[arista]

She gets a No.

[The UK government has formally
rejected a call from Scotland's
first minister for a
second independence referendum.
Prime Minister Boris Johnson said
a referendum would "continue the
political stagnation Scotland
has seen for the past decade".
And he said First Minister Nicola Sturgeon
had previously pledged that the 2014
referendum would be a "once in a generation" vote.
Ms Sturgeon tweeted that the Tories
were attempting to "deny democracy".]

Tough Titty TS.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotla...itics-51106796

[parmnion]

It would be silly to allow another for all sorts of reasons

[Tom4784]

Any Brexiter that demanded Brexit and made out that any attempts to oppose it is to oppose democracy YET oppose Scotland's right to choose whether they want to stay in the UK or not are complete and utter ****ing hypocrites and Boris is the king of their hypocritical kingdom.

Scotland voted overwhelmingly for the SNP which is anti-brexit and pro-Scotland's independence. The Tories dominance in the election was touted by brexiters as a sign that the public still want brexit yet they cover their eyes to the fact that Scotland is obviously telling us, in the same way, that they want an indyref.

Any brexiter that would oppose Scotland's demand for an indyref is a hypocrite and a poser who only pretends to care about democracy when it benefits them.

[Twosugars]

Well said Dezzy!

They only bleat about democracy when it suits them

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Scotland voted overwhelmingly for the SNP which is anti-brexit and pro-Scotland's independence.

55% of Scotland voted for pro-union parties.

[parmnion]

God save our gracious queen.

[Livia]

The last Scottish referendum was a "once in a lifetime vote". Having another one now because Nicola wants it isn't any more democratic than having a second Brexit referendum.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Livia

The last Scottish referendum was a "once in a lifetime vote". Having another one now because Nicola wants it isn't any more democratic than having a second Brexit referendum.

Very True
Livia.

[Tom4784]

Giving the people a choice will always be the democratic option. Trying to peddle that another vote would be undemocratic is actually senseless and an example of the Brexiter attitude of 'it's democracy if I say so but if you oppose me, you oppose democracy itself'.

Every vote that has ever been presented to the public is democratic, it doesn't stop being democratic just because it doesn't suit you.

[Ammi]

...for me ‘once in a lifetime’ and ‘democratic’ contradict each other...once in a lifetime is not conducive to democracy...democracy is representative of a majority public and that will always be open to change, depending on many factors...it doesn’t represent a ‘one day in their life public’...that would be for me, everything that democracy isn’t...’you made that choice/decision, you can’t change it...time can evolve things into a completely different scenario so that your choice is not the choice that you considered at the time...and we can make any changes to choices but you can’t...’...etc, etc...makes no sense at all in progressiveness of any society that considers itself democratic...in my humblest of opinions of course...

[Greg!]

Originally Posted by Livia

The last Scottish referendum was a "once in a lifetime vote". Having another one now because Nicola wants it isn't any more democratic than having a second Brexit referendum.

Ok but Nicola won a mandate from the people of Scotland to hold another referendum in the recent election. A much bigger mandate than Boris got for Brexit I might add.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Greg!

Ok but Nicola won a mandate from the people of Scotland to hold another referendum in the recent election. A much bigger mandate than Boris got for Brexit I might add.

How does that change the fact that the last referendum was a once in a lifetime vote? It didn't say it was a once in a lifetime vote, unless Nicola gets a particularly good result partially because Labour failed. And Boris has a mandate for something the people actually voted for last time.

[bitontheslide]

if Scotland truly want to be independent, they will be, Boris won't be able to stop it.

[arista]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

if Scotland truly want to be independent, they will be, Boris won't be able to stop it.

He will.

[bitontheslide]

you are wrong Arista

[arista]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

you are wrong Arista

You Are


They will try a Catalonia
style - which means non official

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

That is incorrect, it was Alex Salmond who a few days before the 2014 Scottish independence referendum, then-First Minister said that he felt the vote was a “once in a generation opportunity”. He said this in a TV interview, it was not policy or part of the ref, it was his own feeling.


This constantly gets dredged up as if this was part of the vote, it wasnt.


Before the ref equally, Nicola Sturgeon said that a significant and material change in circumstances – i.e. Britain voting to leave the EU – would justify a second ballot.

I dont see that comment being brought up by the PM, I wonder why?

Out of curiosity LT, what would you vote if you did get another referendum?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

i would decide on the basis of what was on offer at the time

No leaning either way?

[Cherie]

The problem with offering another referendum is that we all know if the result didn't differ from the last one, it wouldn't take that long before yet another one would be requested and on it would go...

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

The problem with offering another referendum is that we all know if the result didn't differ from the last one, it wouldn't take that long before yet another one would be requested and on it would go...

True but I think there's a case to be made this time because of Brexit and because EU membership was used the last time as a reason to stay within the UK, wasn't it?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

im a fair man so i would assess at the time and make my decision

Pleading the 5th?

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Livia

The last Scottish referendum was a "once in a lifetime vote". Having another one now because Nicola wants it isn't any more democratic than having a second Brexit referendum.

That time voting was undemocratic lol

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Withano

That time voting was undemocratic lol

Votes are only considered democratic if they benefit brexiters after all. Having votes they don't agree with is the height of anti-democracy in their eyes.

[Tom4784]

If the 'once in a lifetime' line was true, there would have been no EU ref since the last time we voted on the issue before 2016, we voted ourselves back in.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

True but I think there's a case to be made this time because of Brexit and because EU membership was used the last time as a reason to stay within the UK, wasn't it?

Well I would agree, but then its like the UK versus the EU, did they vote only for the good bits of staying in the UK? and my point is if it is the same result again, this will come up again and again.. I am all for them going btw