[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Merry Kizzmas

Damn right I'm claiming the higher ground!
#NotInMyName

A difference of opinion does'nt by default make something "higher ground".

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

A difference of opinion does'nt by default make something "higher ground".

Oh I disagree, I don't have my conscience to fight with so I feel I'm already on at least firmer ground. If that is a bitter pill I make no excuses for illuminating the gulf between the two options.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Merry Kizzmas

Oh I disagree, I don't have my conscience to fight with so I feel I'm already on at least firmer ground. If that is a bitter pill I make no excuses for illuminating the gulf between the two options.

Only because you are not looking at both options thoroughly.You only see the negatives of bombing and not the negatives of letting IS carry on slaughtering people in the worst ways possible.I would say the latter option would make me fight with my conscience more.You see opinions don't equal 'higher ground'.We all have different opinions.

[Ammi]

..there is no high ground bcause there was never any to be taken in the first place, all there ever was and all there ever is, is a ...oh my opinion is better than your opinion/I'm right, you, you're wrong, I'm more informed than you are, catch yourself on, tat and tit and last word and look now are you happy there are civilians dead...while in fact, civilians are dead and no one is happy, why would they be, the very suggestion is absurd but still, the last words or the words continuing instead of showing some respect for those who are dead by ceasing these silly words ....you struggle to even be civil to each other or respectful/thoughtful of each other and yet you think that you have something to add in solutions of world conflicts...

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..there is no high ground bcause there was never any to be taken in the first place, all there ever was and all there ever is, is a ...oh my opinion is better than your opinion/I'm right, you, you're wrong, I'm more informed than you are, catch yourself on, tat and tit and last word and look now are you happy there are civilians dead...while in fact, civilians are dead and no one is happy, why would they be, the very suggestion is absurd but still, the last words or the words continuing instead of showing some respect for those who are dead by ceasing these silly words ....you struggle to even be civil to each other or respectful/thoughtful of each other and yet you think that you have something to add in solutions of world conflicts...

Higher ground has been taken by some Ammi, I have been made to feel less than comfortable often on here even by those who think it ridiculous as to being against the air strikes.
I wavered and still wavered and have had pacifist thrown at me, what would you do, when I don't know as if their way was the only way.

Even on here and off too, some took the line the PM did with his obscene comment as to voting against being terrorist sympathisers..The claps given to those defending that statement were telling.

I have always said, I was in a dilemma on this as I think most should be, however it has been the case of not perhaps crowing but more jubilation shown from those who supported the action,while ridiculing and interrogating those after the voter was passed as to what they would do, sit around the table with IS for instance not to mention the unsavoury digs to Corbyn on this.

So sorry to disagree that some have not jumped into taking the higher moral ground on this but I think you will find that has been the case.

I could answer with well wait until all the deaths that will come about and then blame the action for them if I wanted to take the moral high ground,however that is what would be really sickening to do.

Equally however I am not going to clap the action being taken either.
I agree there should be no moral high ground to take but equally there should be no condemnation, ridiculing and interrogation of those against or for the action either.
It is a dilemma,a real one and people I think are more likely to be undecided rather than for or against either position.

[Jamie89]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..there is no high ground bcause there was never any to be taken in the first place, all there ever was and all there ever is, is a ...oh my opinion is better than your opinion/I'm right, you, you're wrong, I'm more informed than you are, catch yourself on, tat and tit and last word and look now are you happy there are civilians dead...while in fact, civilians are dead and no one is happy, why would they be, the very suggestion is absurd but still, the last words or the words continuing instead of showing some respect for those who are dead by ceasing these silly words ....you struggle to even be civil to each other or respectful/thoughtful of each other and yet you think that you have something to add in solutions of world conflicts...

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

Only because you are not looking at both options thoroughly.You only see the negatives of bombing and not the negatives of letting IS carry on slaughtering people in the worst ways possible.I would say the latter option would make me fight with my conscience more.You see opinions don't equal 'higher ground'.We all have different opinions.

You attempt to justify it any which way you like, don't presume I haven't thought about the issue thoroughly thankyou.
I could quite as easily reverse that and suggest that those who supported airstrikes didn't think of the ramifications in enough detail couldn't I?
All the lofty idealists that were shouting down it was the right thing to do do not appear to be shouting as loud and from as high.... therefore it is my opinion that the balance has shifted.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Merry Kizzmas

You attempt to justify it any which way you like, don't presume I haven't thought about the issue thoroughly thankyou.
I could quite as easily reverse that and suggest that those who supported airstrikes didn't think of the ramifications in enough detail couldn't I?
All the lofty idealists that were shouting down it was the right thing to do do not appear to be shouting as loud and from as high.... therefore it is my opinion that the balance has shifted.

But you apparently are'nt 'fighting with your conscience' over the issue.Something which the MP's who had to make this decision had to do.
The fact that you are not 'fighting with your conscience' suggests that you are only looking at it from one perspective.You only see 'bombing bad' when in actual fact both options have horrible consequences.It is not a black and white issue and has to be thought about a little more indepth than that.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

But you apparently are'nt 'fighting with your conscience' over the issue.Something which the MP's who had to make this decision had to do.
The fact that you are not 'fighting with your conscience' suggests that you are only looking at it from one perspective.You only see 'bombing bad' when in actual fact both options have horrible consequences.It is not a black and white issue and has to be thought about a little more indepth than that.

Hmm. Bombing has thus far had observable and tragic horrible consequences and so far zero observable positive effects. Come back when these supposed benefits have actually materialised and we can talk about the moral grey areas. Thus far, these "positives to bombing" are pure hypothesis.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Toy Santa

Hmm. Bombing has thus far had observable and tragic horrible consequences and so far zero observable positive effects. Come back when these supposed benefits have actually materialised and we can talk about the moral grey areas. Thus far, these "positives to bombing" are pure hypothesis.

If any of the terrorists in question have been killed and any of their income supplies have been stopped then i would say those are the positives thus far.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

But you apparently are'nt 'fighting with your conscience' over the issue.Something which the MP's who had to make this decision had to do.
The fact that you are not 'fighting with your conscience' suggests that you are only looking at it from one perspective.You only see 'bombing bad' when in actual fact both options have horrible consequences.It is not a black and white issue and has to be thought about a little more indepth than that.

Again, don't presume I haven't thought about the issue thoroughly thankyou.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Merry Kizzmas

Again, don't presume I haven't thought about the issue thoroughly thankyou.

Hey i'm just going by what you've written in your posts.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

Only because you are not looking at both options thoroughly.You only see the negatives of bombing and not the negatives of letting IS carry on slaughtering people in the worst ways possible.I would say the latter option would make me fight with my conscience more.You see opinions don't equal 'higher ground'.We all have different opinions.

I could not agree more. Well said.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Sorry mate but this whole paragraph is a 'pot kettle black' post.

I'd be real interested to know why you think bombing Syria will work Johnny? From where I'm sitting, there's a lot of winduppery going on whilst not saying very much at all, at least nothing that can be focussed on or debated with.

What's the long term plan of this bombing campaign against ISIS? How do we know when we've got them all and at what stage is it safe enough to pull out? Indeed, can we ever pull out or is this going to be another 10 year invasion?

Kizzy doesn't need defending but when I see you, the person who recently started a thread so that you could ask an unanswerable question with the full intention of mocking and patronizing any reasonable answers, trying to patronise and segregate a person who so often brings so much thought and debatable issues to a forum group; it takes every inch of me to hold back and not insult you.

Hey nay worries I never respond to posts like that, that's what the report button is for.