed seeing a bunch of strangers walk into her room, then when she finally remembered us (or pretended too..I'm still not convinced she ever did, more acted that way as she thought that was what she was meant to do) being still all nervous and such..thinking my dad was her husband...it was just awful. But yeah, I didn't visit her again at all after a few times as when she 'remembered' me she seemed to HATE me..I didn't see what good it would do her and it was upsetting me badly. It was also severely distressing to hear her talk about ending her own life, which was pretty regular.

My dad kept visits to a minimum (once a week instead of every other day)

My sister didn't go back after being accused of hitting on my grans husband (her own dad ) either..even though it was explained to her that my gran didnt realize what she was saying and stuff...it upset her way too much.

But yeah,. it was entirely selfish really. I get that. I don't regret it though as now besides a few incidents I mainly remember her as the woman she was, not what the illness turned her into.

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

It probably is selfish really, I know we didn't make the decision to cut back on visits for my grans sake above all else. Partly though, as she was getting distressed seeing a bunch of strangers walk into her room, then when she finally remembered us (or pretended too..I'm still not convinced she ever did, more acted that way as she thought that was what she was meant to do) being still all nervous and such..thinking my dad was her husband...it was just awful. But yeah, I didn't visit her again at all after a few times as when she 'remembered' me she seemed to HATE me..I didn't see what good it would do her and it was upsetting me badly. It was also severely distressing to hear her talk about ending her own life, which was pretty regular.

My dad kept visits to a minimum (once a week instead of every other day)

My sister didn't go back after being accused of hitting on my grans husband (her own dad ) either..even though it was explained to her that my gran didnt realize what she was saying and stuff...it upset her way too much.

But yeah,. it was entirely selfish really. I get that. I don't regret it though as now besides a few incidents I mainly remember her as the woman she was, not what the illness turned her into.

I don't think it was entirely selfish at all Vicky.
Only the individual person can make the decision to visit or not, everyone's circumstances are different.
From what you have said above You did take your Gran into consideration, if the visits were distressing to her then what would be the point of visiting, especially if it upset everybody concerned.
We were very lucky that my MIL never turned against any of us, my son decided he would stop visiting after MIL asked who the boy was that had been sat talking to her, it cut him up no end.
We all deal with these things differently, I just thought it looked so cruel when Beefy said he did not visit his dad for the last few years and didn't want his family to, because he wanted to remember him in the good days of his life, the thing we found was that after it is all over you do end up remembering the good times anyway.
Such a cruel illness that affects so many people.

[the truth]

Every situation is different , every relationship is different. We all have different responsibilities and capabilities and theres a lot of other factors....I work from home so I was able to make the time to look after dad. It was incredible how many small details get overlooked constantly and how much you have to be on top of things. Medication especially, keeping the bed clean etc If I wasn't rest assured he would have passed many years before. I don't say that in a self congratulatory way, its just the truth. Underpaid overworked often very poorly prepared Carers would often miss something, a soreness especially. Nurses would rush in and out, on a few occasions nurses attempted to have the care taken away by carrying out a "review" when myself nor my mother were present. Id have to constantly ensure they turned him over and tried to get them to hoist him out of the bed more often. again trying to get carers and occupational therapists to hoist him from bed was exhausting in itself, they found endless excuses not to bother. Not once in 8 years did one carer, nurses, therapist suggest lets get him out of bed in his wheelchair and out of the house. Meanwhile battling the trust endlessly threatening to take his care away with their phoney reviews.

I have to admit that lack of empathy for a man locked away for 8 years will disturb me for the rest of my life and has caused me to become more cynical. The system itself was the biggest culprit. The nhs trust were beyond a nightmare to deal with, simply put they are heartless liars.

Despite all this it was worth it and I recommend looking after your parent at home if you can. There was endless fun and chat. strolling down memory lane and enjoying the test matches together. But beneath all of the politics, despite their Machiavellian nonsense, nothing would ever distract from the simple fact,he was my hero. He was my best mate, my biggest support and harshest critic and no one made me laugh harder. he was the most genuine, sincere, loyal person Ive ever met. I cannot even begin to verbalise how much I loved and respected him. So for me there wasn't even a choice. If he didn't remember me one day or was agitated with me or shouted at me, to me it was relatively trivial distractions, though many friends and relatives used that as excuse not to bother visiting him anymore. Frankly hell could have frozen over, the world could have gone up in smoke, NOTHING ON EARTH would dissuade me from to the fact I was with him all the way to the end of the line.

[Vicky.]

Yeah my gran actually moved in with my dad for over a year before he felt he had no choice but to put her in a home where she could be cared for 24/7. Through the night she was trying to cook, nearly starting fires, hiding food under her bed, and eventually was caught (luckily) trying to drink bleach at 3am :S Its unrealistic to be able to care for someone 24 hours a day..especially when you and your wife both do long shifts, and short of locking her in her bedroom on a night...which is disgusting, there was no other option.

[Ammi]

...wow, some stories ...no truth, I don't think that Ian Botham should be judged and no Vicky, I don't think that it was selfish with your gran...this is something quite personal to me as well with my mum...you know, when my dad died and I looked at his face laying there, I knew with complete certainty that it wasn't my dad laying there, everything that was him was gone and this was just an 'empty shell' that had held him through his living years...(I think, for me anyway..)...that I see that same emptiness with my mum, that she isn't here anymore or is slipping away and feel the same grief as if her body was still, like his...and we all grieve differently/there is no formula or 'right thing' there so it will be different for all of us...

...anyways, not to dwell...truth I found this a little while ago on the internet, something an Alzheimer's patient wrote and put on the door of their hospital room and it is just so it for me and I wanted to share it with you...





...although you try to have us believe otherwise sometimes....truth, I think that you're a pretty terrific guy.....

[user104658]

Slightly different, but my gran on my mum's side suffered a brain injury after being hit by a car when she was in her late 70's. Her condition deteriorated over a few months from being completely herself to having no idea where she was or who the people around her were, thought she was on a boat at sea, things like that. Both of my parents were top grade nurses, my mum mostly in care of the elderly and my dad in mental health, so they decided to take the time off work and care for her in our home as she deteriorated and eventually died a couple of months later.

The experience is almost certainly what pushed my own mother over the edge into major anxiety issues, depression, full blown alcoholism along with multiple antidepressants and other pills, which eventually caused her own death (and a really horrible one, I'll be honest) aged just 59.

So I think it has to be down to the individual. If you are the sort of person who can handle that sort of sustained stress and responsibility without wrecking yourself and you think someone (them, or you) will benefit from spending those final days together then yes that's admirable. Some people simply can't and my answer would have to be that, no, you can't derail your own life or your own mental health for a dying parent.