[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Niall

Okay this might be long and slightly convoluted, but I'm going to try my best to explain myself.

Firstly, the Christian God is the God that I believe in. Its a belief thats deeply entrenched in me. I don't consider myself Catholic really even though I was raised as one because of their attitude to not only homosexuality, but a whole host of other issues (which I won't get into because if I did I'll be here all week ). But I do consider myself a Christian. I don't think at an omni-benevolent entity would create a group of people for the express purpose of their discrimination. Its just not logical.

I mean if you take the passage of the Bible which labels homosexuality a sin, it has to be taken with a pinch of salt as that was written over 2000 years ago. Its simply not relavent to todays society. Back then maybe, what with the high amounts of disease killing people (reproduction was a necessity, and homosexuality infringed upon that I guess). But now thats no longer the case. The same part of the Bible from where that passage is lifted, also contains a verse which says that wearing wool and cotton blended clothing is also an abomination. It also says its okay to sell your daughter into slavery, stone her if she's adulterous (I think). The list goes on. I just think its absurd to actively defend the passage pertaining to homosexuality, when the other things I mentioned are also written in the same part of the book.

So I do consider my self a Christian, but with a slightly reformed (I think thats the right word?) view on the Bible and the religion in general. I don't take the Bible literally, so I don't thing that my interpretation of Christianity would see homosexuality is immoral or sinful. There are several newer denominations of the religion that believe that too. It makes sense not to take the Bible literally.

Niall,I have to say what brilliant post, it is one of the most thought provoking posts I have read in the 2+years I have been on here.

One of my thoughts as to organised religion is that particularly Christianity,so called because Christians claim to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Taking the New Testament which is presented as devoted to his life and teachings, also removing from the New Testament the rather volatile opinions of Paul,who one day tells us to love one another and another is ranting against all sorts of things, I am sure his writings depended on what mood he got up in a morning.What we then find is one simple fact.

In all of the Gospels which are supposedly attributed solely to the life, words and teachings of Jesus, he himself in all those Gospels speaks about many things both new and from the Old Testament too but nowhere,anywhere, does he mention or condemn homosexuality.Not a single word.
It always amazes me that something he himself seems to have not deemed to give any instruction on or condemn whatsoever should be a basis for so much controversy in Christianity by the hierarchy of Christianity too.

Your post Niall is excellent, really well laid out and said.

[Urban Cragou]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Niall,I have to say what brilliant post, it is one of the most thought provoking posts I have read in the 2+years I have been on here.

One of my thoughts as to organised religion is that pariculary Christianity,so called because Christians claim to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Taking the New Testament which is presented as devoted to his life and teachings, also removing from the New Testament the rather volatile opinions of Paul,who one day tells us to love one another and another is ranting against all sorts of things, I am sure his writings depended on what mood he got up in a morning.What we then find is one simple fact.

In all of the Gospels which are supposedly attributed solely to the life, words and teachings of Jesus, he himself in all those Gospels speaks about many things both new and from the Old Testament too but nowhere,anywhere, does he mention or condemn homosexuality.Not a single word.
It always amazes me that something he himself seems to have not deemed to give any instruction on or condemn whatsoever should be a basis for so much controversy in Christianity by the hierarchy of Christianity too.

Your post Niall is excellent, really well laid out and said.

Exactly. You see, this is why I don't do religion, particularly not Christianity. A load of cack with rules and regulations that basically stops me from having a life.

I just find it funny that the Church is supposed to be a welcoming place, yet it said that homosexuality is a criminal offense and the person found in a relationship should be stoned to death, which totally contradicts one of its ten commandments, 'do not murder'.

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah, see that's the problem I have with organised religions in general, they're out dated and also man made. Religions have had a huge amount of power over people and I think they abused that power to make people do what they want and keep them in line. Personally I don't believe in a God but if there is one I don't see why you need a religion to believe in him properly. Anyway, I guess I'm going a bit off topic with this!

Oh I certainly agree with that. Organised religion has brought copious amounts of what it professes to stop: pain, corruption, greed etc. I think that religion just becomes evil and (ironically) sinful when its an institutionalised thing.

I also hate the self promoting nature of it. The people that irk me the most arre the ones that will try and mention their religion in every conversation. I just can't stand it.

I don't know I just think it should be a private and personal thing kinda.

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Niall,I have to say what brilliant post, it is one of the most thought provoking posts I have read in the 2+years I have been on here.

One of my thoughts as to organised religion is that particularly Christianity,so called because Christians claim to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Taking the New Testament which is presented as devoted to his life and teachings, also removing from the New Testament the rather volatile opinions of Paul,who one day tells us to love one another and another is ranting against all sorts of things, I am sure his writings depended on what mood he got up in a morning.What we then find is one simple fact.

In all of the Gospels which are supposedly attributed solely to the life, words and teachings of Jesus, he himself in all those Gospels speaks about many things both new and from the Old Testament too but nowhere,anywhere, does he mention or condemn homosexuality.Not a single word.
It always amazes me that something he himself seems to have not deemed to give any instruction on or condemn whatsoever should be a basis for so much controversy in Christianity by the hierarchy of Christianity too.

Your post Niall is excellent, really well laid out and said.

Thanks Joey. Thats so sweet of you to say.

But yeah, I totally agree with you. The latter half of your post in particular. I find it incredible that the Christian churches try and hold up that archaic rule, especially when you consider that all other rules from that region of the Bible were discarded for being backward and outdated long, long ago. Its insane.

Like Livia said though, things have changed an awful lot in the past century with regards to homosexuality (and sexuality in general), and the number of new denominations of the faith seing it as a natural and moral thing is encouraging. Change doesn't happen overnight I guess (no matter how much I'd like it to ).

[Urban Cragou]

Anyway, yeah, there are far more important things in the world than the wording of a title - it's not that bleeding special.

[Merry Mockmas]

Originally Posted by Redway

Exactly. You see, this is why I don't do religion, particularly not Christianity. A load of cack with rules and regulations that basically stops me from having a life.

I just find it funny that the Church is supposed to be a welcoming place, yet it said that homosexuality is a criminal offense and the person found in a relationship should be stoned to death, which totally contradicts one of its ten commandments, 'do not murder'.

That's why im not religious to the point of what you've just mentioned here, I just believe in a God and that's it, I do think religion has gone way to out of control as the leaders are very prejudicial towards anyone that's different to them, even though God says to love all living things (although I disagree with that as there's some right nutjobs out there) but that is another reason why I could never fanatically follow Christianity and any religion tbh.

Im sorry if the post is to long but I had alot to get off my chest.