[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

That was my words not the court. The sufficiently masculine part.

It makes sense to me. It's about biological sex but if someone has taken steps to be perceived as male then yes they will cause distress to others on a female only space.

But basically 'but transmen' is not an argument

But what about the Trans Men you view as biological women? Do those biological women not count?

You're advocating for cis women not to share spaces with biological men while at the same time happy that some Trans men (who you happily call female because you see them as women) are sharing space with biological men.

So really, your care for biological sex only extends so far, meaning it's not about biological sex at all and moreover, your care for biological women only extends to cis biological women and so you don't really care about biological women at all. You just don't like trans women and you don't care about trans men.

[Vicky.]

Transmen are biological women. I would have thought the court giving an answer to that would be a good thing. After all, now no cis men can enter female only spaces by pretending to be transmen. Which was apparently concerning to people.

[Vicky.]

Also men are not as much in need of single sex spaces. If they are then I guess it's up to them to complain and such.

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by BBXX

It's almost like it's not about biological sex being important in the slightest then.

Anyone supporting this ruling should have a major issue with the above caveat and if you don't, it shows you don't care about women or biological sex at all, you just hate trans people.

Irrespective of the hypocrisy, who decides what is 'sufficiently masculine' and why are we letting other people decide define what passes as woman or man on the basis of appearance. ****ing archaic.

At least people are finally being honest about it now, even though this was the obvious truth from the very beginning

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Transmen are biological women. I would have thought the court giving an answer to that would be a good thing. After all, now no cis men can enter female only spaces by pretending to be transmen. Which was apparently concerning to people.

Yes, that's great. Fantastic news. And it's great news that Trans Men get to use the male facilities. It's what I was advocating for the whole time.

I just find it so interesting that your whole argument has been biological women shouldn't be sharing spaces with biological men, and yet you're okay with trans men using the male facilities... am I on glue, or is that not also biological women and biological men sharing a space?

Can you explain something for me as to why one is okay and the other isn't?

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Also men are not as much in need of single sex spaces. If they are then I guess it's up to them to complain and such.

It's not really about men being unsafe. It's about sending trans women into male spaces for men to kick the **** in to them, to be blunt.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Liam-

At least people are finally being honest about it now, even though this was the obvious truth from the very beginning

I don't really think they're even being honest, I think they're tripping up over their own hypocrisy.

[Livia]

Trans women suggested we use disabled toilets if we didn't like them in women's toilets. I suggest they take their own advice.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Livia

Trans women suggested we use disabled toilets if we didn't like them in women's toilets. I suggest they take their own advice.

Indeed and as I indicated earlier establishments have already taken steps by turning single toilets into unisex also as has been said on numerous occasions toilets are a distraction technique...refuges sports jobs all much more important but don't let that get in the way of 'worrying' about peeing

[Crimson Dynamo]

Thankfully women and girls will now be able to feel safe again

that is progress

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by BBXX

It's not really about men being unsafe. It's about sending trans women into male spaces for men to kick the **** in to them, to be blunt.

Have you evidence of that happening since the ruling?

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by BBXX

Yes, that's great. Fantastic news. And it's great news that Trans Men get to use the male facilities. It's what I was advocating for the whole time.

I just find it so interesting that your whole argument has been biological women shouldn't be sharing spaces with biological men, and yet you're okay with trans men using the male facilities... am I on glue, or is that not also biological women and biological men sharing a space?

Can you explain something for me as to why one is okay and the other isn't?

Because women need space away from male people in certain circumstances. Due to (some) mens treatment of women and just..privacy reasons. If men are concerned about single sex spaces then they can lobby and such

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Have you evidence of that happening since the ruling?

I haven't looked, but you cannot ignore the fact trans women are 4x more likely to be a victim of violence than cis gender people. Do you really honestly think a trans woman is safer in the male changing rooms than the female ones? Are cis women really that violent?

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Because women need space away from male people in certain circumstances. Due to (some) mens treatment of women and just..privacy reasons. If men are concerned about single sex spaces then they can lobby and such

What about the trans men, who you call females and biological women? You seem happy for them to share spaces with biological men? I thought women needed space away from men? I'm confused.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by BBXX

What about the trans men, who you call females and biological women? You seem happy for them to share spaces with biological men? I thought women needed space away from men? I'm confused.

I do not care if transmen want to use male spaces. That's up to them and the males.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I do not care if transmen want to use male spaces. That's up to them and the males.

You called them female before, that's all. And then biological women. And I was just confused why you don't care about that subsection of "females/biological women" sharing spaces with biological men and only the cis biological women. But nevermind, I digress...

[Vicky.]

It's transmens choice if they wish to use male spaces imo. Unless men complain about that, in which case a discussion needs to be had (not #nodebate stonewall)

[Crimson Dynamo]

[Livia]

There is no such thing as cis women.

Women
Trans women
Men
Trans men

I do not need a title imposed on me for the benefit of a tiny subsection of society.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Crimson Dynamo

It's not difficult to grasp, is it.

[bots]

how many cases have there been reported about men feeling threatened by a trans man using their toilet? Surely it was a big issue prior to this ruling?

[Beso]

Originally Posted by BBXX

I haven't looked, but you cannot ignore the fact trans women are 4x more likely to be a victim of violence than cis gender people. Do you really honestly think a trans woman is safer in the male changing rooms than the female ones? Are cis women really that violent?

Do you have any stats on how likely they are to commit sexual violence towards female children than a woman is?

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Beso

Do you have any stats on how likely they are to commit sexual violence towards female children than a woman is?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce39v5k0gx2o.amp

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

It's transmens choice if they wish to use male spaces imo. Unless men complain about that, in which case a discussion needs to be had (not #nodebate stonewall)

Okay cool. But you’re fine with them using women’s spaces too, if they want to?

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Livia

There is no such thing as cis women.

Women
Trans women
Men
Trans men

I do not need a title imposed on me for the benefit of a tiny subsection of society.

Nobody is forcing you to use it. Cis is an adjective that has been used for a long, long time. If you want to not use words that fine. If you don’t wish to be called it, that’s also fine and I won’t call you specifically a cis woman, but you don’t get deny words just because they trigger you.