[Glenn.]

If you cant see or will deliberately ignore the fact that thousands of people protesting in close proximity to each other, not wearing masks, in the middle of a pandemic that is killing people won’t spread the virus even further then I can’t help you. That’s common sense.

[Alf]

I understand your points, and I know it's a fearful time for us all, in our different ways. But people have got to do what they've got to do.

These protesters arne:t there because they want to be, they're there because they have great concern.

[Elliot]

I’m screaming there’s no debate being had within science the consensus is there. Choosing not to believe it is of your own ignorant volition..

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Elliot

I’m screaming there’s no debate being had within science the consensus is there. Choosing not to believe it is of your own ignorant volition..

You're entitled to that opinion, and other people are entitled to their's. What can you do?

[Alf]

Can anyone confirm that the survival rate from being infected with Covid is 99%. That's just a number I've seen, I don't know how accurate that is. But if it is accurate, then is crashing the economy and prohibiting people of their freedom the correct action?

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Alf

Can anyone confirm that the survival rate from being infected with Covid is 99%. That's just a number I've seen, I don't know how accurate that is. But if it is accurate, then is crashing the economy and prohibiting people of their freedom the correct action?

It’s around that but the survival rate isn’t the issue, if you let it rip through the population unchecked, hospitals just won’t be able to cope, ICU will be full of Covids on ventilators and if you or you Ma needs ICU care you can kiss goodbye to that

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Alf

Can anyone confirm that the survival rate from being infected with Covid is 99%. That's just a number I've seen, I don't know how accurate that is. But if it is accurate, then is crashing the economy and prohibiting people of their freedom the correct action?

Like Cherie says above its a bit more complicated than that because the strain on health services will cost lives (not just Covid deaths; deaths from all causes).

Also 1% is overall and you have to remember that under 25 the death rate is effectively 0% (not zero deaths but a miniscule proportion) and goes up with age; its probably 5%+ in 60 year olds and if you go up to 80 year olds it's as high as 20%.

So it's not as simple as saying "you have a 99% chance of survival" - it's not random, it depends on your age and health. If you're a fit 20 year old you have a 99.99% chance of survival. If you're a fat 70 year old you're probably in trouble.

A lot of the people protesting look to be in their 50's and have nowhere near 99% survival rate.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Like Cherie says above its a bit more complicated than that because the strain on health services will cost lives (not just Covid deaths; deaths from all causes).

Also 1% is overall and you have to remember that under 25 the death rate is effectively 0% (not zero deaths but a miniscule proportion) and goes up with age; its probably 5%+ in 60 year olds and if you go up to 80 year olds it's as high as 20%.

So it's not as simple as saying "you have a 99% chance of survival" - it's not random, it depends on your age and health. If you're a fit 20 year old you have a 99.99% chance of survival. If you're a fat 70 year old you're probably in trouble.

A lot of the people protesting look to be in their 50's and have nowhere near 99% survival rate.

I imagine that influenza statistics are similar? Older people are more vulnerable?

We don't usually crash the the economy and turn ourselves into a totalitarian society every influenza season.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Alf

I imagine that influenza statistics are similar? Older people are more vulnerable?

We don't usually crash the the economy and turn ourselves into a totalitarian society every influenza season.

Its weird to me that the government has been removing oversight, have introduced policies to attack a specific minority group (travellers), are attacking lawyers and judges, are knowingly hurting the country with brexit, and yet the authoritarianism card is being wheeled out when it's time protect Doris round the corner by wearing a mask.

Brought to us primarily, by the all lives matter crowd.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

Its weird to me that the government has been removing oversight, have introduced policies to attack a specific minority group (travellers), are attacking lawyers and judges, are knowingly hurting the country with brexit, and yet the authoritarianism card is being wheeled out when it's time protect Doris round the corner by wearing a mask.

Brought to us primarily, by the all lives matter crowd.

No understandio!

[Elliot]

You are a moron if you don’t wear masks. You’re putting people more vulnerable than yourself at a great risk for literally no reason

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Elliot

You are a moron if you don’t wear masks. You’re putting people more vulnerable than yourself at a great risk for literally no reason

Why, what do masks do?

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Alf

Why, what do masks do?

can I ask Alf if you sneeze or cough do you put your hand over your mouth, its pretty much the same concept

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Cherie

can I ask Alf if you sneeze or cough do you put your hand over your mouth, its pretty much the same concept

Alf on the bus yesterday

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Cherie

can I ask Alf if you sneeze or cough do you put your hand over your mouth, its pretty much the same concept

At the start, we were advised to cough into the inside of our elbows. That was fine, I happily went along with that and still do that.

I went along with the metres apart advise, that's no problem. I wasn't obsessive about it, but tried to be respectful to others.

The only time I wear a mask is when I'm going in a shop, I put it on as I'm entering and take it immediately off as I leave. The only reason I wear one in shops is because I understand that people are really fearful, and fully believe this advice is the Gospel. Most of them don't even ask for a second opinion.

I've had the same mask since the mask thing came in, I haven't washed it once, I don't know what it's doing other than making me look like a dork and feeling uncomfortable.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Alf

At the start, we were advised to cough into the inside of our elbows. That was fine, I happily went along with that and still do that.

I went along with the metres apart advise, that's no problem. I wasn't obsessive about it, but tried to be respectful to others.

The only time I wear a mask is when I'm going in a shop, I put it on as I'm entering and take it immediately off as I leave. The only reason I wear one in shops is because I understand that people are really fearful, and fully believe this advice is the Gospel. Most of them don't even ask for a second opinion.

I've had the same mask since the mask thing came in, I haven't washed it once, I don't know what it's doing other than making me look like a dork and feeling uncomfortable.

oh right, I only wear a mask in shops as well, if I am out walking the dog or whatever I don't bother

[Alf]

Youtube video

[user104658]

Again I think it's about the scale of the freedoms I guess.

Do we need the freedom to pack into stadiums when there's a virus around? No. Do we need the freedom to choose to not wear a mask? No (the argument is ridiculous; we've accepted clothing requirements for hundreds if not thousands of years)

Most other things I'm fine with as a firm suggestion but I start getting a bit uncomfortable with them being enforceable law. E.g. 2m social distancing - everyone should be doing it and conscious of it but do I think the police should cuff anyone who wanders too close to each other in Tesco? No. And again, the restriction of movement within the country is a huge one for me. The SUGGESTION that people try to stay in their own council area and use common sense I am perfectly fine with. The government-mandated legal ban on crossing county borders "except for reasons they say is OK"? Not so much. I find it a stretch too far. Its also simply ludicrous where I live because its a "commuter county" - probably 3/4 people who live here work in Glasgow, Edinburgh or other neighbouring counties which means most people cross county lines on a daily basis anyway - but not for groceries? Other things too, e.g. I live near the edge of a county which means we actually have to travel FURTHER to the nearest supermarket. Also can't take the dog up the coast to a big deserted beach where you don't come within 100m of another human... But instead have to walk the local dog walking routes, passing countless people. A lot of it is arbitrary authoritarianism with no real common sense or science behind it, yet mandated by law. Worrying.

[Elliot]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Again I think it's about the scale of the freedoms I guess.

Do we need the freedom to pack into stadiums when there's a virus around? No. Do we need the freedom to choose to not wear a mask? No (the argument is ridiculous; we've accepted clothing requirements for hundreds if not thousands of years)

Most other things I'm fine with as a firm suggestion but I start getting a bit uncomfortable with them being enforceable law. E.g. 2m social distancing - everyone should be doing it and conscious of it but do I think the police should cuff anyone who wanders too close to each other in Tesco? No. And again, the restriction of movement within the country is a huge one for me. The SUGGESTION that people try to stay in their own council area and use common sense I am perfectly fine with. The government-mandated legal ban on crossing county borders "except for reasons they say is OK"? Not so much. I find it a stretch too far. Its also simply ludicrous where I live because its a "commuter county" - probably 3/4 people who live here work in Glasgow, Edinburgh or other neighbouring counties which means most people cross county lines on a daily basis anyway - but not for groceries? Other things too, e.g. I live near the edge of a county which means we actually have to travel FURTHER to the nearest supermarket. Also can't take the dog up the coast to a big deserted beach where you don't come within 100m of another human... But instead have to walk the local dog walking routes, passing countless people. A lot of it is arbitrary authoritarianism with no real common sense or science behind it, yet mandated by law. Worrying.

Yes this is exactly how I feel. I have pretty bad asthma and I have zero issues wearing masks. It’s so insensitive, irresponsible and entitled to see people be so contrary to something so harmless when there’s other aspects about lockdown that are actually setting a worrying precedent

[DouglasS]

Mildly inconvienced? People are losing their own businesses that they have dedicated their lives to building... So many people have lost jobs and are unable to pay to feed their family properly... self employed workers are screwed by the furlough scheme and can’t afford to live. These are all impacts of lockdown. I get your point about the spread of the virus but you are downplaying the impact Massively, saying to a lot these people that they are mildly inconvienced is like spitting in their face

[The Slim Reaper]

Yeah, these protests aren't anything to do with the economy or hurting people, because they lived through 10 years of austerity without saying dick.

[Tom4784]

Few, if any, of these protesters are wearing masks. You can try to make out it's about livelihood and higher purposes, but let's be real, it's a bunch of right wing anti-mask nutjobs and nothing more.

Ridiculous creatures, idiots the lot of them.

[Tom4784]

If these people care about what you are making them out to care about then why aren't they adhering to the lockdown? If we followed the advice of experts then we wouldn't have had a second lockdown, ignoring social distancing and not wearing masks in crowded places and then crying about the lockdown is peak stupidity.

[Alf]

Had my fill of him, he's on ignore.

[Tom4784]

That's an odd way to say 'I can't argue against what you're saying but I can't bring myself to admit it.'