[arista]

http://www.channel4.com/news/univers...n-demo-protest

2 Video reports

Go to the 2nd Video one down
Studio Angry Debate
with the lady from the independent


"There is a fear of offending the Muslim community but there are a lot of modern Muslims that would never allow gender segregation."

[user104658]

Originally Posted by arista

http://www.channel4.com/news/univers...n-demo-protest

2 Video reports

Go to the 2nd Video one down
Studio Angry Debate
with the lady and the independent


"There is a fear of offending the Muslim community but there are a lot of modern Muslims that would never allow gender segregation."

"the organisation published a report last month saying universities could segregate by gender during talks from external speakers."

These are optional, anyone who doesn't want anything to do with this doesn't have to go. There is no aspect of force here, this is not apartheid, this is a complete non-issue. But of course, people will take any excuse to break out the war drums... especially thoughtless feminists (there is some wisdom in some feminism - there are also a lot of people involved just because they like to have something to be annoyed about ) and xenophobes. This "debate" appeals to both, I guess.

Like I said - if they start allowing this to be implemented by University staff in standard course lectures or somehow across the board, then there is obviously a massive problem. Allowing it to be requested by a small number of super-religious guest speakers whose lectures are attended completely out of personal interest? It just isn't an issue. The alternative is probably that these hyper-religious nutjobs won't come to speak at the University at all, which would be a shame, because a lecture like this would be very ACADEMICALLY INTERESTING to anyone studying theology.

But screw academia, right? Who cares if there's something interesting to be observed or an opportunity for a cultural issue to be examined up close. People are offended . Call the police immediately, and immigration. Send these curry-smelling foreign johnnies back, eh?

[Livia]

"In November a Universities UK report presented some hypothetical case studies which come up on campuses, including whether a speaker from an ultra-orthodox religious group requests an audience is segregated by gender.

The report states that university officials must consider both freedom of speech obligations and discrimination and equality laws when considering such a request."

How many other religions apart from Islam are vociferous in requesting the segregation of sexes? I kind of resent the "racist" and "xenophobe" comments when it's clear that the students are against the segregation of the sexes for any reason, including segregation on religious grounds.

[Nedusa]

No Segregation by Gender or Race or Religion or age or skin colour.... we have moved on from that **** !!!

We must not allow our accepted norms be changed because some minority group would prefer it that way.

No No No.......this is the slippery slope next thing all our women folk will have to wear headscarves and then veils and then the full Tent.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

No Segregation by Gender or Race or Religion or age or skin colour.... we have moved on from that **** !!!

We must not allow our accepted norms be changed because some minority group would prefer it that way.

No No No.......this is the slippery slope next thing all our women folk will have to wear headscarves and then veils and then the full Tent.

Have we? Are the masonic lodges present in every town in the UK accepting female members all of a sudden? Hmmm... no, they're not. But no one makes a huge fuss because these organisations are private members clubs, attending one is a choice, and those who disagree with their outdated values simply don't go.

This is absolutely no different. Other than it being about nasty, scary, hairy Muslims instead of old white men. Think about the Masonic order for a minute. Did you get as angry about that as you are about this? No? Now consider why that might be?

Again, this is about guest speakers - not standard University course lectures - and attending these lectures is completely optional. It is not segregation in a public setting. It is clearly not some sort of imminent threat to our culture. It's getting zealots in to speak when they otherwise simply wouldn't come, because hearing them speak is academically interesting, and just blustering "WELL THEY JUST SHOULDN'T COME THEN BLAAARGH" is limiting to a University. You don't have to agree with a speaker to be interested in attending something like this. You can attend to debate against them. And the ability to do that is more important than refusing to allow the event to take place in the first place. Failure to realise this is and blustering in with butthurt placards is, frankly, unacademic and has no real place in any discussion over how a University is run. I will be horrified if these Universities bow to pressure and allow the assembled masses to dictate their policies.

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Have we? Are the masonic lodges present in every town in the UK accepting female members all of a sudden? Hmmm... no, they're not. But no one makes a huge fuss because these organisations are private members clubs, attending one is a choice, and those who disagree with their outdated values simply don't go.

This is absolutely no different. Other than it being about nasty, scary, hairy Muslims instead of old white men. Think about the Masonic order for a minute. Did you get as angry about that as you are about this? No? Now consider why that might be?

Again, this is about guest speakers - not standard University course lectures - and attending these lectures is completely optional. It is not segregation in a public setting. It is clearly not some sort of imminent threat to our culture. It's getting zealots in to speak when they otherwise simply wouldn't come, because hearing them speak is academically interesting, and just blustering "WELL THEY JUST SHOULDN'T COME THEN BLAAARGH" is limiting to a University. You don't have to agree with a speaker to be interested in attending something like this. You can attend to debate against them. And the ability to do that is more important than refusing to allow the event to take place in the first place. Failure to realise this is and blustering in with butthurt placards is, frankly, unacademic and has no real place in any discussion over how a University is run. I will be horrified if these Universities bow to pressure and allow the assembled masses to dictate their policies.

Not sure your comparison with Masonic lodges highlights the issue in this thread. what is under attack here is the changing of well established normal routines eg when people attend lectures regardless of the subject or speaker, people sit wherever that is to say they are not compelled to suddenly undergo a gender segregation becuase it suits the whim or desire of the speaker.

This is the issue at hand when did we suddenly start allowing ourselves to be dictated to, and ask to accept new patterns of behaviour on the say so of someone who clearly believes that his way is the correct way.

It is not..........and we should resist such requests regardless of the academic consequences....!!!!

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

Not sure your comparison with Masonic lodges highlights the issue in this thread. what is under attack here is the changing of well established normal routines eg when people attend lectures regardless of the subject or speaker, people sit wherever that is to say they are not compelled to suddenly undergo a gender segregation becuase it suits the whim or desire of the speaker.

This is the issue at hand when did we suddenly start allowing ourselves to be dictated to, and ask to accept new patterns of behaviour on the say so of someone who clearly believes that his way is the correct way.

It is not..........and we should resist such requests regardless of the academic consequences....!!!!

Ahh I see - so gender segregation is OK so long as it's British gender segregation, not a foreign invasion of murky alien gender segregators. This is pretty much what I suspected. This is not an issue of gender equality, but a cultural one.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by the truth

schools have segregation don't they? there are also many womens only organizations in this country and 1000s more female only charities than for males....clearly that point is lost here as this site is brainwashed by feminist bias

You do realise feminism is about EQUALITY? Right?

[the truth]

schools have segregation don't they? there are also many womens only organizations in this country and 1000s more female only charities than for males....clearly that point is lost here as this site is brainwashed by feminist bias

[Livia]

Originally Posted by the truth

schools have segregation don't they? there are also many womens only organizations in this country and 1000s more female only charities than for males....clearly that point is lost here as this site is brainwashed by feminist bias

I think most women on this site are for equality.

[swinearefine]

Well aside from the Islamophobia this is bound to engender, sex segregation cannot be permitted in any form. I never graduated high school because of sex segregation because they made a new rule that boys and girls couldn't sit together on the bus anymore, and I refused to move so was off the bus with no way to school. What with this, the Croatian and Indian bans on gay rights, it seems like we've been taking some regrettable steps back in basic human rights lately.... at least we all have Uruguay though

[arista]

The PM has said no to this

http://www.theguardian.com/education...er-segregation


[The body that represents UK universities
has withdrawn guidance on the
gender segregation
of audiences in lectures and debates
after the prime minister, David Cameron, said it
should not be allowed to happen.
Universities UK said a controversial
case study setting out the guidance
was being withdrawn while it
reviewed its stance, but insisted
the legal position remained unclear
on whether the voluntary separation
of men and women could be allowed
at events such as lectures on Islam by
visiting speakers.
Cameron's spokesman had
earlier said Universities UK
should urgently review the guidance.]

[arista]

another great live debate on Ch4News
Jon Snow with a Islamic woman who wants Segregation
and a Lady against that.

[arista]

http://www.channel4.com/news/panderi...er-segregation
2nd video down
Video of the new Debate
from Ch4News tonight

[Marsh.]

Tell someone who cares Sally.