[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

It's a bit sluggish tbf

Yeah also not as many shelling out on it as a sport

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Just noticed Ascot is about to take place,some guys dressed in silly clothes ,with a whip,riding a horse round a track in this heat,riding it for all it's worth,until some die of injuries or exhaustion,in my eyes it,nearly on a par with foxhunting,dog racing,bullfighting etc,my question is WHY is it so popular ? it's as cruel as other animal sports in my book,but people dressing up and getting excited about it is not nice to see,why do you think this is different to other animal sports where the animals are in danger? I know I will be called all sorts and unpopular but I feel strongly about it so thought I would ask why I am ready for the onslaught

It's shameful in this day and age and it should be completely outlawed. I have to say I didn't feel much in the way of sympathy for the matador that recently died - he had more than a fighting chance which is more than can be said for the poor bull.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It's shameful in this day and age and it should be completely outlawed. I have to say I didn't feel much in the way of sympathy for the matador that recently died - he had more than a fighting chance which is more than can be said for the poor bull.

I agree brillo,I saw them on the news dressed up and sipping champaign,what idiots they look,surely all the money that is put into this and similar events,could go to something much more worthy and needed,(like animal sanctuaries etc)those poor horses running in this heat,just why cant people be entertained and enjoy themselves without the need for an animals life to be at risk.I know it is not intentional,but these people know as well as we do fatalities happen all the time,as for the matador,no sympathy from me at all,but felt sorry for the bull.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

I agree brillo,I saw them on the news dressed up and sipping champaign,what idiots they look,surely all the money that is put into this and similar events,could go to something much more worthy and needed,(like animal sanctuaries etc)those poor horses running in this heat,just why cant people be entertained and enjoy themselves without the need for an animals life to be at risk.I know it is not intentional,but these people know as well as we do fatalities happen all the time

I agree Kaz. I'm always feel sickened that any man can cold-bloodedly run a sword through a young bull's brain, which I believe is always the outcome of such bullfights.

I think matadors are cowards - it isn't brave when the odds are massively in their favour.

[Crimson Dynamo]

we kill millions of animals a week for food, they have no life and have a vile death

racehorses have a good life compared to 99.9999999% of all animals on earth

there are other better battles to be fought

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

we kill millions of animals a week for food, they have no life and have a vile death

racehorses have a good life compared to 99.9999999% of all animals on earth

there are other better battles to be fought

But we don't need to kill them for sport LT, infact we don't really need to kill them for food but that is another debate.I am on about animals dying for our entertainment.

[DemolitionRed]

I've had a lot of dealings in the horse trade including racing yards and if people knew what happened to these beautiful beasts after their racing career is over, they'd be shouting loudly about it... and so they should.

A horse that is bred to race is backed (saddled and ridden) as a two year old. None race horses are backed between the age of three and four so their bones, especially their spines, have matured well. These young horses, if they do survive past the race course, will likely suffer from spinal and pelvic pain for the rest of their miserable lives.

Young mares that have done well will be used in the breeding pool but most horses don't do well and they either end up in the abatour or sold for pennies to some novice who thinks its cool to own an ex race horse. But it gets worse and I've seen this with my own eyes. The better a horse does on the race-track, the more valuable it becomes and so the more its insured for. If that horse takes an injury, especially something that could traumatize that horse at future hurdles, corrupt vets will often tell the insurers that the horse is non-recoverable. Young fit race horses get a bullet through the head on a regular basis because they are worth more dead than alive.

Its not only horses. Racing greyhounds and whippets get the same lousy treatment. They are treated like kings until something goes wrong and after that its either death or a life of misery.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

I've had a lot of dealings in the horse trade including racing yards and if people knew what happened to these beautiful beasts after their racing career is over, they'd be shouting loudly about it... and so they should.

A horse that is bred to race is backed (saddled and ridden) as a two year old. None race horses are backed between the age of three and four so their bones, especially their spines, have matured well. These young horses, if they do survive past the race course, will likely suffer from spinal and pelvic pain for the rest of their miserable lives.

Young mares that have done well will be used in the breeding pool but most horses don't do well and they either end up in the abatour or sold for pennies to some novice who thinks its cool to own an ex race horse. But it gets worse and I've seen this with my own eyes. The better a horse does on the race-track, the more valuable it becomes and so the more its insured for. If that horse takes an injury, especially something that could traumatize that horse at future hurdles, corrupt vets will often tell the insurers that the horse is non-recoverable. Young fit race horses get a bullet through the head on a regular basis because they are worth more dead than alive.

Its not only horses. Racing greyhounds and whippets get the same lousy treatment. They are treated like kings until something goes wrong and after that its either death or a life of misery.

Thanks for that.

[DemolitionRed]

And this is in memory of Trojan, a beautiful Irish thoroughbred who I had the pleassure of knowing during his short life. He'd done well on the track but on his final season he'd pulled up with azoturia. This was caused by bringing him up to racing fitness too quickly. He was given field rest and I was the lucky person who helped get him better. I really wanted this horse and begged the owner to sell him to me. The owner however, decided he could do one last race (very dangerous for a horse who has suffered azoturia). Half way into the race he pulled up and had to be limped back to the horse box.

I'm so tempted to put the owners name here but I'd probably get into trouble.

I tended to Trojan that night and he seemed okay. I didn't get to speak to his owner that night but I was more determined than ever that he was going to now release this horse to me. I eagerly arrived at the yard the next morning, knowing I was going to have a busy day of negotiations ahead of me. I started to walk to his field and the trainer pulled me back and told me to sit down.

They had shot Trojan that night after I left. The excuse was, he was just too valuable to give away but he was worthless as a race-horse.

Trojan was three years old. A noble and gentle beast who had this lovely mischievous side to him... so these words are in memory of someone who greatly touched my life and will live on in my memory forever.

Thank you for starting this thread.

[y.winter]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

we kill millions of animals a week for food, they have no life and have a vile death

racehorses have a good life compared to 99.9999999% of all animals on earth

there are other better battles to be fought

Every battle is worth fighting for. It's not limited to one fight only.

[michael21]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Just noticed Ascot is about to take place,some guys dressed in silly clothes ,with a whip,riding a horse round a track in this heat,riding it for all it's worth,until some die of injuries or exhaustion,in my eyes it,nearly on a par with foxhunting,dog racing,bullfighting etc,my question is WHY is it so popular ? it's as cruel as other animal sports in my book,but people dressing up and getting excited about it is not nice to see,why do you think this is different to other animal sports where the animals are in danger? I know I will be called all sorts and unpopular but I feel strongly about it so thought I would ask why I am ready for the onslaught

Well I don't think wiping any animal or living thing is right

I bet but on football and I'll. Win to much money

Will horse racing be ban I don't thing so as the queen like it and the mp get tax from it

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

And this is in memory of Trojan, a beautiful Irish thoroughbred who I had the pleassure of knowing during his short life. He'd done well on the track but on his final season he'd pulled up with azoturia. This was caused by bringing him up to racing fitness too quickly. He was given field rest and I was the lucky person who helped get him better. I really wanted this horse and begged the owner to sell him to me. The owner however, decided he could do one last race (very dangerous for a horse who has suffered azoturia). Half way into the race he pulled up and had to be limped back to the horse box.

I'm so tempted to put the owners name here but I'd probably get into trouble.

I tended to Trojan that night and he seemed okay. I didn't get to speak to his owner that night but I was more determined than ever that he was going to now release this horse to me. I eagerly arrived at the yard the next morning, knowing I was going to have a busy day of negotiations ahead of me. I started to walk to his field and the trainer pulled me back and told me to sit down.

They had shot Trojan that night after I left. The excuse was, he was just too valuable to give away but he was worthless as a race-horse.

Trojan was three years old. A noble and gentle beast who had this lovely mischievous side to him... so these words are in memory of someone who greatly touched my life and will live on in my memory forever.

Thank you for starting this thread.

Only just seen this,how very sad DR,what a total waste of a horse that could have had so much love from you,money hungry bastards need the gun turning on them.

[jaxie]

I think you brought up an interesting discussion Kazanne. I think the horses involved in flat racing are generally well looked after while they are successful but are horribly mistreated and discarded, often slaughtered once their usefulness is over. Some are only a few years old. There are very few who end up happily frolicking in a pasture somewhere. This seems particularly cruel to me.

I don't see a place for the likes of the grand national in a caring civilised world.

[Alf]

So what happens to the race horses if the stop horse-racing? Who looks after them? Where do they live? How do they survive? Who's paying?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Alf

So what happens to the race horses if the stop horse-racing? Who looks after them? Where do they live? How do they survive? Who's paying?

Well if the horse racing stopped they wouldn't be bred .

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Well if the horse racing stopped they wouldn't be bred .

So make them extinct then? Just wipe them of the face of the Earth, just because some people don't agree with horse racing?

[y.winter]

Originally Posted by Alf

So make them extinct then? Just wipe them of the face of the Earth, just because some people don't agree with horse racing?

They won't get extinct... Let's not give the horse racing industry too much credit...
Animal abuse is quite a poor solution to extinction. It's like a kidnapper saying to his victim "thank me for giving you food and drink and sex, it's better than being dead"... Abuse stays an abuse.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by y.winter

They won't get extinct... Let's not give the horse racing industry too much credit...
Animal abuse is quite a poor solution to extinction. It's like a kidnapper saying to his victim "thank me for giving you food and drink and sex, it's better than being dead"... Abuse stays an abuse.

It's the horse racing industry, that actually looks after and cares for them.

They get stables to live in, they're fed and groomed. And they earn their keep by racing. Just like people who go out to work, earn their keep. Sometimes it might be dangerous, but so are lots of peoples jobs.

Wanting to get rid of horse racing, isn't about the well being of the horses, it's just about a persons own personal feelings, and wanting to look like a good person.

What's the percentage of owners/trainers in the industry who abuse them, compared to the owners/trainers who care for them?

[y.winter]

Originally Posted by Alf

It's the horse racing industry, that actually looks after and cares for them.

They get stables to live in, they're fed and groomed. And they earn their keep by racing. Just like people who go out to work, earn their keep. Sometimes it might be dangerous, but so are lots of peoples jobs.

Wanting to get rid of horse racing, isn't about the well being of the horses, it's just about a persons own personal feelings, and wanting to look like a good person.

What's the percentage of owners/trainers in the industry who abuse them, compared to the owners/trainers who care for them?

First, I would suggest looking more into the sad story behind the scenes of horse racing. You'll be surprised to know that the truth is less sugar coated. It's far from My Little Pony. It's the same excuses that keep Zoos going, while forgetting that it's basically an imposed incarceration ("They wouldn't make it in the nature, so we're doing them a favour!").
Drugs, stress fractures, incarceration in a small confined space for hours, genetic deformity, blood diseases, sperm extortion for breeding, high level of casualties, the direct connection to the meat industry, and many other horrible things that happen "thanks" to overexertion. This is an industry, and as such, it has it products - the horses. The product doesn't give a good result and money? guess what... People just don't see it and like to believe that "stability, food and grooming" is the full story. Well, there's more into it. I highly recommend reading and watching before coming to conclusions.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by y.winter

First, I would suggest looking more into the sad story behind the scenes of horse racing. You'll be surprised to know that the truth is less sugar coated. It's far from My Little Pony. It's the same excuses that keep Zoos going, while forgetting that it's basically an imposed incarceration ("They wouldn't make it in the nature, so we're doing them a favour!").
Drugs, stress fractures, incarceration in a small confined space for hours, genetic deformity, blood diseases, sperm extortion for breeding, high level of casualties, the direct connection to the meat industry, and many other horrible things that happen "thanks" to overexertion. This is an industry, and as such, it has it products - the horses. The product doesn't give a good result and money? guess what... People just don't see it and like to believe that "stability, food and grooming" is the full story. Well, there's more into it. I highly recommend reading and watching before coming to conclusions.

So we stop horse racing. So there's no need for owners or trainers. Nobody need to look after them.

What happens to them? What's the plan?

[y.winter]

Originally Posted by Alf

So we stop horse racing. So there's no need for owners or trainers. Nobody need to look after them.

What happens to them? What's the plan?

The answer would be the same as for the dogs in the dog fighting industry - growing them like the animal that they are and not like a machine, some will naturally breed some won't, some will be able to go back to the wild and some will have to stay for the rest of their lives where they are (because of domestication from birth and such), they'll die eventually and slowly the excess number of horses that were "made" for this purpose will decrease to the sane and natural number of horses, which will slowly go back to where they belong - nature and not stables. This is a process, natural selection, and it takes time, but that's far from a population explosion.

[Withano]

My main problem is with zoos existing, when can they go forever? 'Ah this ones sick, lets look after it in a different country, never put it back, and make it breed so we can keep several generations of healthy offspring caged up for moneyyy' no **** off, why did people stop caring about caged up animals after Shamu the killer whale.

I can see the concern for racehorses, theyre not really too high up on my priorities though, because I agree with Alf, they live a better life than the majority of animals in this country. Probably third best actually, after cats and dogs. The sharp majority do actually die of old age.

Lions living inside cages in London should be freed from suffering first - and then the other large animals - Giraffes, Chimps, Hippos.. none of them belong in cages.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Just noticed Ascot is about to take place,some guys dressed in silly clothes ,with a whip,riding a horse round a track in this heat,riding it for all it's worth,until some die of injuries or exhaustion,in my eyes it,nearly on a par with foxhunting,dog racing,bullfighting etc,my question is WHY is it so popular ? it's as cruel as other animal sports in my book,but people dressing up and getting excited about it is not nice to see,why do you think this is different to other animal sports where the animals are in danger? I know I will be called all sorts and unpopular but I feel strongly about it so thought I would ask why I am ready for the onslaught

Any sport that endangers the lives of animals or causes them distress should be outlawed fullstop. Are we or are we not supposed to be more civilised than that?

It's Sickening how some people at worst take pleasure out of animal cruelty or at best are indifferent to their suffering. Cowards in my opinion.