[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

Shocked to see Niamh defending Ann and her views.

[DouglasS]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Honestly I think people are deliberately misrepresenting what Cherie (and TS) have said, it isn't about Ann or defending her and saying she shouldn't be called out for being a bigot ........because she is, what she said is offensive and divisive. The issue is the use of sexist(and ageist) insults which are insulting to women in general, it's not ok to use racist or homophobic insults against people just because they're assholes so why doesn't the same apply about sexist slurs? It's about the use of sexist words in general as a way to insult anyone.

********I AM NOT DEFENDING ANN OR ANY OF HER VIEWS

Exactly. I really struggle to follow some of the logic people have posted.

Cherie saying resorting to slurs / offensive insults to other groups of people is not the best way to go about things = not understanding the point or being homophobic According to some??

It’s the exact same logic as saying I am against animal cruelty and so that means I disagree with trans rights... (Aka no logic between the two points at all)

There is LITERALLY no logic in some posters posts in here, they have tried to put words into cheries mouth (and when called out merely state they are just posting or it’s a different battle... well no, if you’re posting nonsense expect to be called out is my view)

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Cherie

you claimed people were defending her when nothing of the sort was happening, if you are going to make these claims you have to back them up, engage with me, don't engage with me that is your perogative

No I don't.
Plus I've answered you by saying clearly I stand by what I've said.
That's in relation to what I've read and seen.

It is my right to engage or not to with anyone on here and that's what I will do too, thank you for reminding me.

It's good protection to do so.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

x2

[The Slim Reaper]

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Cherie

The LGBTQ community fought long and hard against offensive references, stereotyping and slurs so its disappointing to see those tools that were used against them for so long used by some to make a point.

More false equivalence.

'Yeah, this bigot may have done everything in her power to harm LGBT people but LGBT people are just as bad for calling her names when she continues to be bigoted!'

Utter bull****.

[DouglasS]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

More false equivalence.

'Yeah, this bigot may have done everything in her power to harm LGBT people but LGBT people are just as bad for calling her names when she continues to be bigoted!'

Utter bull****.

Never once did Cherie say people are just as bad... nor did she make that point

Once again the point Cherie made was LGBT have undergone decades of having slurs thrown at them and being called offensive words on the basis of being gay. And that those people especially would understand that generalising a whole population with slurs gets you nowhere/ is ridiculous...

Saying she is old and irrelevant / going to die soon and other slurs for being old isn’t helping the cause.. if anything it’s harming the cause as people will (wrongly may I add) read your comments and think how childish and go the other way

there are other ways to argue your point other than insulting large communities, hopefully you can learn from this

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

[Liam-]

Yeah, I’m not going to lose sleep over someone who would be quite happy to see all of my rights stripped away, because of the gender I’m attracted to, being called some nasty names, it’s time to normalise minorities not having to tolerate bigotry because ‘everyone is allowed an opinion’, we’re expected to just be nice and grateful we don’t get put in prison anymore

[Nicky91]

also lol, when Ann is in the minority here, since a lot of people look forward to seeing Nicola & Katya

and it is the second time she aims for Katya, after that one time she wanted her and Seann banned from the show after that kiss

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by DouglasS

Never once did Cherie say people are just as bad... nor did she make that point

Once again the point Cherie made was LGBT have undergone decades of having slurs thrown at them and being called offensive words on the basis of being gay. And that those people especially would understand that generalising a whole population with slurs gets you nowhere/ is ridiculous...

Saying she is old and irrelevant / going to die soon and other slurs for being old isn’t helping the cause.. if anything it’s harming the cause as people will (wrongly may I add) read your comments and think how childish and go the other way

there are other ways to argue your point other than insulting large communities, hopefully you can learn from this

Indeed, you and Niamh got what I meant right on the nail...thank you

[Nicky91]

what is the correct way of debating then?

cuz i'm pretty much confused now either


i understand sexist, ageist and other slurs are wrong, but what is the correct way then?

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Liam-

Yeah, I’m not going to lose sleep over someone who would be quite happy to see all of my rights stripped away, because of the gender I’m attracted to, being called some nasty names, it’s time to normalise minorities not having to tolerate bigotry because ‘everyone is allowed an opinion’, we’re expected to just be nice and grateful we don’t get put in prison anymore

Pretty much, the constant false equivalence annoys me endlessly. Insulting someone isn't akin to trying to impede and strip people of their rights.

I'm not gonna clutch my pearls over a bigot getting dragged.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Indeed, you and Niamh got what I meant right on the nail...thank you

Still false equivalence, nothing that other person has said changes that.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Still false equivalence, nothing that other person has said changes that.

What do you mean by false equivalence though? Do you mean women in general haven't suffered as bad as gay people in the past? (and present depending on where you live) or are you talking specifically about Ann Widdecomb?

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

What do you mean by false equivalence though? Do you mean women in general haven't suffered as bad as gay people in the past? (and present depending on where you live) or are you talking specifically about Ann Widdecomb?

It's the whole trying to make the LGBT look hypocritical for lashing out at bigots when those bigots have repressed us. People clutching their pearls being all like 'We shouldn't call her names', whether they realise it or not, are engaging in false equivalence by saying we're being just as bad when it's not comparable at all.

She has done everything she can to impede and hurt LGBT people, we are entitled to our anger.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

It's the whole trying to make the LGBT look hypocritical for lashing out at bigots when those bigots have repressed us. People clutching their pearls being all like 'We shouldn't call her names', whether they realise it or not, are engaging in false equivalence by saying we're being just as bad when it's not comparable at all.

She has done everything she can to impede and hurt LGBT people, we are entitled to our anger.

She should definitely be called names I think and bigot is a very fitting one. I just take exception at sexist insults, no matter what the situation because it's hurtful for women in general I believe (w***e, slut etc are my personal least favourites). I'm in no way saying people shouldn't be angry with her and call her out on remarks like this.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

She should definitely be called names I think and bigot is a very fitting one. I just take exception at sexist insults, no matter what the situation because it's hurtful for women in general I believe (w***e, slut etc are my personal least favourites). I'm in no way saying people shouldn't be angry with her and call her out on remarks like this.

So if the the gay community are angered by a black person holding bigoted views they can legitimately employ racist language as a way of conveying anger? That’s what is being said I believe or is it only sexist and ageist comments that can be utilsed which makes the point even more biazarre than it already is

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

So if the the gay community are angered by a black person holding bigoted views they can legitimately employ racist language as a way of conveying anger? That’s what is being said I believe or is it only sexist and ageist comments that can be utilsed which makes the point even more biazarre than it already is

Yeah that's what I'm saying, sexism just seems to be not as frowned upon as others when in reality women through history have had as ****ty a time as other oppressed groups

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah that's what I'm saying, sexism just seems to be not as frowned upon as others when in reality women through history have had as ****ty a time as other oppressed groups

Agree with you, I will join Nicky in the confused corner...is it a tiered system maybe

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

She should definitely be called names I think and bigot is a very fitting one. I just take exception at sexist insults, no matter what the situation because it's hurtful for women in general I believe (w***e, slut etc are my personal least favourites). I'm in no way saying people shouldn't be angry with her and call her out on remarks like this.

Luckily I didn't see anyone here calling her either of those.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Cherie

So if the the gay community are angered by a black person holding bigoted views they can legitimately employ racist language as a way of conveying anger? That’s what is being said I believe or is it only sexist and ageist comments that can be utilsed which makes the point even more biazarre than it already is

More false equivalency and just a plain ludicrous attack tbh by suggesting gay people would be racist towards bigots.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Luckily I didn't see anyone here calling her either of those.

Not those ones no, hag was one though which is a popular sexist slur for women over probably 30 at this stage

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Not those ones no, hag was one though which is a popular sexist slur for women over probably 30 at this stage

A hag is a witch, is she not a witch?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Liam-

A hag is a witch, is she not a witch?

What does hag mean in slang?
What does hag mean? Historically, a hag is an old, ugly woman with evil powers. Much like witches, crones, and banshees, hag has become a sexist insult degrading women.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hag