[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Alf

Only if they have to pay for the wages of the support workers, the counseling, the rent of the facilities and the medication, out of their own pockets, If not, then they should go to prison like the rest of us would have to. Or would they just get all that for nothing at the tax payers expense?

Sounds more like a weekend break at a luxury spa instead of paying for your crimes.

We tax payers pay for them to languish in prison, come out, re-offend and then go back to prison where we tax payers pay again where they get access to career criminals, drugs, hooch, education etc etc.

I'm not talking about rehab just for Katie Price, I think it would be more beneficial for addicts who have not caused injury, death or property destruction to anyone but themselves. Obviously, there is very little option if they have caused damage to property or other people, then prison is the only right way to go for the victims sake.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

I don't think prison is always the answer for addicts - as people have said they will not get rehabilitation in their, they will have their addictions fed - usually by stronger drugs and hooch.

Mandatory, secure rehab is the answer in my opinion. Somewhere where they can't leave but have access to the relevant support, counseling and controlled meds. A 3 month stint isn't going to be enough for a lifelong addict.

I agree with all that Annie.
You are right about prisons too.

People go to prison who haven't touched drugs but then get introduced to by having them given in there.
It's a way of a coping mechanism of being in prison.

Yes however, I totally agree with your second paragraph.

[rusticgal]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

Until the addiction is treated though she will probably continue to re-offend. 6 months inside will do nothing to stop her getting into a 2 ton car again when she gets out to score more drugs / booze if she is still addicted.

You dont really know what effect prison has on you...believe me there are many that go there and vow never to go there again. To have your freedom taken away from you...being told what to do...watching your loved ones have to endure visiting procedures...the shame...the embarrassment. It can teach some people a very valuable lesson..it can be a massive deterrent. Shes had loads of therapy and its clearly not working. If she kills someone it will not only ruin innocent lives but it could also be the end of hers.

[Alf]

Would a better plan be to investigate the corruption of people (prison officers) who bring the drugs into those places.

If you don't want drugs in prison then it's pretty easy to stop it, especially with all the technology available.

Sniffer dogs are always keen and looking for work.

[rusticgal]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

People go to prison who haven't touched drugs but then get introduced to by having them given in there.
It's a way of a coping mechanism of being in prison.

But we are not talking about these people...we are talking about a celebrity that has addictions and keeps breaking the law. Shes not stealing from a sweet shop, shes driving whilst banned and high on drink and drugs and could have killed someone....and its far from the first time. Being pampered by experts at The Priory clearly isnt working... Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind when being kind doesnt work...let her endure the shame of prison and see if that works. Let her have a taste of what could be a very long sentance if she continues to break the law and maybe kill someone.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Alf

Would a better plan be to investigate the corruption of people (prison officers) who bring the drugs into those places.

If you don't want drugs in prison then it's pretty easy to stop it, especially with all the technology available.

Sniffer dogs are always keen and looking for work.

Except Alf, unofficially.
It makes prison officers life easier, so a blind eye can be the case as to them being ' brought ' in.

Yes however, I agree with you in this day and age it should be really simple to eradicate drugs from prisons.
Should be if it's wanted to really be.

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by rusticgal

You dont really know what effect prison has on you...believe me there are many that go there and vow never to go there again. To have your freedom taken away from you...being told what to do...watching your loved ones have to endure visiting procedures...the shame...the embarrassment. It can teach some people a very valuable lesson..it can be a massive deterrent. Shes had loads of therapy and its clearly not working. If she kills someone it will not only ruin innocent lives but it could also be the end of hers.

And there are many many people who re-offend

I have a lot of knowledge and experience of the prison system and the number of re-offenders is huge.

I agree for some people it is a deterrent but for many, it becomes a way of life sadly.

Katie is celeb who has highlighted this but I don't feel addicts get the help they need in prison in general and there needs to be a reform - maybe the answer is to offer better rehabilitation services in prisons to actually treat the issues rather than locking them away for the urge to return as soon as they get out.

[thesheriff443]

Let’s all get on drink and drugs go out and commit crimes but because we are considered addicts get let off

It’s doesn’t make you a better person for having a so called heart to these people it makes part of the problem.

They are nothing more than criminals under the influence of a substance be that drink or drugs

How many times do we hear this after a tragedy, if only something was done sooner

Being famous should not make a difference when it comes to breaking the law

[thesheriff443]

All those that support her when she clearly has not got any respect for the law, you should go to prison on her behalf because let’s be fair she is as good as family the way some of you are talking.

[LeatherTrumpet]

Katie Price and son Harvey's follow-up BBC documentary 'axed after her drink-drive crash'
as troubled former-celeb remains in The Priory for another most-likely failed rehab stint to avoid jail

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbi...&ci=9s7WvRECRq

[rusticgal]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Katie Price and son Harvey's follow-up BBC documentary 'axed after her drink-drive crash'
as troubled former-celeb remains in The Priory for another most-likely failed rehab stint to avoid jail

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbi...&ci=9s7WvRECRq

Good. Apparently she could still be sent to prison when she returns to court in December…..but I doubt she will.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

Joey that's true , nobody knows what each person has gone through personally . And what you just shared must have been really upsetting & difficult to go through , sorry to hear about your family tragedy. Like I said addiction & mental illness ISN'T a joke.

But Katie price DOESN'T help herself, I actually didn't realise she'd broken the law SOO many times. What is it they say 'the first step is admitting you have a problem' , but then the road to recovery takes time.

Many of us are sceptical of her as her life choices seem to always get worse, but I will agree something needs to be done whether it's a house arrest thing or a long rehab stay. When she's putting others lives at risk then there needs to be a serious consequence.

I still think she SHOULD be permanently banned from driving,but I know not everyone will agree with that . But surely then it will be a wake up call for her to change her ways. She's 43 she can't keep acting like a teenager with no responsibilities.

Hi GoldHeart.
Oh absolutely, she needs to be prevented from driving possibly for good.
Unless she really did get clear of addictions for a very long period.

I was in my teens when what happened with my Cousin.
It gave me a different perspective on just judging people, as that hit home.

No one is saying Katie Price should be left driving around, plus if she's to avoid prison, then she must be ordered to undergo, very lengthy not just a few weeks or even a couple of months, therapy and it must be residential at that.

I just don't see where prison would help.
Yes, she could hate being in prison.
Yes, she could get a tough time in there.
That may be fine for some who'd send her there.

I think more likely, she could befriend some who would be able to ensure she still got drugs whatever, they even can get alcohol in too.
I don't see how that will help her.

In a couple of years depending on what a judge gave her.
Then after a period, she'd be out again with no change whatsoever.

Often while prison is a nightmare for many sent there, it can often be an introduction to drugs environment and training ground for worse activites.

I agree getting addicts to admit to their problem is important and desirable..
However many block out they have a problem.
Or just never can be got to accept they have.

So yes, she could need forcing into therapy.
Constantly supervised too.
Not with free movement.

However, she has a severely disabled son, who is reliant on her near totally.
She's even like his voice and watching her with him, she can get him to respond on things, which others maybe couldn't.

Now yes, we can say well she should have thought of him, and she should have definitely.
However just if she WAS given a custodial sentence.
Then he was unable to see his Mother, whose been there since he was born and all through.

I can't see how he'd cope without seeing her.
How could he see her.
Fair enough, she's done wrong.
He hasn't..
How could Harvey with his disabilities, be able to visit her in prison.
Plus how traumatic would it be for him too.

The big picture around her is a massive mess.
However I just CANNOT see where prison would be the answer here.

Of course she must never drive anything.
She also must go into residential therapy too.
On an order that she can only be discharged, when it's felt she has been clean enough of her addiction to do so.

Still no driving too however.

She has failed to help herself, however I've come across addictions where that's often the case.
Sometimes addicts have to be forced to have help.
The right help.

I just feel that, better than prison cells, would be the way I'd go re Katie Price.
If she refused to agree to residential therapy and treatment.

Well then that's a different story.

My point is sometimes addicts need helping to help themselves.
I would always say prison is the last place where that would be even possible.

It will depend on the judge who decides her sentence.
Sadly in cases like even this one, Judges don't help the issue and can make things worse even.

I can feel sorry for her that's all.
Really for anything other than putting away violent offenders, sexual offenders, rapists, murderers.
Who obviously have to and should be, removed from society.
My view is prison is not always fit for purpose.

I don't think it is, still, even in this case.
I take on board what you and others say however.

If I was judging her, and sentencing her, I wouldn't be sending her to prison.
I'd be looking at the things I outlined before.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Hi GoldHeart.
Oh absolutely, she needs to be prevented from driving possibly for good.
Unless she really did get clear of addictions for a very long period.

I was in my teens when what happened with my Cousin.
It gave me a different perspective on just judging people, as that hit home.

No one is saying Katie Price should be left driving around, plus if she's to avoid prison, then she must be ordered to undergo, very lengthy not just a few weeks or even a couple of months, therapy and it must be residential at that.

I just don't see where prison would help.
Yes, she could hate being in prison.
Yes, she could get a tough time in there.
That may be fine for some who'd send her there.

I think more likely, she could befriend some who would be able to ensure she still got drugs whatever, they even can get alcohol in too.
I don't see how that will help her.

In a couple of years depending on what a judge gave her.
Then after a period, she'd be out again with no change whatsoever.

Often while prison is a nightmare for many sent there, it can often be an introduction to drugs environment and training ground for worse activites.

I agree getting addicts to admit to their problem is important and desirable..
However many block out they have a problem.
Or just never can be got to accept they have.

So yes, she could need forcing into therapy.
Constantly supervised too.
Not with free movement.

However, she has a severely disabled son, who is reliant on her near totally.
She's even like his voice and watching her with him, she can get him to respond on things, which others maybe couldn't.

Now yes, we can say well she should have thought of him, and she should have definitely.
However just if she WAS given a custodial sentence.
Then he was unable to see his Mother, whose been there since he was born and all through.

I can't see how he'd cope without seeing her.
How could he see her.
Fair enough, she's done wrong.
He hasn't..
How could Harvey with his disabilities, be able to visit her in prison.
Plus how traumatic would it be for him too.

The big picture around her is a massive mess.
However I just CANNOT see where prison would be the answer here.

Of course she must never drive anything.
She also must go into residential therapy too.
On an order that she can only be discharged, when it's felt she has been clean enough of her addiction to do so.

Still no driving too however.

She has failed to help herself, however I've come across addictions where that's often the case.
Sometimes addicts have to be forced to have help.
The right help.

I just feel that, better than prison cells, would be the way I'd go re Katie Price.
If she refused to agree to residential therapy and treatment.

Well then that's a different story.

My point is sometimes addicts need helping to help themselves.
I would always say prison is the last place where that would be even possible.

It will depend on the judge who decides her sentence.
Sadly in cases like even this one, Judges don't help the issue and can make things worse even.

I can feel sorry for her that's all.
Really for anything other than putting away violent offenders, sexual offenders, rapists, murderers.
Who obviously have to and should be, removed from society.
My view is prison is not always fit for purpose.

I don't think it is, still, even in this case.
I take on board what you and others say however.

If I was judging her, and sentencing her, I wouldn't be sending her to prison.
I'd be looking at the things I outlined before.

I completely understand what you're saying , i think it's good that you've helped people with addictions and problems aswell .

I guess time will tell with Katie , and it's not healthy for the kids to be put through all this aswell especially Harvey who needs her support.

Like i said i think a long stint in rehab with her license permanently taken away is probably the best thing for now . Thankfully nobody was hurt this time.

If she continues to re offend after getting help this time though , then i really do think there's nothing much anyone can do for her.

I deffo think some celebrities with or without their personal issues, still like to take advantage of the system because they know their fame will give them a lenient sentence or just a slap on the wrists , which frustrates alot of people . Obviously they're not all the same though.

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

I completely understand what you're saying , i think it's good that you've helped people with addictions and problems aswell .

I guess time will tell with Katie , and it's not healthy for the kids to be put through all this aswell especially Harvey who needs her support.

Like i said i think a long stint in rehab with her license permanently taken away is probably the best thing for now . Thankfully nobody was hurt this time.

If she continues to re offend after getting help this time though , then i really do think there's nothing much anyone can do for her.

I deffo think some celebrities with or without their personal issues, still like to take advantage of the system because they know their fame will give them a lenient sentence or just a slap on the wrists , which frustrates alot of people . Obviously they're not all the same though.

"with her license permanently taken away is probably the best thing for now"

do you not get she does not care about this and will still drive??

[rusticgal]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Hi GoldHeart.
Oh absolutely, she needs to be prevented from driving possibly for good.
Unless she really did get clear of addictions for a very long period.

I was in my teens when what happened with my Cousin.
It gave me a different perspective on just judging people, as that hit home.

No one is saying Katie Price should be left driving around, plus if she's to avoid prison, then she must be ordered to undergo, very lengthy not just a few weeks or even a couple of months, therapy and it must be residential at that.

I just don't see where prison would help.
Yes, she could hate being in prison.
Yes, she could get a tough time in there.
That may be fine for some who'd send her there.

I think more likely, she could befriend some who would be able to ensure she still got drugs whatever, they even can get alcohol in too.
I don't see how that will help her.

In a couple of years depending on what a judge gave her.
Then after a period, she'd be out again with no change whatsoever.

Often while prison is a nightmare for many sent there, it can often be an introduction to drugs environment and training ground for worse activites.

I agree getting addicts to admit to their problem is important and desirable..
However many block out they have a problem.
Or just never can be got to accept they have.

So yes, she could need forcing into therapy.
Constantly supervised too.
Not with free movement.

However, she has a severely disabled son, who is reliant on her near totally.
She's even like his voice and watching her with him, she can get him to respond on things, which others maybe couldn't.

Now yes, we can say well she should have thought of him, and she should have definitely.
However just if she WAS given a custodial sentence.
Then he was unable to see his Mother, whose been there since he was born and all through.

I can't see how he'd cope without seeing her.
How could he see her.
Fair enough, she's done wrong.
He hasn't..
How could Harvey with his disabilities, be able to visit her in prison.
Plus how traumatic would it be for him too.

The big picture around her is a massive mess.
However I just CANNOT see where prison would be the answer here.

Of course she must never drive anything.
She also must go into residential therapy too.
On an order that she can only be discharged, when it's felt she has been clean enough of her addiction to do so.

Still no driving too however.

She has failed to help herself, however I've come across addictions where that's often the case.
Sometimes addicts have to be forced to have help.
The right help.

I just feel that, better than prison cells, would be the way I'd go re Katie Price.
If she refused to agree to residential therapy and treatment.

Well then that's a different story.

My point is sometimes addicts need helping to help themselves.
I would always say prison is the last place where that would be even possible.

It will depend on the judge who decides her sentence.
Sadly in cases like even this one, Judges don't help the issue and can make things worse even.

I can feel sorry for her that's all.
Really for anything other than putting away violent offenders, sexual offenders, rapists, murderers.
Who obviously have to and should be, removed from society.
My view is prison is not always fit for purpose.

I don't think it is, still, even in this case.
I take on board what you and others say however.

If I was judging her, and sentencing her, I wouldn't be sending her to prison.
I'd be looking at the things I outlined before.

Harvey is not reliant on her totally…he is living away from her now. Yes it will be devastating for him…but he knows right from wrong. He should count himself lucky he still has a mother because she clearly didn’t think about him or any of her children when she got behind the wheel of that car consumed by drink and drugs…

[bitontheslide]

a lot of people seem to be fixated with prison time, and people are just not been sent to prison at all if it can be avoided, across the board.

If an ankle bracelet stops her driving, then why not use it. That protects the public, which, really, is the only reason to lock her up. I think some people just want her to be locked up

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

a lot of people seem to be fixated with prison time, and people are just not been sent to prison at all if it can be avoided, across the board.

If an ankle bracelet stops her driving, then why not use it. That protects the public, which, really, is the only reason to lock her up. I think some people just want her to be locked up

yes we do as she has shown ZERO regards for her fellow humans

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

a lot of people seem to be fixated with prison time, and people are just not been sent to prison at all if it can be avoided, across the board.

If an ankle bracelet stops her driving, then why not use it. That protects the public, which, really, is the only reason to lock her up. I think some people just want her to be locked up

I agree with all you say there bots.
The fixation of prison being a solution, is not the wisest.
Prison can make things even worse.
Solving nothing.


I will now mention this point too.
Harvey IS reliant on her, she's his Mother for goodness sake.
Of course he is especially with his disability.
Because when he's with his Mother, she understands fully his needs and disabilities.
Has done from his birth.

He may not always be with her all the time however, he responds to her and does rely on her at his side too.

If in prison, how could Harvey then see this important figure of his life there.
How traumatic and devastating would it be for Harvey to be taken into a prison to visit his Mother.

What reaction could he get going in and once in, how distressing or worse could it be for him.
What long term effect would it have on him.

It may well be the judge decides prison is the only answer.
To me that would be wrong.
To punish her and then punish Harvey too.
No.

Some may be wringing their hands with glee to see that outcome..
For me, I think it wouldn't help at all in any shape or form.

Equally I don't think suspended sentence, without an ensuring of long therapy for addiction is a solution either.

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

a lot of people seem to be fixated with prison time, and people are just not been sent to prison at all if it can be avoided, across the board.

If an ankle bracelet stops her driving, then why not use it. That protects the public, which, really, is the only reason to lock her up. I think some people just want her to be locked up

Yep, it’s got nothing to do with the crime she committed and everything to do with punishing her for what they see her as, as a person.

[LeatherTrumpet]

"Yep, it’s got nothing to do with the crime she committed "

Between 1979 and 2014

An average of 666 people were killed in drink driving related accidents in Great Britain each year.

An average of 3,551 people were seriously injured in drink driving related accidents in Great Britain each year.

Approximately 85,000 people are convicted of drink driving related offences each and every year in England and Wales alone.

[LeatherTrumpet]

the justification for this heinous crime is chilling

[LeatherTrumpet]

can you imagine if instead of Price it was a 60 year old white Conservative Councillor?




yep

[LukeB]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

I don't think prison is always the answer for addicts - as people have said they will not get rehabilitation in their, they will have their addictions fed - usually by stronger drugs and hooch.

Mandatory, secure rehab is the answer in my opinion. Somewhere where they can't leave but have access to the relevant support, counseling and controlled meds. A 3 month stint isn't going to be enough for a lifelong addict.

I agree!! I think prison will damage her mental health more. She shouldn’t have done want she did but addictions can get out of hand. People are so quick to judge and act on their high horse.

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by LukeB

I agree!! I think prison will damage her mental health more. She shouldn’t have done want she did but addictions can get out of hand. People are so quick to judge and act on their high horse.

they are protecting children walking in the street

jesus

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by LukeB

I agree!! I think prison will damage her mental health more. She shouldn’t have done want she did but addictions can get out of hand. People are so quick to judge and act on their high horse.

I do think she must be stopped from driving.
She hasn't hurt anyone yet but still she shouldn't be driving, particularly under the influence of anything.

I agree with you Luke, I see no positive to her being in prison.
As you say it could damage her mental health and destabilise her further.

Thankfully and I hope in this case hopefully, Judges generally look at the overall big picture, not just a narrow snapshot to judge.

Taking into account too, any worse negative effects of from a custodial sentence..
She isn't violent, she hasn't hurt anyone although she's done wrong driving when banned and with drink and drugs.

The real issue, is the way to ensure she no longer gets behind the wheel of a vehicle and how best to ensure she really, for as long as it takes, is in full detoxing and clearing of her addiction.

WITHOUT being in prison.
Which really isn't the appropriate place for her to be in my view.
Good to see you post Luke.