[Matt10k]

Originally posted by Magic

Thats my point.,

But magic, why mention the rest of the solar system? Yes, changes in the sun will effect them but who cares?! There is no life there so let's concentrate on our own planet shall we!

[Tom]

With the smoking debate, I think it should be compulsory that in pubs with more than one room and bar that one is made non-smoking and some smoking but it should be down to the license holders on whether smoking should be banned in smaller pubs or not. I think staff have the right to say they don't want to work in a smoky environment. Most bar staff of today will have signed up before the smoking ban so won't really mind anyway as that is what their job entailed before. If you signed up to work at a pub or club before July 07 then you will have known that you would be spending a lot of time around smokers.

I don't agree with smoking, in fact I think its a disgusting habit but at the minute smokers are being treated like animals which isn't fair on them.

[Matt10k]

Also, other planets do have atmospheres. Venus has a very thick atmosphere. Mars has an atmosphere (a very thin one).

[Scarlett.]

Lol! Humble pie!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe I'd be more willing to hear about GW more if it wasnt in every news report

Its like Iraq, we hear about bombings everyday, but its been reported on so much it doesnt stick in your mind

[Matt10k]

Originally posted by Chewy
Lol! Humble pie!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe I'd be more willing to hear about GW more if it wasnt in every news report

Its like Iraq, we hear about bombings everyday, but its been reported on so much it doesnt stick in your mind

I know. That's because it's so flavour of the month that any new study along climate lines needs to somehow relate back to global warming or they can't get funding. The program covered that too... there were many researchers and scientists on it who stated they had trouble finding funding unless they somehow related their studies back to global warming. One gave an example of a study citing the disappearance of red squirrels and said they related the study to global warming even though their disappearance had nothing to do with it, so they could secure funding!

So do you see how this could cause tremendous bias?!

[Scarlett.]

Aye

also another example of flogging a dead donkey is Maddie, the story was one so much that people began not to care (although I hope she is found one day)

[Matt10k]

Originally posted by Chewy
Aye

also another example of flogging a dead donkey is Maddie, the story was one so much that people began not to care (although I hope she is found one day)

Yep, what the media chooses to show and not show us seems to have a massive effect on what people believe to be true, even when further research shows it is mostly hype, created by media moguls to make more money.

[CookieDough3000]

Originally posted by Dr43%er
Typing China once hardly counts as a compultion.

A: I am a boss. So I have a duty of care to my employees for their health and safety. This includes making sure they have the right safety equipment for the job, and a safe working environment. This include noxious airborne substances I.E cigarette smoke.

Smoking in bars is not some strange side-effect that happens as the customers spontaneously burst into smoking, it is (or rather was) one of the things people gathered to do. Owners were happy with it, smokers were happy with it, non-smokers were happy with it, or at least happy enough to not leave, which is always their prerogative. The comparison with China is moot - there, there is very little employment choice. That is not the case here.

As to your example of the dangerous machinery...if a popular and legal past time was to operate dangerous machinery without correct equipment, and a businessman decided to allow it on his premises, it would not be the role fo the state to ban it. The difference between smoking and using poor machinery is clear: whereas the former was one of the main functions of a bar, the latter is not true of machinery.

B: Smoking is something "some" people do for there leisure. Why should this effect the non smokers or smokers who are just trying to do there job.

Their job is to work in a premises that allows smoking. If they don't like it, they can leave. It is a choice to work in such a place, unless you are suggesting that they were coerced into applying there?

C: Who made you the chairman of F.O.R.E.ST? Most of the bar workers I know, even the smokers prefer working now the ban is in.

Nobody. I do not presume to speak for anyone - it is you who are bravely flying the flag for the workers. That is fine; those employees could have recommended it to their employer earlier. If they hate smoking so much, they shouldn't have started working in a place that allows smoking. They clearly didn't care enough to leave.

With regards to me being egotistical and selfish. As you don't know me you can not possibly know if I ever complained about smokers in bars. I will let you know. Yes I have when someone has burnt me with their fag.

...someone burnt you with their fag, and as a consequence smoking in every single enclosed space up and down the country should be banned?

You are the one who wants to smoke it, so hold it nearer to you and not away from you.

I want to smoke what now? Who said I smoke? I've never smoked a cigarette in my life, nor do I intend to. Not everyone who opposes the smoking ban smokes; some of us just recognise that there is such a thing as privacy, and we don't have the right to legislate our way into every detail of someone's life.

I quite like the idea that I am selfish but you are saying to bar workers, If I want to smoke you should get another job to protect your health.

I am saying nothing of the sort, firstly because I don't want to smoke. I am saying to bar workers if you do not like smoking, do not work in a place that allows it. I dislike smoking, so I rarely go into bars that allow it. I exercise my choice, just as do those that smoke, and those that don't. Nobody is coerced into entering a bar or working at one. If an owner wants to allow it, fine. If a worker has no problem with it, fine. If anyone does have a problem with it, don't walk through the door.

[Magic]

Originally posted by Matt10k

But magic, why mention the rest of the solar system? Yes, changes in the sun will effect them but who cares?! There is no life there so let's concentrate on our own planet shall we!

Because someone said the sun is heating up, and thats what is causing Global Warming. What i meant to show is that if the sun was the main cause, it wouldn't be [b]global[/global] warming.

[Matt10k]

Originally posted by Magic

Because someone said the sun is heating up, and thats what is causing Global Warming. What i meant to show is that if the sun was the main cause, it wouldn't be [b]global[/global] warming.

Global warming is just the term they use to describe that the earth is heating. I'm not sure what the point you are trying to make is? If you don't believe the sun is expanding/ heating and that solar cycles effect the earths climate and have done for millions of years (before modern man ever produced CO2) then look up the evidence yourself...

[Scarlett.]

Just because its called Global Warming

doesnt mean it doesnt mean the other Planets wont get warmer

[Stu]

Im going to chip in and give my opinion on some issues...

Global Warning : Im no scientist , but 'the man' is not trying to take away your civil liberties and keep you down just by telling you we all have to make this rock last a little longer. Fact. Some of the arguments on the first page of this thread are laughable.

Smoking : People have always and will always for ever more smoke. If your bothered by a smoker in this day and age - with all the laws that already go against us smokers - you can just sod off.

Fat People : Every time I see Jamie Oliver on my TV I want to kick his teeth down his throat and hope their is a substaintial amount of fat in them. People are fat. People like to eat. Each one of us are bound to be doing something that is slowly killing us off. Leave fat people be. Most of them are fine individuals who know the perils themselves by now. Information is one thing , talks of hiking the price on fattening food is a whole different basket of eggs.

Drugs : Their are good drugs and bad drugs. Alcohol is a drug. Drugs are not for everybody. Not everybody who uses drugs is an arsehole. All facts. Keep the ban on Heroin , Coke , Speed and other dangerous , addictive drugs. The fact , however , that drugs like Cannabis are still against the law is a disgrace. Whats more of a disgrace is mindless people who buy into the talk to frank bullshit. Cannabis has a thousand uses. All of them positive. Legalise!

Abortion : Im anti abortion , but pro choice. Give people the choice.

Illegal Downloading : I watched 3 new release DVD's for free over the past week by downloading illegaly. Hollywood is still getting rich. Tell me who is the victim in this supposed 'crime'???

[Magic]

Originally posted by Matt10k

Global warming is just the term they use to describe that the earth is heating. I'm not sure what the point you are trying to make is? If you don't believe the sun is expanding/ heating and that solar cycles effect the earths climate and have done for millions of years (before modern man ever produced CO2) then look up the evidence yourself...

Scientists have found though when looking at Ice Caps, the CO2 Concentration has increased some much in the last 50 years. So thats evidence proving we speeding up climate change.

[Tom]

Originally posted by Magic

Scientists have found though when looking at Ice Caps, the CO2 Concentration has increased some much in the last 50 years. So thats evidence proving we speeding up climate change.

Scientist shave also found that throughout the course of history there have been fluctuations in temperature, and we are only going through part of the earths natural cycle. They have predicted that in another million years we will be in another ice age. Its also been mentioned in this thread that the sun is growing in size which is something we cannot control. Yes, we are speeding it up but we are not to blame as much as the governments around the world make out to be. Its inevitable.

[Matt10k]

Yes, they measured CO2 levels and found that when the planet was hottest, CO2 was highest but this increased AFTER the planet heated up, not before.

They then correlated the suns activity over the last few millennia and found clear correlation between when the planet was hottest and when solar activity was highest- nothing to do with CO2 and that CO2 only rose AFTER the planet heated (presumably released from said ice caps when they melted).

We are currently reaching the crest of one of these cycles (see the graph posted earlier)