[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Not yet,there are still people missing in there,surely the blame game can wait .

I notice you had no problem with LT mentioning immigration earlier in the thread, though. Funny that.

[lime]

Originally Posted by Brother Leon

Incredibly sad. I've spent the whole day from about 4am volunteering and making constant runs to Sainsbury's to bring stuff that may be needed with my Fiancé and her sister. Hearing the screams and children being thrown will stay with me forever though.

The spirit shown was real heartwarming though. The last hour or so has slightly changed and there seems more anger around and people taking it out on each other, but on the whole the heart shown has been amazing.

We personally know someone that lives there, but him and his girlfriend in a panic decided to ignore the advice to stay where they are and ran down when it started to look bad. So lucky.

[JTM45]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Not yet,there are still people missing in there,surely the blame game can wait .

The residents and people from the community are discussing it so it's nothing to do with a blame 'game' at all. It's about the people who have been affected by this want some accountability.

These people, some of whom still have relatives and friends missing, are angry that they're finding out that the authorities and ministers were given recomendations about installing sprinkler systems four years ago and they've done nothing!

[Cherie]

17 now dead

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Cherie

17 now dead

I was thinking maybe those fireladders like they have in New York would be helpful on high rise buildings ,I am hearing now there were no smoke alarms going off !!

[DouglasS]

I feel so bad for these people its awful, I can't imagine what they felt being trapped in the building waiting for help that never came

[smudgie]

Absolutely tragic.
No hope of finding anybody else alive now.

[DemolitionRed]

These tower blocks act like chimneys in a fire. Fire will of travelled up the lift shafts, the stairs and the rubbish shoots.

Another thing is double glazing. Because fire searches for oxygen and doesn't have as much oxygen to fuel it in a double glazed building, it works its way upwards much quicker than it would otherwise. People above the fire opening windows would of been another reason for the fire spreading so quickly.

A thank you to BL for doing your bit in these tragic circumstances.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

I was thinking maybe those fireladders like they have in New York would be helpful on high rise buildings ,I am hearing now there were no smoke alarms going off !!

its the nature of the fire. As it seems to have travelled up the outside of the building the standard fire prevention/alert mechanisms weren't so effective. Also it spread so quickly that it couldn't be contained sufficiently quickly enough. In typical circumstances each apartment "should" be its own isolated zone. Whatever interfered with that should be looked into quickly along with how it spread so quickly up the outside, although that has received a lot of attention already.

[arista]

Dogs to go in today , with the Fire Crew
should help locate bodies

[Crimson Dynamo]

Surely by now we must know how many are dead. Relatives will know now if a loved one is a resident and they have not heard from them in the last 24 hours etc?

[Vanessa]

Two Italians are among the missing. Hope they managed to escape. Such a tragedy, I feel for everyone involved.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I notice you had no problem with LT mentioning immigration earlier in the thread, though. Funny that.

what has that got to do with blaming a political party for the tragedy

in any way shape or form?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

what has that got to do with blaming a political party for the tragedy

in any way shape or form?

In the way, shape and form that you were making it blatantly political.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

In the way, shape and form that you were making it blatantly political.

My point, as you know, was that it would make finding out who was dead/in there more difficult. Illegal immigrants are here due to all political parties (save say UKIP) not one. Its a logistics point. I am sorry that you think an illegal immigrant is some political badge, that is your prejudice

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

My point, as you know, was that it would make finding out who was dead/in there more difficult. Illegal immigrants are here due to all political parties (save say UKIP) not one. Its a logistics point. I am sorry that you think an illegal immigrant is some political badge, that is your prejudice

Indeed I'm sorry and I do 100% believe that there was nothing more to it than that. You only brought up illegal immigrants as a logistics point. Obviously.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Indeed I'm sorry and I do 100% believe that there was nothing more to it than that. You only brought up illegal immigrants as a logistics point. Obviously.

It is and if in that block there was a lot of subletting then finding out how many have died will be much more difficult - especially if it goes down to dental records..

[Tom4784]

They need to look at Tower Blocks across the map and make sure they are all up to code because there's almost certainly gonna be more companies that are cutting corners on safety and prevention.

[smudgie]

I think it is going to be very difficult to put an exact figure on fatalities.
People could have been visiting family, staying over or on holiday.
I don't really know the possibility of checking dental records, a fire burning so long at that intensity could diminish this possibility.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I know the block well by sight and used to drink all around there when i worked at the BBC in white city

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by smudgie

I think it is going to be very difficult to put an exact figure on fatalities.
People could have been visiting family, staying over or on holiday.
I don't really know the possibility of checking dental records, a fire burning so long at that intensity could diminish this possibility.

Wouldn't the landlord/council have a tenents list,that would help as for any other people in there visitors etc,that could be difficult

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

They need to look at Tower Blocks across the map and make sure they are all up to code because there's almost certainly gonna be more companies that are cutting corners on safety and prevention.

Definitely.
From the look of it, the first thing would be to strip all this fascia that appears to be the cause of the speed the fire spread.
No good spending nearly £10 million tarting a tower block up when there were so many other issues and safety features that could have been improved on.
Perhaps the fire exit availability also needs to be looked at, in normal circumstances a fire can be better contained, therefore the procedure is to stay in your own flat unless in obvious danger from a spread of the fire, unfortunately this fire was mainly spread from the outside and had no chance of being under control.
Take away the risk of it happening again from the outside of the building and then create external escape exits from every floor.
One fire exit can't work, the fire brigade have to use the same stairwell to gain access and with so many people needing to vacate the building at the same time it is catastrophic.
A sprinkle system should be made law, surely it would make a massive difference to the possibility of surviving a fire.

[Vanessa]

Firefighters are still working on the fire. Month end news now

[Vanessa]

It's nice to see the community coming together after this tragedy. Heartwarming.

[Crimson Dynamo]

DM hinting now at "hundreds dead"