[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Livia

Don't use facts with these people they like to believe their own biases are reality.

I was stating my opinion, you were suggesting something was fact. There is a difference...

[Livia]

Originally Posted by BBXX

Thank you for confirming.

The latest polling suggests that while overall support for trans people is decreasing across the board, women are consistently, and always have been, more supportive than men.

"Latest polling suggests". Can't argue with facts like that.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Livia

"Latest polling suggests". Can't argue with facts like that.

We use statistics to get a pulse on public opinion for many things, Livia.

It's certainly a better benchmark for public opinion than "it seems to me" (aka based on my limited experience on a Big Brother forum).

[Livia]

Originally Posted by BBXX

We use statistics to get a pulse on public opinion for many things, Livia.

It's certainly a better benchmark for public opinion than "it seems to me" (aka based on my limited experience on a Big Brother forum).

You haven't used statistics! You said "latest polling suggests". But you didn't produce the results of that poll. This place is for opinions (so people say things like, it seems to me...), but you can back up those opinions with evidence. Or, you can say things like "latest polling suggests" and imagine that's enough to prove your flimsy point.

You say "on a Big Brother Forum" like it's an insult. And yet here you are.


Of course, we could go back to us not conversing. That would suit me down to the ground.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Livia

You haven't used statistics! You said "latest polling suggests". But you didn't produce the results of that poll. This place is for opinions (so people say things like, it seems to me...), but you can back up those opinions with evidence. Or, you can say things like "latest polling suggests" and imagine that's enough to prove your flimsy point.

You say "on a Big Brother Forum" like it's an insult. And yet here you are.


Of course, we could go back to us not conversing. That would suit me down to the ground.

Last time I provided links to unbiased, non-partisan stats your only contribution was to say there was a lot of "generalisations and shaky stats" and then when I said I was open to my mind being changed if other stats could be provided, I didn't hear from you.

Unfortunately, you have proven time and time again you don't care about stats that go against your opinion, so I am not wasting my time linking sources that will be there if you Google.

My claim was based of statistics I've read from polling of the general public, your claim was based off your experience on a forum that is one of the biggest echo chambers I've ever come across. One is not the same as the other.

Happy to stop conversing, sounds like a plan.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by BBXX

Last time I provided links to unbiased, non-partisan stats your only contribution was to say there was a lot of "generalisations and shaky stats" and then when I said I was open to my mind being changed if other stats could be provided, I didn't hear from you.

Unfortunately, you have proven time and time again you don't care about stats that go against your opinion, so I am not wasting my time linking sources that will be there if you Google.

My claim was based of statistics I've read from polling of the general public, your claim was based off your experience on a forum that is one of the biggest echo chambers I've ever come across. One is not the same as the other.

Happy to stop conversing, sounds like a plan.

I don't recall you ever providing valid stats for anything.

If this forum is such an echo chamber, if you have so little respect for it and people who use it, why do you keep coming back? Why?

Have the last word, I know it'll be important to you, then let's go back to ignoring each other.

[bots]

the police are not there primarily to police the event, that is their sole duty

[Crimson Dynamo]

why are so many police at this "family-friendly event" anyroad??

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Crimson Dynamo

why are so many police at this "family-friendly event" anyroad??

Because it draws immense crowds and police need to ensure safety - just like literally any event large crowds are drawn to.

Often you'll also get conclaves of people who stand on the side of the parade shouting at the people who are enjoying their day that they are going to hell for loving someone of the same sex and so the police are there to ensure nothing kicks off.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Cherie

So no women have been harmed recently Mock, you can't think of a single case where a woman has been suspended or worse lost her job for being gender critical?

I said that the Police officers celebrating Pride isn't harming anyone.

Not that there haven't been cases of Transwomen thinking that it's okay to (for example) take part in Martial Arts against women.

[Glenn.]

Originally Posted by BBXX

Because it draws immense crowds and police need to ensure safety - just like literally any event large crowds are drawn to.

Often you'll also get conclaves of people who stand on the side of the parade shouting at the people who are enjoying their day that they are going to hell for loving someone of the same sex and so the police are there to ensure nothing kicks off.

It’s common sense no?
To think police would police large scale crowds like that. A crazy concept huh?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

I said that the Police officers celebrating Pride isn't harming anyone.

Not that there haven't been cases of Transwomen thinking that it's okay to (for example) take part in Martial Arts against women.

No one is saying police should be excluded from Pride. In their own time.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Livia

No one is saying police should be excluded from Pride. In their own time.

But they're already there.

Why can't they multitask and celebrate Pride while also doing their job?

Going by Ammi's post, the Police were able to do it back in 2016.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

But they're already there.

Why can't they multitask and celebrate Pride while also doing their job?

Going by Ammi's post, the Police were able to do it back in 2016.

The argument is Police are supposed to be and look impartial. I would question the intentions of anyone who wants to look 'impartial' on the subject of LGBT existing, tbh, but hey ho.

The issue stems from Pride being a politically motivated 'movement', and therefore Police need to be neutral. However, Pride is only political because people in power, the majority of whom are straight, make the existence of LGBT people political.

The vast majority of LGBT people would rather their existence wasn't up for political debate, in the same way straight people's existence hasn't ever been (for their identity). However, this is where we are and always have been, and so Pride will continue to be political.

My opinion is the police force have a checkered history with the LGBT community, they were instrumental in upholding discriminatory laws, often with force and violence. The police are not a very trusted collective within the community due to this history. Police involvement in pride not only goes ways to bridge that, for the sake of community, peace, trust and mutual respect, but it also creates a visual for any LGBT person who wants to join the Police force that perhaps it's now a viable workplace for them to exist in without prejudice.

I think often people, when suggesting X, Y and Z shouldn't "be political and get involved in pride" forget that gay people exist within those corporations and for many it's a way to show they're a company that accepts and supports you regardless of your sexuality.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by BBXX

The argument is Police are supposed to be and look impartial. I would question the intentions of anyone who wants to look 'impartial' on the subject of LGBT existing, tbh, but hey ho.

The issue stems from Pride being a politically motivated 'movement', and therefore Police need to be neutral. However, Pride is only political because people in power, the majority of whom are straight, make the existence of LGBT people political.

The vast majority of LGBT people would rather their existence wasn't up for political debate, in the same way straight people's existence hasn't ever been (for their identity). However, this is where we are and always have been, and so Pride will continue to be political.

My opinion is the police force have a checkered history with the LGBT community, they were instrumental in upholding discriminatory laws, often with force and violence. The police are not a very trusted collective within the community due to this history. Police involvement in pride not only goes ways to bridge that, for the sake of community, peace, trust and mutual respect, but it also creates a visual for any LGBT person who wants to join the Police force that perhaps it's now a viable workplace for them to exist in without prejudice.

I think often people, when suggesting X, Y and Z shouldn't "be political and get involved in pride" forget that gay people exist within those corporations and for many it's a way to show they're a company that accepts and supports you regardless of your sexuality.

Maybe that's the difference then.

Because to me I don't see Pride as the same as Just Stop Oil for example.

And I do want to say that I personally believe that some of society want to take our Humanity away in certain situations, and make us more robotic.

It seems like crying is the only form of emotion that's deemed acceptable nowadays.

Just going on a bit of a tangent, sorry about that.

[Beso]

Political pride activists are ruining pride for the non political.

[Glenn.]

Originally Posted by Beso

Political pride activists are ruining pride for the non political.

Pride was literally born out of clashes with the police. Stonewall wasn’t a brunch, it was a riot…

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

But they're already there.

Why can't they multitask and celebrate Pride while also doing their job?

Going by Ammi's post, the Police were able to do it back in 2016.

When they go to football matches, maybe they can just watch the game. They're there already after all. And during royal parades instead of watching the crowd maybe they can watch the horses go past.

They are there to do a job. While I want them to be friendly and approachable, I don't want them joining in with the festivities.

[Glenn.]

Some people really are ****ing miserable aren’t they lmao

[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by Livia

Lesbians have suffered with the trans madness but hey, they're just women. It seems to me that trans ideology is heavily supported by gay men.

Let’s not generalise all gay men, please.

I really appreciate some of the police want to be more involved but I agree they are there to police the event and should be doing just that. If they want to join in, they should have taken the time off of work.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Benjamin

Let’s not generalise all gay men, please.

I really appreciate some of the police want to be more involved but I agree they are there to police the event and should be doing just that. If they want to join in, they should have taken the time off of work.

Of course that's what I meant. I did not mean to generalise and apologise unreservedly x

[Liam-]

They can police the event and not be stoic bastards while doing it, it doesn’t need to be an either or situation

[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by Liam-

They can police the event and not be stoic bastards while doing it, it doesn’t need to be an either or situation

My issue is if something (god forbid) happened like a bomb/attack, they’d have come straight under fire for not being fully alert doing their job though. Nobody is saying they need to be stoic (well I’m not) but they are there to do a job to protect, so they should be focused on that. If they wanted to join the march they should, and can do so off-duty.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Benjamin

My issue is if something (god forbid) happened like a bomb/attack, they’d have come straight under fire for not being fully alert doing their job though. Nobody is saying they need to be stoic (well I’m not) but they are there to do a job to protect, so they should be focused on that. If they wanted to join the match they should, and can do so off-duty.

That's exactly what I mean. Like I said, I want them to be friendly and approachable, but they can't be alert and nip crimes and problems in the bud if they're dancing.

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Glenn.

Pride was literally born out of clashes with the police. Stonewall wasn’t a brunch, it was a riot…

What is it now.