[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Are you REALLY being serious, Goldheart?

One can be both anti-Semitic AND a terrorist sympathiser and scheming bastard Corbyn has proved to be BOTH over decades in politics.

Like Livia, I am bewildered how ANYONE in this country can continue to defend this slimeball.

We NEED a Labour Party - one which honestly and fairly represents the best interests of the poorer classes of society as well as the United Kingdom in general, and one which offers a GENUINE alternative to the Conservatives.

Labour as it now does NEITHER and Corbyn and his REAL motives for wanting power is responsible for a large part of just WHY Labour is NOT fit to form a Government.

He is a ****ing disgrace.

Well ,Kirk,I can't really add much tothat,very well said

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Well ,Kirk,I can't really add much tothat,very well said

Hi Kaz.

I don't know how ANYONE can lambaste Trump whilst they are defending Corbyn.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Are you REALLY being serious, Goldheart?

One can be both anti-Semitic AND a terrorist sympathiser and scheming bastard Corbyn has proved to be BOTH over decades in politics.

Like Livia, I am bewildered how ANYONE in this country can continue to defend this slimeball.

We NEED a Labour Party - one which honestly and fairly represents the best interests of the poorer classes of society as well as the United Kingdom in general, and one which offers a GENUINE alternative to the Conservatives.

Labour as it now does NEITHER and Corbyn and his REAL motives for wanting power is responsible for a large part of just WHY Labour is NOT fit to form a Government.

He is a ****ing disgrace.

People are fickle AF I remember the OTT praise Corbyn got when he became labour leader , they even started complimenting his son saying he looks like a "Hollywood actor & model" .

And they treated Corbyn like superman , wow how things have turned predictable much .

The point I'm making is what ever Corbyn does he's now slated, and this hate campaign against him is happening while sweeping under the rug all Teresa May's dirty antics .

I don't believe Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser one bit, he never said he was laying a wreath for terrorists, he said he was paying his respects to the victims.

I'm not saying Corbyn is perfect, after all the guy is human but it just makes me laugh how quickly the media and everyone has turned against him , when not long ago people were treating him like a hero . I know opinions change but jeeeez ! .

[Maru]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

People are fickle AF I remember the OTT praise Corbyn got when he became labour leader , they even started complimenting his son saying he looks like a "Hollywood actor & model" .

And they treated Corbyn like superman , wow how things have turned predictable much .

The point I'm making is what ever Corbyn does he's now slated, and this hate campaign against him is happening while sweeping under the rug all Teresa May's dirty antics .

I don't believe Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser one bit, he never said he was laying a wreath for terrorists, he said he was paying his respects to the victims.

I'm not saying Corbyn is perfect, after all the guy is human but it just makes me laugh how quickly the media and everyone has turned against him , when not long ago people were treating him like a hero . I know opinions change but jeeeez ! .

While I do see your point (particularly the first three paragraphs) about the extremes of media coverage, as I understand the article, he laid the wreath for the attackers and posed over their grave sites?... maybe he laid a wreath for the victims as well, but that hardly matters for those who feel the first action was unacceptable.

The other point to be made is he felt the need to leave out the pertinent bits about his actions regarding the wreath. I understand wanting to dovetail a controversy, but he inevitably fueled it when he decided rather than cop to what had transpired, he would render misleading statement(s) instead.

Jeremy Corbyn has admitted attending a ceremony for the terrorists behind the Munich massacre, but denied laying a wreath himself.

The Labour leader said he was “present” at a memorial event commemorating those responsible for the 1972 attack, despite his office previously insisting he was only at the event in question honouring Palestinians killed in an Israeli air strike.

Wreath laying photos and placements
Source: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti..._campaign=1490

Even it is clear what he said, but if his actions aren't as clear as his words, then his detractors are going to tend to focus on the bits that don't add up...

My general thoughts on this story:

We in the US as well are having issues with Anti-Semitic-ism and other forms of racism. So it is understandable if folk there would prefer not to see the culture go further our direction when it comes to this. So I think it makes sense to want to map out an opposition party that doesn't cater to either. I wouldn't say that condemnation here is often now reciprocal enough. Certain forms of racism and discrimination go under the radar often here, but it just seems as an outsider that the UK is better about dealing with both sides of the equation when it comes to race-relations? Whereas our focus is very minute one and often one-sided... very politics-driven.

Though admittedly, this notion of governing all race relations from our own cultural perspective is getting a bit hairy. Yes, we should condemn all forms, but we can't operate in such a way that we attempt to domineer relations between members of groups we the individual don't reside in...

In Corbyn's case however, he will potentially be the PM and will govern policy. So it is important he is on the right page morally. Granted that page is more difficult to find now when both sides are growing further and further apart when it comes to the overall moral spectrum. So yeah, endless smear campaigns as both sides attempt to shame-boast their moral opponents into a political oblivion ... so while one side argues this means nothing, the other would argue it means everything, etc...

But yeah, this constant muck-muck campaign is getting old fast... so I'm on board with your primary point. However, Corbyn potentially being PM, it would not be good if he were to be elected and only sided with certain groups... I'd prefer we had a lame duck President than one that only worries about one side of the political equation... and we haven't had that kind of leader in a really long time it feels like...

[RileyH]

Gross

[arista]

He has spoken again today Ch4HD News
saying he was there in memory of the attack in 1985 Tunisia
which was condemned Worldwide.
And he layed a wreath

[JoshBB]

oh wow.

I only saw bits on this through twitter, and I got the impression that he was laying a wreath for someone else and these bastards' graves just happened to be nearby.

Labour really need a new leader

[Oliver_W]

The love of Corbyn is just weird. When people buy tote bags or t-shirts with his face on, and he occasionally has trending hashtags where people declare their love for him, he comes off more as the leader of a creepy cult than the leader of the Opposition.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

The love of Corbyn is just weird. When people buy tote bags or t-shirts with his face on, and he occasionally has trending hashtags where people declare their love for him, he comes off more as the leader of a creepy cult than the leader of the Opposition.

...oh come on Oliver, you know you want one of those t-shirts...you know you do, just give in to it...

[Oliver_W]

One of us ... One of us ...

[user104658]

I'm not a Corbyn fan and I think he's clearly made plenty of suspect and unfortunate decisions, I don't particularly want him to be PM (though no less than I want VoJo or ****ing Tit Mogg as PM)

... but anyone who doesn't think there is currently a deliberate propaganda campaign against him is flat out deluded . They did the same thing with Milliband; they just had less juicy material to work with so had to target his dad, his sandwich eating proficiency, and the fact that he looks like claymation.

"Corbyn HATES TEH JEWS!" certainly makes bolder headlines.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'm not a Corbyn fan and I think he's clearly made plenty of suspect and unfortunate decisions, I don't particularly want him to be PM (though no less than I want VoJo or ****ing Tit Mogg as PM)

... but anyone who doesn't think there is currently a deliberate propaganda campaign against him is flat out deluded . They did the same thing with Milliband; they just had less juicy material to work with so had to target his dad, his sandwich eating proficiency, and the fact that he looks like claymation.

"Corbyn HATES TEH JEWS!" certainly makes bolder headlines.

Exactly !!

Notice how we're hearing less & less about May & the Tories .

As I previously said Milliband was mocked & treated like crap ,for no reason . People took the pee out his voice & his looks and even laughed at him eating a sandwich but none of them bothered to listen to him .

Interesting how people supported Cameron though ,who could easily of been mocked for his face . No matter what Labour always gets mud thrown at them , it's always the same.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

Exactly !!

Notice how we're hearing less & less about May & the Tories .

As I previously said Milliband was mocked & treated like crap ,for no reason . People took the pee out his voice & his looks and even laughed at him eating a sandwich but none of them bothered to listen to him .

Interesting how people supported Cameron though ,who could easily of been mocked for his face . No matter what Labour always gets mud thrown at them , it's always the same.

So you think that May and Boris and all the others in the Tory party never get mocked and treated like crap. Interesting...

It saddens me to think that Islamophobia is quite rightly not acceptable in the Labour party... antisemitism though? Well... they're Jews, right? Who cares? At least that's how it's come over to me lately.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Livia

So you think that May and Boris and all the others in the Tory party never get mocked and treated like crap. Interesting...

It saddens me to think that Islamophobia is quite rightly not acceptable in the Labour party... antisemitism though? Well... they're Jews, right? Who cares? At least that's how it's come over to me lately.

No Livia
That's not what I said ,but they're getting less bad publicity it's do obvious what's happening.

I still don't believe Corbyn is anti-Semitic , he's probably associated or been linked with people who are but doesn't mean he is himself .

[Livia]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

No Livia
That's not what I said ,but they're getting less bad publicity it's do obvious what's happening.

I still don't believe Corbyn is anti-Semitic , he's probably associated or been linked with people who are but doesn't mean he is himself .

I think laying wreaths on the graves of terrorists colours my judgement about him. The IRA, the PLO, Hamas... there are plenty of terrorist causes he and his colleagues support. And he can't make the distinction between being Israeli and being Jewish.

Corbyn could have put an end to the antisemitism allegations a long, long time ago. But he didn't. Instead he's kept his silence and that can only lead me to believe he is antisemitic. And meanwhile his supporters respond with stuff like... It's all a smear campaign... and yeah, but what about the Tories!

[Livia]

Corbyn is the leader of a party that has major problems with antisemitism and as leader he's done nothing to help rectify it. That doesn't mean to say the other parties are perfect... but Corbyn and his Labour party do have an antisemitism problem that no one is addressing. That's how I feel. And that's how my family feel, and we've discussed it at length. My grandmother thinks he's a dangerous man and is quite frightened of him, that's mostly because she is a holocaust survivor and knows how little it takes for a whole community to singled out and oppressed. Now, I'm not saying that Corbyn might turn into Hitler, but the fact that he has so many questions to answer and has answered none to my satisfaction makes him look weak at best and antisemitic at worst. Most Jewish people I speak to, including Labour supporters, think Cornbyn needs to piss or get off the pot when it comes to standing up to antisemitism. The fact that he has done so little makes up till now me think he doesn't want to.

[Livia]

No one sold arms under Tony Blair? He took us to war on a lie. Talking about things being swept under the carpet...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

No one sold arms under Tony Blair? He took us to war on a lie. Talking about things being swept under the carpet...

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I guess there aren't many high profile politicians who don't have a finger in that particular pie, so it gets overlooked as "the norm".

Just because it's become commonplace, does not make it less serious.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Livia

No one sold arms under Tony Blair? He took us to war on a lie. Talking about things being swept under the carpet...

Are you kidding?? , Nothing Blair did was ever swept under the carpet . Even now he still gets blamed for the war on Iraq

[Livia]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

Are you kidding?? , Nothing Blair did was ever swept under the carpet . Even now he still gets blamed for the war on Iraq

And are YOU kidding by claiming the Tories selling arms to Saudi has been swept under the carpet? How come we're talking about it??

Who else should be blamed for the war on Iraq?

All the political parties get trolled by the press. Singling out the Labour party as being particularly affected is more ridiculous than the antisemitism denials.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

And are YOU kidding by claiming the Tories selling arms to Saudi has been swept under the carpet? How come we're talking about it??

Who else should be blamed for the war on Iraq?

All the political parties get trolled by the press. Singling out the Labour party as being particularly affected is more ridiculous than the antisemitism denials.

The mainstream UK tabloid press is heavily skewed towards the Conservatives. We're not going to start denying that now too, surely?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The mainstream UK tabloid press is heavily skewed towards the Conservatives. We're not going to start denying that now too, surely?

I don't read the tabloid press. And no one I know takes them seriously.

Antisemitism is a problem for Labour. With or without the tabloids.

And what do you mean, am I going to deny that "too".

Maybe I'm a little too close to this argument.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Livia

And are YOU kidding by claiming the Tories selling arms to Saudi has been swept under the carpet? How come we're talking about it??

Who else should be blamed for the war on Iraq?

All the political parties get trolled by the press. Singling out the Labour party as being particularly affected is more ridiculous than the antisemitism denials.

It's being downplayed , labour are getting a much negative backlash that's my point.

The war on Iraq was both Blair & Bush let's open our eyes , I never said Blair didn't have a part in it but it wasn't just him .

[user104658]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

The war on Iraq was both Blair & Bush let's open our eyes , I never said Blair didn't have a part in it but it wasn't just him .

To be fair in my opinion there were far bigger global tides driving the Iraq war than individuals like Bush or Blair (it would have happened regardless of who was POTUS or PM) but I think that's a whooole other thread .

[Livia]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

It's being downplayed , labour are getting a much negative backlash that's my point.

The war on Iraq was both Blair & Bush let's open our eyes , I never said Blair didn't have a part in it but it wasn't just him .

Well I can tell you that the feeling amongst Jews is very different.

I mean, he's denied he laid a wreath on the graves of the terrorist who killed Israelis at the Munich Olympics. He ONLY laid a wreath on terrorists who were training at a PLO camp in Tunis. Oh well, that's fine then!

There's also the fact that Labour want to change the definition of antisemitism. Everyone else in the world uses the definition in its entirety... but Labour want to change it.

I have not personally seen a news story in this country affect the Jewish community so deeply.... ever.