[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...what if we all had a nut allergy, though...

Fight the nut?

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Fight the nut?

...you fight the nut...if you fall, I will cashew......

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

It's not all about you. Understanding the world is about looking outside of your own experiences.

Sure, but very few perspectives should hold words and violence at the same level.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Sure, but very few perspectives should hold words and violence at the same level.

Nobody said it should but judging the level of someone else's abuse off a low level abuse you think you can handle is a nonsensical comparison.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Nobody said it should but judging the level of someone else's abuse off a low level abuse you think you can handle is a nonsensical comparison.

If he's man enough to slug out an old man, he's man enough to ignore nasty words.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

If he's man enough to slug out an old man, he's man enough to ignore nasty words.

That wasn't the point I responded to. I responded to your claim that he should deal with racism because of a hypothetical scenario of a completely different situation involving yourself, which is not comparable.

Someone else's experience isn't void just because you live a completely different life.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

That wasn't the point I responded to. I responded to your claim that he should deal with racism because of a hypothetical scenario of a completely different situation involving yourself, which is not comparable.

Someone else's experience isn't void just because you live a completely different life.

I don't know what kind of life he leads, his life could be almost identical to mine

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I watched both of the time stamps you gave and a good chunk of the rest. I do think the video is interesting and thought provoking though I'm not sure it's entirely relevant? It's talking about political violence. Hand on heart, do you think the incident in the OP video is an example of the type of political violence being discussed in that video?

No, but I don’t think it’s beyond the realms of possibility that this man has either directly or indirectly been exposed to and influenced by racist ideology. And while an old man sitting on a bus may not be “building fascism” per se, it’s this kind of insidious (and yet direct) racism which mustn’t be left unchallenged.

If I’m being honest, do I think punching him was necessary? Probably not. Do I understand why they did? Yes. Do I particularly care that’s the course of action they chose? No, not really. I shared the video more because I noticed the “all violence is bad and never acceptable” argument cropping up, and thought it was relevant to illustrate that that argument is founded on a lot of false equivalences. I think it’s an interesting topic in its own right.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

If he's man enough to slug out an old man, he's man enough to ignore nasty words.

Let's face it they attacked because they knew he was old a weak. It was a cowardly attack.

[GiRTh]

As usual on this forum.

I love the way the onus is always on the black person to calm the situation. . If this man is going to walk around talking like that on the streets then he needs to know that quite a few people are going to object to what he's saying and those people will react in different ways. Violence is never the answer, but do we try and council this man if he is abusing us.? Do you really think counselling and re-education will help this man? The words he use make me think he's already quite far down a certain path.

I’m waiting for the – Maybe he was mortified when he went home and regretted his words. So many trying everything they can to defend him but talk like that and people are not going to like it; so maybe he should review his own approach to these situations.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

As usual on this forum.



I love the way the onus is always on the black person to calm the situation. . If this man is going to walk around talking like that on the streets then he needs to know that quite a few people are going to object to what he's saying and those people will react in different ways. Violence is never the answer, but do we try and council this man if he is abusing us.? Do you really think counselling and re-education will help this man? The words he use make me think he's already quite far down a certain path.



I’m waiting for the – Maybe he was mortified when he went home and regretted his words. So many trying everything they can to defend him but talk like that and people are not going to like it; so maybe he should review his own approach to these situations.

You're right, let's hope he gets a brain bleed and dies eh. These guys definitely won't face charges because, after all, any reasonable judge would see that there was no real choice but to cave his skull in,it was unavoidable, and any reasonable person would have done the same.



Its not about giving a **** about an old racist man. It's about expecting or at least hoping for better from people regardless of the circumstances, or at least understanding that it wasn't the RIGHT course of action even if you can empathise with why it happened.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

You're right, let's hope he gets a brain bleed and dies eh. These guys definitely won't face charges because, after all, any reasonable judge would see that there was no real choice but to cave his skull in,it was unavoidable, and any reasonable person would have done the same.



Its not about giving a **** about an old racist man. It's about expecting or at least hoping for better from people regardless of the circumstances, or at least understanding that it wasn't the RIGHT course of action even if you can empathise with why it happened.

Your first paragraph is not what I said at all and I'm a bit surprised by you TBH TS you've taken it that way. What if I came up to Scotland and started chatting sh*t in Glasgow pubs? How long would I last and could I claim that those nasty people shouldnt resort to violence? The argument would be made that I was quite aware of what I was saying and how it would be construed.

Second paragraph is laughable. How long you been on this forum? 'Hoping for better from people'

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

As usual on this forum.

I love the way the onus is always on the black person to calm the situation. .

The onus is on every person to control themselves and not throw their fists around.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

The onus is on every person to control themselves and not throw their fists around.

The onus on people is to conduct themselves with dignity at all times. DIdnt see much dignity from this man

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

The onus on people is to conduct themselves with dignity at all times. DIdnt see much dignity from this man

Doesn't mean others need to sink to his level.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Doesn't mean others need to sink to his level.

And when he sinks to that level different people will react in different ways.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

And when he sinks to that level different people will react in different ways.

Sure, but that doesn't excuse violence.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

As usual on this forum.

I love the way the onus is always on the black person to calm the situation. . If this man is going to walk around talking like that on the streets then he needs to know that quite a few people are going to object to what he's saying and those people will react in different ways. Violence is never the answer, but do we try and council this man if he is abusing us.? Do you really think counselling and re-education will help this man? The words he use make me think he's already quite far down a certain path.

I’m waiting for the – Maybe he was mortified when he went home and regretted his words. So many trying everything they can to defend him but talk like that and people are not going to like it; so maybe he should review his own approach to these situations.

Jesus said..turn the other cheek

Wise words

[bots]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Jesus said..turn the other cheek

Wise words

LT quoting Jesus .... i've seen it all now

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

LT quoting Jesus .... i've seen it all now

It's when I quote slim that we know we are in the End Days

[user104658]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

Your first paragraph is not what I said at all and I'm a bit surprised by you TBH TS you've taken it that way. What if I came up to Scotland and started chatting sh*t in Glasgow pubs? How long would I last

Not long

and could I claim that those nasty people shouldnt resort to violence?

Yes. That is really the entire point.

The onus on people is to conduct themselves with dignity at all times. DIdnt see much dignity from this man

Exactly! The onus is on people to control themselves at all times. Not "Until someone else starts being a prick, then it all goes out the window and you can start throwing punches and it's fine". .

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Exactly! The onus is on people to control themselves at all times. Not "Until someone else starts being a prick, then it all goes out the window and you can start throwing punches and it's fine". .

And I suppose that would include not talking sh*t in front of people who may, if a person doesnt express themselves in a polite and respectful manner, take offence and in some cases, quite serious offence.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

And I suppose that would include not talking sh*t in front of people who may, if a person doesnt express themselves in a polite and respectful manner, take offence and in some cases, quite serious offence.

Taking "serious offence" is no more a justification for violence than falling wildly in unrequited love is an excuse for rape. Feelings don't excuse actions.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Taking "serious offence" is no more a justification for violence than falling wildly in unrequited love is an excuse for rape. Feelings don't excuse actions.

People react differently. We're not trained to deal with these situations. However, it would be nice if these situations never occured in the first place.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

And I suppose that would include not talking sh*t in front of people who may, if a person doesnt express themselves in a polite and respectful manner, take offence and in some cases, quite serious offence.

Yes but I haven't at any point tried to defend the racist old guy. Him being a piece of **** doesn't justify responding violently. Whether he was "asking for it", "should have expected it", even "deserved it" - all totally irrelevant to my opinion on whether they should have actually done it.