[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

"Being against the objectification and hypersexualisation of women is sexist! Saying that porn and prostitution is the prime example of objectification and commoditisation of women is actually denying them the right to choose a career!!!"

...shouted the fellowship of male TiBB members, in newly found harmony...

How the tables turn eh Liam . Don't worry, I was already aware that being a "SWERF" isn't au fait with the community.

Not sure you can compare walk on girls who are basically advertising the sponsor to porn and prostitution? what about models who sashay down the catwalk wearing Alexander McQueen would you compare that to porn and prostitution? what about models on TV adverts, again are they there to be drooled over by 60 somethings, I think you are over exaggerating the effect these women have on men tbh

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Not sure you can compare walk on girls who are basically advertising the sponsor to porn and prostitution? what about models who sashay down the catwalk wearing Alexander McQueen would you compare that to porn and prostitution? what about models on TV adverts, again are they there to be drooled over by 60 somethings, I think you are over exaggerating the effect these women have on men tbh

They're there to advertise the sponsor... William Hill... I mean if you can suggest how the two things are related?

But anyway yes lots of advertising is indeed exploitative (of all sorts of people and things). That would be a much bigger discussion. Fashion is a bit of a grey area but tbh again, I don't think the fashion industry holds up very well under a little scrutiny either. I mean... At least the porn industry doesn't require people to starve themselves on top of everything else.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Crimson Dynamo

yep, floundering around after being exposed

pathetic

I literally have zero interest in anything you have to say, Trumpet. You may continue to snipe from the sidelines, I'm not going to block you but I hand on heart promise that I'm not going to lower myself to engaging with you on any topic, ever. You revealed yourself to be worse than I actually thought during the England riots, if that's at all possible. It goes a bit beyond the usual forum nonsense really, doesn't it. You should be permanently banned. I'm going to pretend that you are. That shall be all.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

I literally have zero interest in anything you have to say, Trumpet. You may continue to snipe from the sidelines, I'm not going to block you but I hand on heart promise that I'm not going to lower myself to engaging with you on any topic, ever. You revealed yourself to be worse than I actually thought during the England riots, if that's at all possible. It goes a bit beyond the usual forum nonsense really, doesn't it. You should be permanently banned. I'm going to pretend that you are. That shall be all.

oh it hurts when you are the subject..

re-read the thread m8

its all on you

own it

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Livia

Because it gives the mistaken impression that people who look a certain way and dress in tight, skimpy clothes can be objectified because of the way they look. I would be horrified to see my daughter when she grows up, leered at by old men with a pint in their hand. To me, it's no different to a men following a young woman down the street, commenting and wolf whistling. Women are accomplished and multi-faceted, they're not here solely for the gratification of men.

I'm talking about the men in speedos.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Two completely different things surely walking down the street minding your own business and putting yourself in a situation where you are paid to do so? That said Darts currently have pom pom girls who dance on the stage as the players are walking on, no one pays them any attention, the audience are focussed on the Darts player they are like the warm up act at a gig, practically invisible, we really cant choose how women like to get paid because it doesnt suit us or we wouldnt want family members to do it, I think its as Parm said earlier more of a boost to the betting company who sponsor the event to give them more exposure as Darts audiences dont pay all that money to see women walking around in a dress given they could get much more free on pornhub or whatever, its the same argument as women only watch football to look at muscly men, just inane

Anyhoo I will be buying a blind fold for Mr C and will only remove it when play commences .....

I agree with most of this post.

The only part that I don't agree with, is I think that the Darts want the walk on girls back for "eye candy" reasons, and personally I don't see the issue with that reason.

In my personal view whether the Darts wants them or not doesn't affect my personal enjoyment of the Darts (my type tend to mostly be in the Music scene anyway) so I'm not really getting that much gratification out of having walk on girls in Darts personally.

But I also don't get the drama of women (or men if they were to ever do that equivalent) having an extra job opportunity? We're not an Islamic or Evangelical state.

[Alf]

Taylor Swift wears less on stage.

[Alf]

Sam Smith wears less than Swift.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by MTVN

I see both sides of the debate really. Fundamentally I think it's a pretty harmless practice and while it might be a bit sad and a bit pervy the reality is that you'll never be able to completely de-sexualise society. Saying that I don't think it's needed and it doesn't really add anything. I've almost never heard people lamenting the absence of walk on girls since they were scrapped

I think that I can understand your view tbh.

And I agree that it's not really needed.

[Alf]

Woman are such victims these days. I'm old enough to know and remember strong women. Not the fake strong of today. When they just say they're strong, but the reality is they have to be defended on nonsense things like this.

I blame the demise of humour.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

We'll agree to disagree there Mock; I think you're still (relatively?) young and that you realise that 50 year olds drooling over women in their 20's is not normal nor should it be socially acceptable, and I hope that the old gents on here arguing hard to the contrary doesn't give you the idea that it is normal. It is, in fact, normal to find people in your own age bracket more attractive than people young enough to be your own children.

But like I said I think you're still a relatively young man so it's not really possible to say how you'll see it when you're approaching middle age.

I hope for the best. Don't be like this lot .

I can accept that tbf.

I'm 28 at the moment, and I do kind of have my own cut off point for myself.

Like for me whilst I can find 16-18 year olds attractive, I would never actually enter a sexual encounter with someone in that age group.

Fair enough to anyone that's in my age group that is okay with that, but it's not for me.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

I agree with most of this post.

The only part that I don't agree with, is I think that the Darts want the walk on girls back for "eye candy" reasons, and personally I don't see the issue with that reason.

You don't see the issue with the concept of "eye candy" because you yourself enjoy it and you don't want to have to stop enjoying it, because you have no alternative frame of reference.

You might be a dad to girls one day and then I think (hope) you might see things differently, and when men your own age are drooling at girls your daughter's age, you might understand the issue.

Some dads still don't, unfortunately, but hey.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

You don't see the issue with the concept of "eye candy" because you yourself enjoy it and you don't want to have to stop enjoying it, because you have no alternative frame of reference.

You might be a dad to girls one day and then I think (hope) you might see things differently, and when men your own age are drooling at girls your daughter's age, you might understand the issue.

Some dads still don't, unfortunately, but hey.

Tbh I never pay the girls any attention at the men's Sporting events, and that's the truth.

Like I know that F1 I think have those flag girls before the race starts, and I honestly can't remember a single one of them.

[Alf]

We love eye candy.

As the Rolling Stones once said

"I see the girls go by dressed in their Summer clothes"

We don't try to stop you ogling Sam Smith, so give us the same courtesy and the World will be a more tolerant place.

Attempt to stop being intolerant if you can, for all our sakes, basically.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Alf

We love eye candy.

As the Rolling Stones once said

"I see the girls go by dressed in their Summer clothes"

We don't try to stop you ogling Sam Smith, so give us the same courtesy and the World will be a more tolerant place.

Attempt to stop being intolerant if you can, for all our sakes, basically.

Don't think I will stop being intolerant of slimey old geezers Alf, no.

By "all our sakes" I assume that's who you're referring to. The smelly old gits perving on young women who want to do it without judgement. Nah. I'm judging.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

You don't see the issue with the concept of "eye candy" because you yourself enjoy it and you don't want to have to stop enjoying it, because you have no alternative frame of reference.

You might be a dad to girls one day and then I think (hope) you might see things differently, and when men your own age are drooling at girls your daughter's age, you might understand the issue.

Some dads still don't, unfortunately, but hey.

Listen, they are not kids forever they grow and most start having sex in their late teens just like their parents did

All this focus on older men drooling over twenty’s something girls is bollox
Because those girls are more than likely sucking on a cock and as disgusting as it will to the fathers of those girls it’s no different to when the parents were at the same age

Sex is part of the human race

[user104658]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

Listen, they are not kids forever they grow and most start having sex in their late teens just like their parents did

All this focus on older men drooling over twenty’s something girls is bollox
Because those girls are more than likely sucking on a cock and as disgusting as it will to the fathers of those girls it’s no different to when the parents were at the same age

Sex is part of the human race

Once again, no one is being puritan about people enjoying sex, it's not the same thing as it being sold to sad old gits as a product/service. Obviously that's a reality of the human race too - but it's a bloody sad reality, and something being commonplace doesn't mean we have to accept it as normal.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

Once again, no one is being puritan about people enjoying sex, it's not the same thing as it being sold to sad old gits as a product/service. Obviously that's a reality of the human race too - but it's a bloody sad reality, and something being commonplace doesn't mean we have to accept it as normal.

You need to accept that being attracted to the opposite sex is part of being a human and that will never change

You can take it all round the houses , with it’s not this it’s that but it’s human nature

[Alf]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

You need to accept that being attracted to the opposite sex is part of being a human and that will never change

You can take it all round the houses , with it’s not this it’s that but it’s human nature

I'm not sure that he likes Human nature. He's borderline Communist.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Alf

I'm not sure that he likes Human nature. He's borderline Communist.

It’s a very unrealistic outlook by him when people are agreeing with you

[user104658]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

You need to accept that being attracted to the opposite sex is part of being a human and that will never change

You can take it all round the houses , with it’s not this it’s that but it’s human nature

Again that's not what's being discussed, there's no issue with human sexuality there is an issue with it being transactional and objectifying (mostly) women.

Originally Posted by Alf

I'm not sure that he likes Human nature. He's borderline Communist.

"That's not human nature, that's COMMUNISM!" is up there with your more bizarre statements Alf. Have you been studying Locke? Capitalism as human nature? I didn't take you for such a philospher. And American colonial philosophy at that. Maybe that part isn't surprising .

[user104658]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

It’s a very unrealistic outlook by him when people are agreeing with you

Apparently I've managed to unite every man on the forum under one banner of misogyny, even Liam joined in to fight for women's right to engage in sex work (because it's empowering, did you know).

It's quite heartwarming really. You could all go to the darts together and peek at some empowered ladies while they walk the men in. Liam can tell them they're empowered. Parmy can go to a business meeting with them. It'll be great.

[Kate!]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

Apparently I've managed to unite every man on the forum under one banner of misogyny, even Liam joined in to fight for women's right to engage in sex work (because it's empowering, did you know).

It's quite heartwarming really. You could all go to the darts together and peek at some empowered ladies while they walk the men in. Liam can tell them they're empowered. Parmy can go to a business meeting with them. It'll be great.

I'm actually with Quantum Boy on this issue.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

Don't think I will stop being intolerant of slimey old geezers Alf, no.

By "all our sakes" I assume that's who you're referring to. The smelly old gits perving on young women who want to do it without judgement. Nah. I'm judging.

Sorry what age are you 'smelly old gits', honestly you really haven't got a leg to stand on at this stage, women want to walk on stage promoting the sponsor wearing a dress, and gasp showing a bit of cleavage .... sorry Mr Victorian or should I call you Mr Burkah, but yeah its going to happen Walking around in a dress is not sex work....no matter how you twist it

[Liam-]

The man who doesn’t think women have the agency to control their own body and do the careers they want to do calls everyone else misogynists