[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'm not talking about the petrol specifically, I'm talking about the HGV goods transport crisis that is ongoing and escalating. All of the smaller issues are just symptoms of that larger one.

If there is money to be made truck drivers will just switch my brother in law drives a hi ab hgv for travis

I can drive an hgv so can my brother if it gets that bad people will switch jobs
It’s not like there is going to be no one around maybe more women will drive hgv’s

There are plenty of women already driving hgv horse boxes

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Effects of Brexit truly starting to hit now. It’s quite worrying and only going to get worse.

Do we need those unelected rich people to hold our hands and do things and organise things for us.

Are us people in the UK really that incapable of functioning.

How come other non EU countries can function, but we're incapable? What's so special about us?

[bots]

you can name any number of things that are affected by a driver shortage. The crucial point is that there is not a supply shortage, there is a delay in goods arriving, which is manageable in 99% of cases. Obviously high demand for something in a hotspot will lead to a shortage, but so what. The media are making the problem worse. Get everyone into a panic about a shortage so that they rush out and buy and create a shortage. Honestly, the media have so much to answer for. They have always been bad, but since covid arrived, they have been completely irresponsible

[Tom4784]

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[Tom4784]

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[Alf]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

People who supported brexit were actually just supporting better tax treatment for the rich. You act like this is some great movement of independence but you voted to lick the feet of the rich and to put everyone's rights at risk. Well done. Be sure to lick inbetween the toes, you don't want to make your masters mad!

The thing is, the only person stopping you from moving to live inside the EU, is you. Our country decided it doesn't want to, but nobody is stopping you.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Alf

Do we need those unelected rich people to hold our hands and do things and organise things for us.

Are us people in the UK really that incapable of functioning.

How come other non EU countries can function, but we're incapable? What's so special about us?

The problem isn't "not having the EU" or being unable to organise it, it's that we WERE in the EU for so long and then, on top of that, that the UK government failed to properly prepare for Brexit once they knew it was happening.

It's not that we "can't" have enough UK-based HGV drivers... it's just that we currently don't. A large chunk of our HGV capacity was staffed by European drivers who now no longer want to haul in the UK because there's so much red tape it isn't worth it for them. Yes we will EVENTUALLY overcome that blip but in the meantime, pretending it isn't a big (and increasing) problem doesn't do anyone any good.

Even the most ardent Brexit supporter should be pissed off about situations like this - we had years to address these upcoming problems between the Brexit vote and the actual implementation of Brexit. Years to consider the lack of HGV drivers. Years to consider the lack of Nursing staff, etc... the government continually kicked those issues into the long grass, pretending it wasn't going to be a problem. And here we are, late 2021... it is becoming a problem. We don't need them to be having a focus on training up more HGV drivers "now" - we needed them to do that as soon as we knew we'd be losing workers from the EU. 5 years ago.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Alf

The thing is, the only person stopping you from moving to live inside the EU, is you. Our country decided it doesn't want to, but nobody is stopping you.

Brexit/leaving the EU meant an end to free movement for residence/work within Europe ... that was a pretty big part of the whole deal. So this is all just... incorrect. A British citizen can't just decide to up sticks and live in mainland Europe. You could have before Brexit. You now cannot.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The problem isn't "not having the EU" or being unable to organise it, it's that we WERE in the EU for so long and then, on top of that, that the UK government failed to properly prepare for Brexit once they knew it was happening.

It's not that we "can't" have enough UK-based HGV drivers... it's just that we currently don't. A large chunk of our HGV capacity was staffed by European drivers who now no longer want to haul in the UK because there's so much red tape it isn't worth it for them. Yes we will EVENTUALLY overcome that blip but in the meantime, pretending it isn't a big (and increasing) problem doesn't do anyone any good.

Even the most ardent Brexit supporter should be pissed off about situations like this - we had years to address these upcoming problems between the Brexit vote and the actual implementation of Brexit. Years to consider the lack of HGV drivers. Years to consider the lack of Nursing staff, etc... the government continually kicked those issues into the long grass, pretending it wasn't going to be a problem. And here we are, late 2021... it is becoming a problem. We don't need them to be having a focus on training up more HGV drivers "now" - we needed them to do that as soon as we knew we'd be losing workers from the EU. 5 years ago.

You can be pi55ed off about things, but to blame it on brexit is just taking short cuts, the easy way out, making excuses.

There's swings and roundabouts.

[Tom4784]

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[Tom4784]

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[Alf]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

He says, while making excuses for the damage that Brexit has caused.

I know denying reality is your thing, Alf, but denial does nothing. We're in this mess because of uninformed dumbasses operating on their base instincts and voting against their own interests.

Yeah, let's put you in charge Dezzy.

You've basically been calling for apartheid in our country, from the vaxed and the unvaxed. You want people to never be allowed medical treatment. You've called for deprogrammimg human beings.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Alf

Yeah, let's put you in charge Dezzy.

You've basically been calling for apartheid in our country, from the vaxed and the unvaxed. You want people to never be allowed medical treatment. You've called for deprogrammimg human beings.

Unvaxed are a problem, though

[Alf]

Originally Posted by arista

Unvaxed are a problem, though

According to a report by CNN the CDC says the vaxed are equally, repeat equally a problem.

I posted the report in the Covid thread.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by arista

Unvaxed are a problem, though

Have you made a thread yet arista about China taking back Taiwan

[Parumpapapump]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

People who supported brexit were actually just supporting better tax treatment for the rich. You act like this is some great movement of independence but you voted to lick the feet of the rich and to put everyone's rights at risk. Well done. Be sure to lick inbetween the toes, you don't want to make your masters mad!

Maybe alfs rich as well.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Alf

You can be pi55ed off about things, but to blame it on brexit is just taking short cuts, the easy way out, making excuses.

There's swings and roundabouts.

But there is no other route in this case - the HGV driver shortage is linked to Brexit, there's no two ways about that. You can either blame it on Brexit happening at all (which would be a "Remainer" stance), or on the failure of the government to adequately prepare for leaving the EU once the vote had happened (the "Brexiteer" stance) as they had 4+ years to do this, and failed, they're only just trying to address it now.

There's just no way to claim that the UK's current haulage problems are not Brexit-related.

[Parumpapapump]

There is a shortage crisis of 400 thousand lorry drivers in Europe..you cant blame this solely on brexit.

[Christmas Dynamo]

So how can shippers avoid getting caught up in delays?
Paul Ferguson, Sales Director for John Good Logistics, has this advice, “We’ve been recommending customers use Northern ports such as Liverpool, especially those based in the North West.”

Since Liverpool opened its deepwater Liverpool2 terminal in 2016 it offers enlarged terminal capacity, an absence of demurrage and detention charges and faster truck turnaround times and available haulage.

Paul continues, “Shipping to Liverpool is often dismissed as not being viable because any cost saving can be outweighed by the additional transit time of 4-5 days. However, with the current issues regarding port congestion following the issues Felixstowe faced with the new IT systems and the general shortage of haulage in the industry, the delays and disruption being experienced on arrival at many of the UK’s main ports mean the door to door transits are now comparative. This is not just Liverpool but other UK feeder ports such as Immingham, Teeside and Grangemouth, which, are all now becoming more attractive propositions.

Additional benefits include a reduction in road miles and of course the environmental benefits also associated with this kind of move. For customers of John Good Logistics, we can also offer flexible haulage options because we operate our own trailers in the UK.”

https://goodlogisticsgroup.com/uk-ha...lage-problems/

problems always have solutions

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

But there is no other route in this case - the HGV driver shortage is linked to Brexit, there's no two ways about that. You can either blame it on Brexit happening at all (which would be a "Remainer" stance), or on the failure of the government to adequately prepare for leaving the EU once the vote had happened (the "Brexiteer" stance) as they had 4+ years to do this, and failed, they're only just trying to address it now.

There's just no way to claim that the UK's current haulage problems are not Brexit-related.

We could have been 3 years further advanced if it wasn't for all the people trying to overturn the result of the referendum, holding us back. And then when we finally seal the deal, the situation the World now finds itself in, starts.

There's always going to be creases to iron out. The first step is to accept we've left, and we're not likely to be returning in our lifetimes. Then we can get on with doing what's best for us.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Alf

There's always going to be creases to iron out. The first step is to accept we've left, and we're not likely to be returning in our lifetimes. Then we can get on with doing what's best for us.

I agree to an extent but that has largely been the case since late 2019. There's a case to be made that Covid complicated matters not long after that, and that "everything else being kicked into the long grass" for most of 2020, then hitting mid 2021 and realising "wups we forgot to do anything else" is also a huge part of the problem, but at the end of the day, the buck stops with the same people anyway. There was a clear failure to adequately prep, no matter what else was going on. I honestly don't understand why both Remainers and Brexit supporters wouldn't be united in being annoyed about that. Other than the tribalism (i.e. "any acceptance of fair criticism = ceding ground to the enemy") that goes on in every topic.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Alf

According to a report by CNN the CDC says the vaxed are equally, repeat equally a problem.

I posted the report in the Covid thread.

this is fact manipulation again. Vaccinated people can still catch and transmit covid, but their chances of doing so are much reduced compared to those unvaccinated.

It has never been the case that the vaccine stopped you getting or transmitting covid.

[Parumpapapump]

All the vaccine does is hide the fact you have covid and that you are at risk of spreading covid because it reduces the symptoms.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

this is fact manipulation again. Vaccinated people can still catch and transmit covid, but their chances of doing so are much reduced compared to those unvaccinated.

It has never been the case that the vaccine stopped you getting or transmitting covid.

As I've said before there is an interesting transmission possibility "side effect", I guess, with vaccines. It's been proven quite thoroughly that in cases where vaccinated people do become infected, and thus infectious, they are more likely than unvaccinated people to be completely symptomless, and thus a higher likelihood that they will never even test and may never know that they were carrying Covid, having never gotten ill themself. Thus, they won't have isolated or taken extra precautions, as they will have been oblivious to the presence of Covid.

It's mitigated slightly by other factors and not really much you can do about it - but this is basically why they advise school-aged teens taking regular lateral flow tests, as they may be covid+ without any symptoms at all. A friend of mine (well, an old friend from my school days, I saw it on his Facebook) had a letter from his kids school saying someone had tested positive and to test... both of his kids (aged 9 and 12) tested positive... he had to keep them at home for 2 weeks and neither of them developed so much as a sniffle.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

this is fact manipulation again. Vaccinated people can still catch and transmit covid, but their chances of doing so are much reduced compared to those unvaccinated.

It has never been the case that the vaccine stopped you getting or transmitting covid.

Nah, what it is, is narrative breakdown.