[Ashley.]

I've had and seen a few different debates today about parenting styles, and the extent to which the child's life should be controlled by the parent(s). Some parents give a considerable amount of autonomy to their children, allowing them to sleep when they want or partake in certain activities when they want. Other parents may give little autonomy, such as a fixed day-to-day routine or excluding the child from being able to make decisions on their life. But of course it's a lengthy spectrum.

I'd say I fell into the latter bracket when I was a child, I did what I was told and as a result was quite timid until I got to the age where I was allowed to make my own decisions. But within this bracket I learned to respect others, to hear other people and pretty much developed a "just get on with it" attitude which has been a major driving force in my later life. And I still see the positive in having considerable autonomy - one argument I've seen is that a child should be allowed to make their own decisions and learn from their own mistakes. Perhaps learning about the consequences of bad decision-making in the early stages of our lives allows us to practice thinking more rationally and staying on the right path. Likewise I see the disadvantages of having little autonomy - it may often lead to a child reacting negatively later on to having a lack of control over their own lives, developing a "power trip" type personality when they are eventually given the opportunity to do what they want, because they may not have learned about consequences.

There are a few interesting articles I've seen today, too. For example this article discusses a type of parent called a lawnmower parent:

Lawnmower parents are compared to the gardening tool because they cut down any obstacle that could stand in their child’s way. Notably, this is a parent who may no longer have the ability or access to remove their child from a problematic situation, therefore they do their “mowing” from a distance.

“At the college level, the physical presence required to hover may be limited, so we are now observing a different parenting style,” Karen Fancher, a professor at Duquesne University’s School of Pharmacy, wrote in the Pittsburgh Mom Blog. “These are the parents who rush ahead to intervene, saving the child from any potential inconvenience, problem or discomfort.”

It also creates a counter argument that children should be given the opportunity to make their own mistakes and grow from them:

“Growing up is about learning to continuously adapt to new and more challenging situations,” says Dr. Jillian Roberts, founder of Family Sparks and an associate professor at the University of Victoria.

“When parents deprive their children of opportunities to practise these skills, their parenting is actually detrimental to their kids. In fact, what they are communicating is: ‘I do not think you are capable of handling this on your own.'”

She says the best thing to do is to allow kids to handle most day-to-day challenges on their own, like ordering their own food at a restaurant or packing their own suitcase. This is how they learn.

That said, she also understands a parent’s knee-jerk reaction to jump in to shield a child from threats that the child hasn’t previously faced.

“Parents have to guide their children past obstacles that they themselves likely never lived through — online bullying, social media pressures, stumbling onto pornography, etc. It is understandable that parents would want to pull their children more tightly into their embrace,” she says.

However, she says there are other ways to help them adapt. Namely, by giving them chores and responsibilities.

“Whenever possible, give your children authentic and meaningful opportunities to make decisions. Little ones can choose what they wear; older ones can choose where you go on family vacations,” Roberts says. “Ease into the sharing of power by offering two to three choices.”

By doing this, you’re setting your child up with a sense of autonomy as well as teaching them that their decisions matter. And even if they fail at a task, allowing them to do so will help build strength and resilience.

So how much "freedom" should a young child have? What factors of a child's life should be controlled, e.g. friendship circles, sleeping routine, outdoor activities? I thought this would be an interesting topic to discuss as I've seen so many different arguments and very little 'wrong answers'.

[Niamh.]

hhhmmm that's a tough question, definitely depends on the age for a start, as they get older I think they should gradually get more choices. In regards to bedtimes, I'd be kind of strict about that weekdays alright. I don't know though, there could be a different answer to different situations/scenarios

[Eddie.]

It depends on the age.

If the child is below 10, certain rules should be taken into consideration though the child would hopefully be given a good amount of freedom.

Above that age, maybe the child can control a bit of the rules as they are mature enough and I believe that if the child is 16 or above, they can do what they want as long as it’s appropriate. If the child goes out of the boundary zone such as underage smoking/drinking, then obviously the parents have to take matters into their own hands.

[LeatherTrumpet]

Too broad a topic tbh.

I dont let smallest boy LT sleep in at weekends for example and in general did the same with the girls as i see that as a waste of the day. Too much to do in life for lying in till 12. That said oldest girl LT will sleep in till 12 but that is because she got in hammered at 4

Smallest boy LT who is now 12 goes up at 10 now and has always had a set time as did the girls. Kids need a structure and so do parents for down time etc

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Too broad a topic tbh.

I dont let smallest boy LT sleep in at weekends for example and in general did the same with the girls as i see that as a waste of the day. Too much to do in life for lying in till 12. That said oldest girl LT will sleep in till 12 but that is because she got in hammered at 4

Smallest boy LT who is now 12 goes up at 10 now and has always had a set time as did the girls. Kids need a structure and so do parents for down time etc

Yeah 100% I think it's really beneficial to kids to have a good sleeping pattern

[arista]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah 100% I think it's really beneficial to kids to have a good sleeping pattern

Yes Sleep Amount Matters.

[Toy Soldier]

GENERALLY they have a lot of freedom with making their own decisions, my eldest even opted out of homework last year (and has this year decided off her own back that she wants to do it, and sits doing it of her own accord with zero complaints )...

...however... bed time / getting up time is the exception. Absolute chaos if it isn't insisted upon.

[Maru]

That type of parenting you've specified Ashley really backfires imo, because then those parents are stuck "parenting" grown adults well into their 20's and early 30's... sadly, I have seen this with some of my peers. There are people older than me who have not moved out of the home, and make every excuse for lack of independence... I think it comes at the cost of their mental health in long-run...

I think some autonomy is better, relative to age obviously... but it helps to give children a chance to develop healthy codependency (which they'll need later to form social connections)... versus children who become sheltered and are expecting to have their decisions... boundaries are very important to instill too between parent and child...

The US lifestyle in general does tend to mean we are more often coddling kids at the expense of society... there was an article I read recently... will have to search for it again. But one comparison... in places in Europe, kids are allowed to walk to the store... that doesn't really happen all that much here, especially if the kids are raised middle class and higher.. it's been culturally ingrained over the past few decades for parents to fear every possible thing that could go wrong... so while my neighborhood when I was growing up, we would walk to the shops and we were a bit more "fearless" as children... many suburbs now look like ghost towns here because parents are simply afraid to take the chance and people have become unnecessarily paranoid imo...

It isn't very good, especially when we don't really have public transportation the way that Europe has it or certain areas of the country... everything is by car, so it just puts more strain on the parents. Moreover, we tend to have larger homes and as a result, much more privacy... so very easy for a child to go into their bedroom and just hide out for an entire summer... I remember going outside all the time when I was younger... but when I have kids, I worry about that because it has become so ingrained in our culture to be overprotective... my allowing kids more reign, like walking down the block... without parents who are on board, they'll have to do it alone and it's not really possible when people call the law here in suburbs for every silly reason... and then add in things like Nextdoor where people publicly shame parents/individuals for doing things that social deems "taboo"... is it even worth it with that taken into consideration?

I think the trend will go backwards as the next generation comes into the realization that with social media creating a lot of anxieties for the younger generation, and our tendency to be so easily manipulated by fear-mongering... something will have to give there with the rise in mental health problems for our younger folk... imo.

To my benefit, I live in a tropical climate with ample sunlight year-round. That can be a major boon for our local culture and I think it does help people to get more people outdoors... and with a higher minority pop, there's a more relaxed culture that does tend to focus around the families and neighborly get togethers... so my neighborhood is much more social as a result...

Anyway, food for thought... obviously consider my locale.

Related:

Have Smartphones Destroyed a Generation?
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...ration/534198/

The decline in dating tracks with a decline in sexual activity. The drop is the sharpest for ninth-graders, among whom the number of sexually active teens has been cut by almost 40 percent since 1991. The average teen now has had sex for the first time by the spring of 11th grade, a full year later than the average Gen Xer. Fewer teens having sex has contributed to what many see as one of the most positive youth trends in recent years: The teen birth rate hit an all-time low in 2016, down 67 percent since its modern peak, in 1991.

Even driving, a symbol of adolescent freedom inscribed in American popular culture, from Rebel Without a Cause to Ferris Bueller’s Day Off, has lost its appeal for today’s teens. Nearly all Boomer high-school students had their driver’s license by the spring of their senior year; more than one in four teens today still lack one at the end of high school. For some, Mom and Dad are such good chauffeurs that there’s no urgent need to drive. “My parents drove me everywhere and never complained, so I always had rides,” a 21-year-old student in San Diego told me. “I didn’t get my license until my mom told me I had to because she could not keep driving me to school.” She finally got her license six months after her 18th birthday. In conversation after conversation, teens described getting their license as something to be nagged into by their parents—a notion that would have been unthinkable to previous generations.

Oh good, I found that article... you might find it interesting, Ashley

How cultures around the world think about parenting
https://ideas.ted.com/how-cultures-a...out-parenting/

Craziness? Culture. In Japan, where Gross-Loh lives part of the year, she lets her 4-year-old daughter run errands with her 7-year-old sister and 11-year-old brother — without parental supervision. Her kids don’t hesitate to take the Tokyo subways by themselves and walk on busy streets alone, just like their Japanese peers. But when she comes back to the States, Gross-Loh doesn’t allow the same.

“If I let them out on their own like that in the U.S., I wouldn’t just get strange looks,” she says. “Somebody would call Child Protective Services.”

Both in Japan and Norway, parents are focused on cultivating independence. Children do things alone early, whether it’s walking to school or to the movies. The frames, however, are different. In Scandinavia, there is an emphasis on a democratic relationship between parents and children. In Sweden especially, the “rights” of a child are important. For example, a child has the “right” to access their parents’ bodies for comfort, and therefore should be allowed into their parents’ bed with them in the middle of the night. If a parent doesn’t allow them, they are both denying them their rights and being a neglectful parent. In parts of Asia, meanwhile, co-sleeping with a family member through late childhood is common. Korean parents spend more time holding their babies and having physical contact than most. But within a family, obedience is key — not democracy.

“We’re supposed to be raising our children to leave us,” she says. “They must develop self-reliance and resourcefulness and resilience, which is a challenge, because we must allow our children to make mistakes.”

I would've loved that lifestyle as a young'un ... I'm hugely independent... but very nurturing... will be a weird mix as a parent Lawnmower definitely parenting wouldn't work for me... I think the last paragraph in one of your quotes, Ashley, is quite sad... but it doesn't have to be at that extreme for a young to become emotionally stunted... maybe even semi-permanently.

Lawnmower parents are compared to the gardening tool because they cut down any obstacle that could stand in their child’s way. Notably, this is a parent who may no longer have the ability or access to remove their child from a problematic situation, therefore they do their “mowing” from a distance.

“At the college level, the physical presence required to hover may be limited, so we are now observing a different parenting style,” Karen Fancher, a professor at Duquesne University’s School of Pharmacy, wrote in the Pittsburgh Mom Blog. “These are the parents who rush ahead to intervene, saving the child from any potential inconvenience, problem or discomfort.”

[Underscore]

I myself had a moderate amount of autonomy... For example, I had a set bedtime, although it was flexible... I was allowed to go out with my friends to drink... but I had to be back by midnight... I was allowed to get pissed ... but don't get stupid. So moderacy

[AnnieK]

Age is a massive factor I think. My son is 7 so he has set bedtimes etc but I let him make decisions.on his free time - what activities he does, what parties he wants to go to etc. I want him to learn to be independent growing up and most importantly to never lie to me so I hope I'll give him enough freedom to do the things he wants whilst being safe and not having to tell me he is at a mates when he is out somewhere else. I don't want to be oblivious to his needs and stifle him but want him to be safe too.....getting that bit right is not easy though as I tend to be a bit neurotic too