[arista]

The Education Secretary
has said today

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-53221741


[Mr Williamson, speaking on LBC,
said penalty fines for non-attendance
would be part of school being compulsory
again next term, unless there
were "good reasons" such as a
local spike in infections.
"We do have to get back into
compulsory education and
obviously fines sit alongside
as part of that," said England's
education secretary.]

[Ammi]

...(..so long as it’s not compulsory because each school is operating differently...)..a curriculum can’t really be taught by any school as that would give advantages of some pupils over others...so yeah, it’s to be expected really ...

[Ammi]

...the fines, though...?...I doubt the courts will give the time to enforce them...and what’s the point or merit in fining when so many will be unemployed and struggling ...the fines are dumb...

[Oliver_W]

tbh I wouldn't be surprised if a number of parents started home schooling full time. FB friends whose kids are a bit of a "handful" have been saying how much better their kids' attitudes are toward learning, how much more they're getting done and seem generally happier.

That said, the ones who've been saying that are the ones making an actual effort, instead of leaving them in front of screens all day and shoving all set work into one evening a week

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

tbh I wouldn't be surprised if a number of parents started home schooling full time. FB friends whose kids are a bit of a "handful" have been saying how much better their kids' attitudes are toward learning, how much more they're getting done and seem generally happier.

That said, the ones who've been saying that are the ones making an actual effort, instead of leaving them in front of screens all day and shoving all set work into one evening a week

...I guess that your experience may be different but I don’t know many who I think would be up for home schooling...when offered places to return, every single parent has been at the school gates, throwing their children over, while still reading the email......

[joeysteele]

I really don't think this rhetoric helps, at a time when there's still uncertainty about this virus.

Is he really telling Parents who have genuine worries about the safety of their children and in fact their own or even their Parents lives.
They should obey him, and disregard the proper welfare of their children.

Not that I'd expect any different rhetoric from Williamson however.

Hasn't taken long to get back to the hard-line attitude.

I equally don't see the point of fining people either.

For what, for saying they are concerned for the health and guaranteed safety of their children.
Any fining should be for the opposite.

[AnnieK]

Its a little early to say that it will be compulsory and fines in effect when we have no idea of the status of the virus....we could be in a state of lockdown again by september or we could be virus free. I would hope it would be more of an individual case basis, if the virus is still active in the community, parents with vulnerable children or other family members will rightly be nervous about sending them in and councils will be mindful of that.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

Its a little early to say that it will be compulsory and fines in effect when we have no idea of the status of the virus....we could be in a state of lockdown again by september or we could be virus free. I would hope it would be more of an individual case basis, if the virus is still active in the community, parents with vulnerable children or other family members will rightly be nervous about sending them in and councils will be mindful of that.

...it’ll be interesting for sure as the pod sizes will resume to full year groups...(...I’ll presume the virus will still be with us...)...so if anyone is ill/..showing any symptoms, the entire class plus staff will have to be sent home...I mean, that’s what happens now but the pods are obviously not full size yet...

[Cherie]

I heard the interview this morning, Gavin Williamson was asked if fines would be back in place as is routine for non attendance and he said yes unless there were exceptional circumstance, so it is just reinstating what was in place before the pandemic, it's no biggie really, if a parent wants to keep their kid at home they can say they are showing symptoms, like everyone else they have to return to some normality at some point

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Cherie

I heard the interview this morning, Gavin Williamson was asked if fines would be back in place as is routine for non attendance and he said yes unless there were exceptional circumstance, so it is just reinstating what was in place before the pandemic, it's no biggie really, if a parent wants to keep their kid at home they can say they are showing symptoms, like everyone else they have to return to some normality at some point

The pandemic is going nowhere likely for months at least or even a year or more.
What are his ' exceptional circumstances'.

I can't think of any better or stronger exceptional circumstances, than Parents caring about the guaranteed safety and health of their children.

I doubt Gavin Williamson would just allow the word, with no proof, from Parents,as to saying a child had symptoms either.

[Ammi]

...I’m doubtful the fines will be enforced anyway, they often haven’t tended to be because they’re an ill thought out thing.../...most schools are academy’s and they don’t have a universal policy on fining...our school hasn’t fined for years for example...but another local school in a different academy..?...tries to adhere a fine after just 1 day absence.../..it will be down to the school to decide on fining...

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...I’m doubtful the fines will be enforced anyway, they often haven’t tended to be because they’re an ill thought out thing.../...most schools are academy’s and they don’t have a universal policy on fining...our school hasn’t fined for years for example...but another local school in a different academy..?...tries to adhere a fine after just 1 day absence.../..it will be down to the school to decide on fining...

Some schools have gone silly on fines.
Then as you say some likely don't want to.

You are right Ammi, the fines are an ill thought out policy anyway.

I consider just about everything however, during the lifetime of this pandemic.
As being of exceptional circumstances.
Really sad and crazy times indeed.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Some schools have gone silly on fines.
Then as you say some likely don't want to.

You are right Ammi, the fines are an ill thought out policy anyway.

I consider just about everything however, during the lifetime of this pandemic.
As being of exceptional circumstances.
Really sad and crazy times indeed.

...yeah, these are ‘unprecedented times’ as the government themselves have said and from the beginning it’s been changing and adapting...and it changes and adapts for safeguarding/wellbeing reasons because it has to and fines will have to be flexible and reasonable too...I’m sure that everyone wants ‘normality’ at school for their children and their education...but wanting it or willing it won’t necessarily make it happen by September...

[Kazanne]

My children have been going to school for a while now, they are in bubbles and have been managed quite well , there are some children running feral on the streets ,vunerable or on their own etc ,so would be safer in school , I don't really see the panic as many were at the beaches etc ,which was crowded and no face masks or protection ,we cannot hide away forever, so unless a child has an underlying health problem I see no more danger in going to school than there ever was.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

The pandemic is going nowhere likely for months at least or even a year or more.
What are his ' exceptional circumstances'.

I can't think of any better or stronger exceptional circumstances, than Parents caring about the guaranteed safety and health of their children.

I doubt Gavin Williamson would just allow the word, with no proof, from Parents,as to saying a child had symptoms either.

I guess he means if they have symptoms or are ill? l kids are not usually fined for being off school ill so why would they now?

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Cherie

I guess he means if they have symptoms or are ill? l kids are not usually fined for being off school ill so why would they now?

You've a lot more faith in the thinking behind these policies than I'll ever have Cherie.

If he's intending to see Parents fined for absence from school.
You said, Parents could say they were ill.

This government doesn't take the word of Doctors on adults anymore.
I can't see where proof the child had symptoms or had it via a test, would not have to be the case to avoid possible fining of Parents..

While it's true some Parents will not be doing always the best for their children.
I'd expect the vast majority of Parents want the best for their children.
That they want them safe, secure and no health risks.

Yes, there'll be Parents who just let their children go back to school believing the government they are safe.
Equally so, there'll be Parents, no less caring who genuinely are concerned for the safety and health of their children.

During this pandemic, for those Parents, in my view, threats of fines are not the nicest rhetoric to use.

I'm sure, or I hope, those Parents happy for their children to return to school, are not hailed above those Parents with genuine concerns who would be nervous wrecks worrying while their child was forced to be in school

During this pandemic,both of those scenarios of Parents, doesn't make either of the sets of Parents better than the other.

Threats of fines, I believe in my view, to be an unnecessary and wrong line to take against Parents.

Just my view.
I obviously haven't any children but I worry for my great Nephews and Nieces.
In this current climate at this moment in time, had I any children of my own.
They would not be going back to school in even September for me.
Unless their full safety, security and health in relation to this virus, was guaranteed.

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

My children have been going to school for a while now, they are in bubbles and have been managed quite well , there are some children running feral on the streets ,vunerable or on their own etc ,so would be safer in school , I don't really see the panic as many were at the beaches etc ,which was crowded and no face masks or protection ,we cannot hide away forever, so unless a child has an underlying health problem I see no more danger in going to school than there ever was.

My son has not been in school, nor has he been near a beach, park or on the streets or with any friends. We have basically shielded the whole lockdown. My worry is, as a single parent who works full time, I rely on my dad to help with pick up / drop off. My dad is over 70 and has been shielding with a shielding letter due to having had a heart problem. That's my worry about sending him back to school....not for his health per se but for what he could inadvertantly pass on

[Toy Soldier]

I don't think physical attendance should be mandatory but I do think "attendance in some form" should be. There's no reason that teachers can't run a hybrid classroom/digital classroom and so long as the work is being done and kids attending remotely are actually online during school hours, there should be no reason to pursue & fine people.

The sad reality though is that lots of parents just haven't been ensuring that their kids do the online learning - about 20% of my daughter's class - and that's a good school in an affluent area. There are two kids who have not been seen/heard from AT ALL by the teacher since March, and they had to ask other kids in the class if they had heard from them to check on their wellbeing. The issue isn't tech availability either, as they're on snapchat/whatsapp/online games etc. so other kids were able to confirm that these kids are fine. Just not doing school. At all.

So, I definitely think there needs to be a mechanism in place to make sure kids are attending in some form.

Assuming nothing dramatically changes here, kids are going back full time in August, which I'm happy enough with given the numbers here. I have to say though, I wouldn't be happy sending them back if we still lived in NW England.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

My son has not been in school, nor has he been near a beach, park or on the streets or with any friends. We have basically shielded the whole lockdown. My worry is, as a single parent who works full time, I rely on my dad to help with pick up / drop off. My dad is over 70 and has been shielding with a shielding letter due to having had a heart problem. That's my worry about sending him back to school....not for his health per se but for what he could inadvertantly pass on

Yes I get that Annie about your dad,my mom picks mine up when we can't,but as far as I know she has no underlying conditions,the children are not sent out altogether like they used to be they come out at different times,so there are no crowds of parents waiting like usual, so it's worked OK for me, its difficult if your dad has an underlying conditions surely you would be exempt from any fines due to your position, I hope so anyway.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

My son has not been in school, nor has he been near a beach, park or on the streets or with any friends. We have basically shielded the whole lockdown. My worry is, as a single parent who works full time, I rely on my dad to help with pick up / drop off. My dad is over 70 and has been shielding with a shielding letter due to having had a heart problem. That's my worry about sending him back to school....not for his health per se but for what he could inadvertantly pass on

Spot on for me this.

Of course they are stopping the shielding too on 1st August.
For the more vulnerable sick and elderly.

I'm sorry but for me there's at this time far too much uncertainty around this virus.
Even to new flare ups now.

It's no good ' thinking ' it's safe for this, that or the other.
No risks should taken until much more is known.
With everything secure and in place.

'Knowing' over ' thinking ' the better way for me.

Your worries re your Dad are commendable.
I hold the same worries for my own Mum.

I agree with TS too re schooling in some form to be done of course.
Preferably home schooling.
I'm surprised more of that hasn't been put in place anyway all these months really.

[arista]

Williamson is live in Parliament
in a few mins.

[arista]

He is Live now
also, on LBC

[arista]

Labour's Kate Green MP
their New Shadow Education Sec ., is talking



LBC reports Teaching Unions
not happy with his plans.

[Nicky91]

with all honesty parents should not be fined, if they are still too scared of sending their children back to school

quite a few parents here in Netherlands still keep their children at home, because they don't feel comfortable yet sending them to school this soon

[arista]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

with all honesty parents should not be fined, if they are still too scared of sending their children back to school

quite a few parents here in Netherlands still keep their children at home, because they don't feel comfortable yet sending them to school this soon

Typical of the Dutch