[bitontheslide]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Meh. People won't remember this in 2024.

the mid terms are next year ... it really depends on the scale of the fallout. If there is even a sniff of a terrorist attack against the usa, the dems are finished for a generation

[Denver]

Originally Posted by Alf

All I'm saying is, this wouldn't be happening under Trump.

You do realise this is happening because of him?

[The Slim Reaper]

I don't think people really understand, that the only reason this is actually happening, is because it is overwhelmingly popular with the American public. Even 60% of dems approved the move. The needle might shift on that, of course, but at the moment, that's where it's at.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Also, Biden wont admit it, but he is much closer to trump politically than he makes out.

It's the only reason he ended up running. On balance it's still the right decision because we have world-ending issues coming into frame that Trump/Republicans in general don't believe in or give a **** about. We could have had several people 10x better but when it comes right down to it, Trump had to go.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Denver

You do realise this is happening because of him?

It's a bit early in the day to be drunk.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

I don't think people really understand, that the only reason this is actually happening, is because it is overwhelmingly popular with the American public. Even 60% of dems approved the move. The needle might shift on that, of course, but at the moment, that's where it's at.

Bollox, it's because they're uncivilised, religious nut-jobs

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

the mid terms are next year ... it really depends on the scale of the fallout. If there is even a sniff of a terrorist attack against the usa, the dems are finished for a generation

America is so polarized that I don't think this could be true for either party. I mean Bush increased popularity after 9/11 and the republicans, less than a year ago attempted a coup, and dems are still dems, and repubs are still repubs.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Alf

Bollox, it's because they're uncivilised, religious nut-jobs

The Taliban aren't much better to be fair.

[bitontheslide]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

America is so polarized that I don't think this could be true for either party. I mean Bush increased popularity after 9/11 and the republicans, less than a year ago attempted a coup, and dems are still dems, and repubs are still repubs.

well the world is basically ****ed up, so there is that

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

I don't think people really understand, that the only reason this is actually happening, is because it is overwhelmingly popular with the American public. Even 60% of dems approved the move. The needle might shift on that, of course, but at the moment, that's where it's at.

It's not even surprising really, a 20 year occupation is ludicrous, but withdrawal should have been 1) started years ago (not even on Trump this one, it should have been in motion with Obama), 2) better organised, and 3) the entire political rebuilding of Afghanistan should have been handled better from the word go. The people and systems that were put in place were corrupt to the core, shady deals all round, and that is the main reason the Taliban have any support at all in the general Afghan population.

This is a failing that spans Bush to Biden and trying to absolve any of the 4 of blame is pointless.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

well the world is basically ****ed up, so there is that

[LeatherTrumpet]

Joe Biden bears a grave responsibility for the chaos in Afghanistan

The President’s handling of this sorry affair raises serious questions about his
ability to lead America and the free world


Joe Biden’s attempts to deflect blame away from the White House for the
Taliban’s seizure of power in Afghanistan are utterly lacking in conviction.
While the US President insists that he stands “squarely” by his unilateral
decision to withdraw American forces, the country’s rapid descent into chaos
since the fall of Kabul at the weekend suggests it has been nothing short of a
disaster, both for the future of the Afghan people and for America’s world
standing.

The President attempted to shift the blame onto his predecessor Donald
Trump, who negotiated the original deal with the Taliban, the Doha
Agreement, in February last year, and which laid the groundwork for
America’s military withdrawal. Mr Biden has also criticised the Afghan people
themselves for not heeding his call, made last week, to unite and “fight for
themselves”.

Mr Trump’s Taliban deal was far from perfect, as it was negotiated without
involving Afghanistan’s democratically-elected government. Nevertheless, the
basis of the agreement was that the completion of America’s military
withdrawal was contingent on the Taliban reaching a peace deal with Afghan
President Ashraf Ghani.

This vital requirement became obsolete the moment Mr Biden announced
that America was ending its 20-year-long involvement in Afghanistan in time
for next month’s anniversary of the September 11 attacks, which prompted
Washington’s military intervention in the first place.

With Afghanistan’s principal ally withdrawing its support at such a critical
juncture, it is perhaps hardly surprising that the country’s beleaguered
security forces lost the will to fight, and Mr Biden’s casual dismissal of their
efforts makes the American leader appear callous and uncaring.

Indeed, the President’s handling of this sorry affair raises serious questions
about his competence both as the leader of the free world and as America’s
commander-in-chief. Mr Biden assumed power in January promising to bring
political stability to Washington after the turbulence of the Trump era. Yet his
bungling of America’s exit from Afghanistan has resulted in the US suffering
arguably the greatest blow to its global prestige since Vietnam in the 1970s.
Mr Biden looks increasingly like a weak and isolated president, one whose
political fortunes may have suffered irreparable damage.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/...s-afghanistan/

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It's not even surprising really, a 20 year occupation is ludicrous, but withdrawal should have been 1) started years ago (not even on Trump this one, it should have been in motion with Obama), 2) better organised, and 3) the entire political rebuilding of Afghanistan should have been handled better from the word go. The people and systems that were put in place were corrupt to the core, shady deals all round, and that is the main reason the Taliban have any support at all in the general Afghan population.

This is a failing that spans Bush to Biden and trying to absolve any of the 4 of blame is pointless.

No argument from me on this.

[Alf]

While your attention is on this, election fraud is being exposed.

[jet]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

No it isn't. I'm pointing out that what the Taliban is doing is nothing new.

...and I was reminding you that contributions from other countries are by no means the only way that the Taliban fund their terrorism as you didn't mention it.

[bitontheslide]

Originally Posted by Alf

While your attention is on this, election fraud is being exposed.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

I don't think people really understand, that the only reason this is actually happening, is because it is overwhelmingly popular with the American public. Even 60% of dems approved the move. The needle might shift on that, of course, but at the moment, that's where it's at.

The American people do not like to be humiliated and this is a humiliation and to add salt to the wound 9/21 will be forever linked with 9/11

[Alf]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

I'm afraid your shutdown tactics don't work on a free person.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by jet

...and I was reminding you that contributions from other countries are by no means the only way that the Taliban fund their terrorism as you didn't mention it.

The Taliban aren't a world terrorist threat. Like i said, it's the Saudis mainly, but there's a reason that we cow-tow to them who also treat their citizens appallingly, versus turning the Taliban into terror poster boys.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Cherie

The American people do not like to be humiliated and this is a humiliation and to add salt to the wound 9/21 will be forever linked with 9/11

They voted for trump, who then defended Putin against his own intelligence service. I'm pretty sure they're used to a bit of humiliation.

[bitontheslide]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

I don't think people really understand, that the only reason this is actually happening, is because it is overwhelmingly popular with the American public. Even 60% of dems approved the move. The needle might shift on that, of course, but at the moment, that's where it's at.

of course it's popular, it would be popular here to if the withdrawal had gone well. I don't think most americans expected the catastrophe that panned out. I don't think i have ever heard the tories directly criticize america in the HoC before, and there was plenty of it today

[jet]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Joe Biden bears a grave responsibility for the chaos in Afghanistan

The President’s handling of this sorry affair raises serious questions about his
ability to lead America and the free world


Joe Biden’s attempts to deflect blame away from the White House for the
Taliban’s seizure of power in Afghanistan are utterly lacking in conviction.
While the US President insists that he stands “squarely” by his unilateral
decision to withdraw American forces, the country’s rapid descent into chaos
since the fall of Kabul at the weekend suggests it has been nothing short of a
disaster, both for the future of the Afghan people and for America’s world
standing.

The President attempted to shift the blame onto his predecessor Donald
Trump, who negotiated the original deal with the Taliban, the Doha
Agreement, in February last year, and which laid the groundwork for
America’s military withdrawal. Mr Biden has also criticised the Afghan people
themselves for not heeding his call, made last week, to unite and “fight for
themselves”.

Mr Trump’s Taliban deal was far from perfect, as it was negotiated without
involving Afghanistan’s democratically-elected government. Nevertheless, the
basis of the agreement was that the completion of America’s military
withdrawal was contingent on the Taliban reaching a peace deal with Afghan
President Ashraf Ghani.

This vital requirement became obsolete the moment Mr Biden announced
that America was ending its 20-year-long involvement in Afghanistan in time
for next month’s anniversary of the September 11 attacks, which prompted
Washington’s military intervention in the first place.

With Afghanistan’s principal ally withdrawing its support at such a critical
juncture, it is perhaps hardly surprising that the country’s beleaguered
security forces lost the will to fight, and Mr Biden’s casual dismissal of their
efforts makes the American leader appear callous and uncaring.

Indeed, the President’s handling of this sorry affair raises serious questions
about his competence both as the leader of the free world and as America’s
commander-in-chief. Mr Biden assumed power in January promising to bring
political stability to Washington after the turbulence of the Trump era. Yet his
bungling of America’s exit from Afghanistan has resulted in the US suffering
arguably the greatest blow to its global prestige since Vietnam in the 1970s.
Mr Biden looks increasingly like a weak and isolated president, one whose
political fortunes may have suffered irreparable damage.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/...s-afghanistan/

Absolutely agree with this. Biden must take the brunt of the responsibility, he is the President NOW and his actions alone decided the final outcome.
He is unfit for office and always was.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by jet

Absolutely agree with this. Biden must take the brunt of the responsibility, he is the President NOW and his actions alone decided the final outcome.
He is unfit for office and always was.

Don't worry, he didn't win, the evidence is out there. Trump has it all, it was a sting job.

[bitontheslide]

can you imagine the next time america want to go in and intervene in a country on their promise of vast investment etc, it's not going to happen

[Alf]

War is very, very profitable to war-mongers. Not to mention it reduces the population, which is something we know the deep state wants.