[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

I guess you fully support Israel. Lets just leave it at that.

It doesn't just have to be about Israel. Wanting to burn down parliament and invoke full capitalism, while saying things like "**** the Queen and especially **** Prince Phillip" shows what kind of group they are.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

It doesn't just have to be about Israel. Wanting to burn down parliament and invoke full capitalism, while saying things like "**** the Queen and especially **** Prince Phillip" shows what kind of group they are.

Yes it is. It is all about Israel/Palestine.
I don't know who the numpties are who want to put an end to Israel or who want to burn down parliament and invoke full capitalism and I don't agree with anyone who wants to abandon our royal family, so lets forget a number of anarchists this group has attracted because a) they will never achieve anything other than a bigger divide and b) disinformation cuts two ways.
Instead, why don't we try looking at the wider issues.

One group of people want something very different than the other group. One sits to the Left, one sits to the Right. Under real democracy they both have a right to a voice but because of the powers of the Right, the Left have been silenced. Secret groups and some very open groups on the Left have grown massively in number over the past decade, especially youth groups in Israel. Why is this happening? what's caused it? should they be stopped? should we listen to what they have to say? all these questions should make for a good and reasonable discussion. Instead we just keep going round in the same old circles and getting nowhere.

[jet]

Why don't you make a thread on Israel/Palestine, Red? This thread is about anti - Semitism in the Labour party.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by jet

Why don't you make a thread on Israel/Palestine, Red? This thread is about anti - Semitism in the Labour party.

Yes it is but anti-Semitism has now been broadened out to the Jewish Left and the anti-Semitism accusations are all about Palestine/Israel. The whole foundations behind this subject is Palestine/Israel.

[bots]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Yes it is but anti-Semitism has now been broadened out to the Jewish Left and the anti-Semitism accusations are all about Palestine/Israel. The whole foundations behind this subject is Palestine/Israel.

No, the subject hasn't been broadened out, it is about antisemitism. The ridiculous far left jewish group only came into play because Corbyn chose to have a dialog with them. The subject remains antisemitism

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

No, the subject hasn't been broadened out, it is about antisemitism. The ridiculous far left jewish group only came into play because Corbyn chose to have a dialog with them. The subject remains antisemitism

Look, you can't have an ongoing debate if its just about mocking Corbyn, unless of course that's all you want this thread for, but then it wouldn't be a debate, it would be an agenda. Baying mobs are unattractive regardless of what side of the fence you sit on. Just going over and over the same old same old is mind numbingly boring or maybe you disagree. If you can't see beyond the rant, then you're under no obligation to involve yourself in the 'ifs, what's, why's and therefore's'.

[bots]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Look, you can't have an ongoing debate if its just about mocking Corbyn, unless of course that's all you want this thread for, but then it wouldn't be a debate, it would be an agenda. Baying mobs are unattractive regardless of what side of the fence you sit on. Just going over and over the same old same old is mind numbingly boring or maybe you disagree. If you can't see beyond the rant, then you're under no obligation to involve yourself in the 'ifs, what's, why's and therefore's'.

the debate has been ongoing due to the continuation of events being reported about Corbyn and the labour party. You can't shift the topic of the debate just because you dont like it's subject.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Look, you can't have an ongoing debate if its just about mocking Corbyn

It's also hard to have a debate with someone who reduces criticism of actions to "mockery". There's been very little actual substanceless mockery for bare pages.

[jet]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Yes it is but anti-Semitism has now been broadened out to the Jewish Left and the anti-Semitism accusations are all about Palestine/Israel. The whole foundations behind this subject is Palestine/Israel.

Strictly speaking, the thread is about anti Semitism in the Labour party, and news/articles/opinions relating to that will get all mixed up with the broader subject of Palestine/Israel. That would be an interesting thread on its own.
Unless you are just interested in the subject as relating to attempting to absolve Corbyn/anti - Semitic Labour members (which it could be seen as), which is your right to do of course.
I would welcome a thread on it from those who are knowledgeable on the subject, I know a bit, but not nearly enough.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by jet

Strictly speaking, the thread is about anti Semitism in the Labour party, and news/articles/opinions relating to that will get all mixed up with the broader subject of Palestine/Israel. That would be an interesting thread on its own.
Unless you are just interested in the subject as relating to attempting to absolve Corbyn/anti - Semitic Labour members (which it could be seen as), which is your right to do of course.
I would welcome a thread on it from those who are knowledgeable on the subject, I know a bit, but not nearly enough.

Of course I want to absolve Corbyn, he's an innocent man.
I am ambivalent about quite a lot of Corbyn politics but I'm not going to stand there humming whilst he's being taken down by people who twist his words to sit with their agenda. A few weeks ago he was a spy, next month he's going to be something else even more heinous. These are the things I see you ringing your hands over. You dislike Corbyn and so you're narrative will always sit with the ones who make the allegations.

I've made my views clear about Israel before. This is a subject close to my heart and so when Corbyn first stood up in parliament and spoke about Israel breaking the UN Resolution, I was all ears. For me and many others he was a brave man for speaking out. Now he's being punished but I believe, all this will bring him a lot more support than he previously had because from where I'm standing, people can see this for what it is.

[jet]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Of course I want to absolve Corbyn, he's an innocent man.
I am ambivalent about quite a lot of Corbyn politics but I'm not going to stand there humming whilst he's being taken down by people who twist his words to sit with their agenda. A few weeks ago he was a spy, next month he's going to be something else even more heinous. These are the things I see you ringing your hands over. You dislike Corbyn and so you're narrative will always sit with the ones who make the allegations.

I've made my views clear about Israel before. This is a subject close to my heart and so when Corbyn first stood up in parliament and spoke about Israel breaking the UN Resolution, I was all ears. For me and many others he was a brave man for speaking out. Now he's being punished but I believe, all this will bring him a lot more support than he previously had because from where I'm standing, people can see this for what it is.

You won't be able to absolve him.
There is ample evidence he was an ira supporter, there is ample evidence that he ignored anti - Semitism in the Labour party and displayed anti - semitism himself although he puts that down to 'I didn't know' I didn't realise'.
A spy? There wasn't enough proof for that one which is why it died quickly - the rest - absolutely!
He is the eternal 'opposition', he has never had the responsibility of doing anything other than 'opposing' this that or the other anti - British. Now he's reaping what he has sowed and is continuing to sow.
You can say he is an innocent man until you turn blue in the face, it won't make any difference to those who know otherwise, those who can read and comprehend the facts and aren't blinded by misplaced devotion.
BTW I read today that a poll has shown his support has fallen in the last few weeks.