[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Greg!

As a mere man I won't give my opinion on this, but out of interest Livia, do you think someone can really be a feminist if they don't support a woman's right to choose?

That's true, it's pretty much impossible to find a way for a pro lifer to also be a feminist without having to admit to having hypocritical views on the issue. Feminism is about equality and women's rights, Pro life is about taking a woman's right to choose away.

You can't really reconcile those opposing view points.

[Vicky.]

I would say Shane is a feminist ally indeed. But drag is a bit...dodgy. Not so much in Shanes style (to be honest I had never seen drag queens who try to look like actual women) but all of the drag round here is basically getting dressed up as a pantomime dame and taking the piss out of women. I don't personally find it offensive, but I can see why some others do.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I think it's silly to take the act of drag as some sort of attack against women, I think a lot of gay/bi men tend to empathise and fiercely support feminism because they understand what it's like to be discriminated against, it's not the same kind of discrimination but there's an overlap in understanding there. I think it's stupid to demonise allies or pretend that their opinion is somehow worth less, it goes against the whole idea of feminism to think so, in fact.

The article is quite dumb simply because the comparison of blackface and drag is just dumb in general and shows a lack of understanding of what Drag is.

I do find it hilarious though, Brillo, that you, in all your hatred towards PC culture, has linked and is arguing for an article written by hardcore PC person that is looking for reasons to be offended. The irony is beautiful.

Hatred is your word not mine. You can label me all you like trying to make a point but it isn’t so because you say so. It is merely your biased opinion. Enjoy.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Greg!

As a mere man I won't give my opinion on this, but out of interest Livia, do you think someone can really be a feminist if they don't support a woman's right to choose?

I don't think someone can truly be a feminist if they do not support a womans ownership over her own body. its not so much the 'choose' part, though I get that this is semantics really. I feel modern day feminism has been a bit..bastardized into 'any choice a woman makes is a feminist choice, as a woman chose it!' when to be honest I do not subscribe to this new notion of 'sex positive liberal feminism'. It seems to me that liberal feminism is mainly about making men happy. Obviously making men happy is not a bad thing, but its not what feminism should be about for me and honestly, near all lib fems I know spend their time going on about how prostitution is such an empowering job, and stuff like that

[Vicky.]

Also as a side note, I ****ing love Meghan Murphy.

Why is it understood that the appropriation of a marginalized ethnicity, race or culture is facilitated by white privilege and that it’s offensive, but not that the same arguments could be applied to a group of men (who benefit from male privilege) who appropriate femininity as a form of entertainment?

And this does give me food for thought if I am honest.

As I said, I am not personally offended by drag (possibly as I spend so much time on the gay scene so see it a LOT) but I can definitely see why others may be. And yes, I can understand the blackface arguments also in a way

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Hatred is your word not mine. You can label me all you like trying to make a point but it isn’t so because you say so. It is merely your biased opinion. Enjoy.

....I didn't mention anything about hatred nor did I label you at any point in that post?

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I don't think someone can truly be a feminist if they do not support a womans ownership over her own body. its not so much the 'choose' part, though I get that this is semantics really. I feel modern day feminism has been a bit..bastardized into 'any choice a woman makes is a feminist choice, as a woman chose it!' when to be honest I do not subscribe to this new notion of 'sex positive liberal feminism'. It seems to me that liberal feminism is mainly about making men happy. Obviously making men happy is not a bad thing, but its not what feminism should be about for me and honestly, near all lib fems I know spend their time going on about how prostitution is such an empowering job, and stuff like that

I agree with you about a woman's ownership over her body and her right to choose but I will say I can also see the view that the child is alive and the other side of the coin. I've been pregnant and felt that life moving in my body. Personally I could never have an abortion.

Also we have lots of contraceptive options nowadays and I think that should be encouraged more.

[Crimson Dynamo]

In a future war between the gays and the feminists I will side with the women

Essentially they have the numbers and will wipe the gays out in minutes

then the men can make peace with the woman and we can live in harmony, but keeping an eye on them and their warring ways

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by jaxie

I agree with you about a woman's ownership over her body and her right to choose but I will say I can also see the view that the child is alive and the other side of the coin. I've been pregnant and felt that life moving in my body. Personally I could never have an abortion.

Also we have lots of contraceptive options nowadays and I think that should be encouraged more.

Oh I can definitely see that view, don't get me wrong. I had an abortion when I was much much younger and I know I could not bring myself to do it now that I have actually gone through pregnancies and had children. I did used to see it as a bunch of cells, and tbh at the stage I had one it WAS just a bunch of cells, certainly not a baby. But I just cannot equate being 'pro-life' with feminism. It may be possible to be against abortion (for everyone, not just for yourself) and be a feminist, but I do not see how.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I’m not anti abortion - never have been so don’t start making things up. I will put you on ignore now as I won’t rise to your tactics today.

Just looked, not anti-abortion, just very open to lowering the cutoff point an abortion can be had. Super feminismy, tell us more.

[bots]

In simplistic terms a man can be a feminist, but only at a superficial, supportive level. So being blunt, Courtney's support of feminism is superficial, because by definition, he can't be anything more

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

Just looked, not anti-abortion, just very open to lowering the cutoff point an abortion can be had. Super feminismy, tell us more.

Its a hard balancing act though. I am pro-choice but at the stage where a baby could survive outside of the womb I do think the cutoff point should be before that. You seem to think not? Given this post? When do you think it should be? I have seen some feminists say the only acceptable feminist opinion on this is that abortion should be available right up to term, which I absolutely cannot agree with no matter how 'pro-woman' I am.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Its a hard balancing act though. I am pro-choice but at the stage where a baby could survive outside of the womb I do think the cutoff point should be before that. You seem to think not? Given this post? When do you think it should be? I have seen some feminists say the only acceptable feminist opinion on this is that abortion should be available right up to term, which I absolutely cannot agree with no matter how 'pro-woman' I am.

Its really not up to me is where i stand. This was discussed in detail before, i cant go through it all right now.

I consider myself a feminist, and Shane J quite obviously is one too. I just cant have a person who wants to limit women's rights to dictate what does, and what doesnt constitute as feminism. Especially with an article like that as a backup. Its all just absurd.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

Just looked, not anti-abortion, just very open to lowering the cutoff point an abortion can be had. Super feminismy, tell us more.

Most people believe in a cut-off point - don’t try to backtrack now with your false allegations.

Btw I only unblocked you for this post because I wanted to see your justification for calling me an anti-abortionist. None then, as expected, just a weak attempted dress-up for jumping to conclusions. Back now.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

Its really not up to me is where i stand. This was discussed in detail before, i cant go through it all right now.

I consider myself a feminist, and Shane J quite obviously is one too. I just cant have a person who wants to limit women's rights to dictate what does, and what doesnt constitute as feminism. Especially with an article like that as a backup. Its all just absurd.

OK. Just your post came across as very snipey, and for seemingly no reason. Surely near all people believe there should be a cut off point somewhere for stuff like that. Not believing in abortion fullstop is very very different (and quite evil, if I am honest, extremely misogynistic either way) to thinking the cutoff age should be lowered I think.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Jack_

You know what I'm looking forward to? Pointing out to the 'mansplaining' complainers today (who, to be fair, do have a point to a certain extent - I'm aware of the irony here btw!) every instance in future in which they pass judgement and comment on an instance of social exclusion or discrimination that they would have no experience of. Because it'll definitely happen.

At least you are honest Jack.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Shane put up with Andrews woman hating becuase basically he wanted to suck his cock

he is a disgusting example of what women have to put up with

[Smithy]

Originally Posted by Livia

As soon as feminism is mentioned, in come the males, telling us what feminism is. Feminism isn't men posting on the subject, quite dismissively. That may be news to some men.

Please, go ahead and tell me what feminism is then, because according to you the dictionary definition isn’t quite correct