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ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums > Non Big Brother Chat > Serious Debates & News > Should "fathers" have a say if a woman has a termination?
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Old 22-02-2009, 05:57 AM #76
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Can we get back to topic about how much say reluctant fathers should get if their partner or former partner get's pregnant by him.
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Old 22-02-2009, 05:57 AM #77
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Can I remind you that this is meant to be a family friendly forum
Purple!
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Old 22-02-2009, 06:01 AM #78
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I am a moderator on BAUT - we use purple when moderating
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Old 22-02-2009, 06:03 AM #79
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Well my view on the topic is that the man should own his seed.. The woman only has the egg, the seed is higher in rank!

Plus many women use the man to get pregnant... Child support etc! Why should he pay if only she wanted the child?..
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Old 22-02-2009, 06:17 AM #80
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Can I remind you that this is meant to be a family friendly forum
lol well tell andyman directly and don't be so indiscriminate.
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Old 22-02-2009, 06:21 AM #81
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oooo fck .... is that rhyming slang for w@nk? Come on people ...andyman needs to know if he's guilty of murder on an untold scale.
Huge scale... Mass amount! tommy tankinging, wearing the sausage coat, treat on her face... I could be worse than pol pot and hitler!!!
treat on her face ?..... what kind of birthday parties did you go to as a kid. hehe when is that a treat?
Women love a facial...
aww so not only are you a self confirmed "tommy tank" er ( did I phrase that right?) but your single too hehe.p
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Old 25-02-2009, 09:15 PM #82
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lewis
Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense
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Old 27-02-2009, 10:40 PM #83
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Quote:
Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by Lewis
Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense






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Old 28-02-2009, 08:59 PM #84
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Quote:
Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
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Originally posted by 08marsh
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Originally posted by Lewis
Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense



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Old 28-02-2009, 09:05 PM #85
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Yeh
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:51 AM #86
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Quote:
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Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
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Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense



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Old 02-03-2009, 04:50 AM #87
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Can I remind you that this is meant to be a family friendly forum
Purple!
You tell them sticks
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Old 03-03-2009, 04:15 PM #88
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Quote:
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Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by Lewis
Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense



Bore off "princess "
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Old 03-03-2009, 05:58 PM #89
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Quote:
Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
Quote:
Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
Quote:
Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by Lewis
Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense



Bore off "princess "
I'm done with you for now
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Old 03-03-2009, 10:01 PM #90
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Quote:
Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
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Originally posted by 08marsh
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Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
Quote:
Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by TheTwilightPrincess5
Quote:
Originally posted by 08marsh
Quote:
Originally posted by Lewis
Overall you are killing a living thing, so i would say it is murder?
Finally, someone with a bit of sense



Bore off "princess "
I'm done with you for now
Ok den, ickle girl! Night night.
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Old 04-03-2009, 07:56 AM #91
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sticks
For the record I do not like the idea of abortions, but it is a fact of life we are stuck with.

So having said that, when a woman gets pregnant and wants to terminate we hear the argument that it is her body and has the right to choose. If the prospective father does not want her to have the abortion, that's tough, he has no say.

But, suppose the couple are going through IVF, if the man withdraws his consent as has happened in recent court cases then the woman is not allowed to continue end of story.

So the suggestion to debate is this

Suppose a woman gets pregnant, as it could be argued that part of the foetus came from the man's sperm contribution, then it's part of the man's body as well. Should the man be legally entitled to insist that the woman have a termination if he does not want to be a father, just like he can withdraw consent on IVF.

Would this not be fair.
What are you talking about, IVF, and she's not allowed to continue?

It's nobodies business. It's the woman's body. End of discussion.

When you came inside her, that was your last warning that you could become a parent.
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Old 04-03-2009, 07:57 AM #92
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Quote:
Originally posted by andyman
Well my view on the topic is that the man should own his seed.. The woman only has the egg, the seed is higher in rank!

Plus many women use the man to get pregnant... Child support etc! Why should he pay if only she wanted the child?..
Because he knocked her up and put her in that position. You don't get to own a woman's body suddenly for 9 months. You want to carry it, and you're male, go ahead and try.
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Old 04-03-2009, 07:58 AM #93
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lol...why would this even be open for debate? Obviously he can't nor does he have any such right. Are you arguing the he ought to have the final choice Sticks?
But already in IVF he can pull the plug

I am putting the "what if" scenario of what if he also had the final say in natural pregnancies?

Also the pro-choice lobby always use the "Women's body" argument and therefore I am turning this around as the man could say part of his body went to make the child so in these days of equality he should be able to decide.

I suspect that some terminations have been done because some woman have been bullied into it by men who did not want their partner to come to term.


On personal level if I had a wife/ girlfriend - and had got her pregnant, I would wanting her to keep the child
No the your confusing the 2 examples... they aren't comparable since in your IVF example no egg has yet been fertilised. Him having the right to withdraw consent of the IVF fertilisation doesn't logically lead to him therefore having the right to choose whether she , once impregnated via IVF or otherwise, has the right to decide on the termination. You see the difference is during conception the man gave his consent ( obviously) but in your IVF example he clearly hasn't.

"Also the pro-choice lobby always use the "Women's body" argument and therefore I am turning this around as the man could say part of his body"

Again not applicable since the "body" referred to here isn't simply the genetic information but the actual human who has to go through the delivery of the baby. It's her body... she has the choice. The argument that it's part of his body too therefore he should have the choice doesn't cut it.

"I suspect that some terminations have been done because some woman have been bullied into it by men who did not want their partner to come to term." Very likely but that isn't argument enough to deny the majority of women their right to choose.
what?... no reply Sticks
So if a woman wants the baby and the man does not want the baby the woman has more legal rights? And when the baby is born the man by law has to support that child with paying child support?
Yep. And that's biology. Take it up with nature. There's more affect on the woman than the man.
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:02 AM #94
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Quote:
Originally posted by letmein
Quote:
Originally posted by Sticks
For the record I do not like the idea of abortions, but it is a fact of life we are stuck with.

So having said that, when a woman gets pregnant and wants to terminate we hear the argument that it is her body and has the right to choose. If the prospective father does not want her to have the abortion, that's tough, he has no say.

But, suppose the couple are going through IVF, if the man withdraws his consent as has happened in recent court cases then the woman is not allowed to continue end of story.

So the suggestion to debate is this

Suppose a woman gets pregnant, as it could be argued that part of the foetus came from the man's sperm contribution, then it's part of the man's body as well. Should the man be legally entitled to insist that the woman have a termination if he does not want to be a father, just like he can withdraw consent on IVF.

Would this not be fair.
What are you talking about, IVF, and she's not allowed to continue?

It's nobodies business. It's the woman's body. End of discussion.

When you came inside her, that was your last warning that you could become a parent.
I agree, but I also believe that the idea of terminations is wrong. So I think that if a male does climax inside the woman then the woman needs to take responsibility for not taking the pill or having unprotected sex. It works both ways, if you are not going to be sensible then you shouldn't be having sex. Women need to accept the responsibilities just like men do.
So what if it's your body, it is still your fault.
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Old 04-03-2009, 04:14 PM #95
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Quote:
Originally posted by letmein
What are you talking about, IVF, and she's not allowed to continue?

It's nobodies business. It's the woman's body. End of discussion.

When you came inside her, that was your last warning that you could become a parent.
There was a court case where a couple going through IVF split up and the man withdrew consent. She had had cancer treatment so this was her only chance for a child, but under the law, which was held up by the courts, the fertilised embryos were destroyed, because the man no longer wanted to be a father.

This is the law relating to IVF, pre-implantation.

This anomaly in the law does prompt the question, if the man has this right to pull the plug on IVF, in these days of equality could it be argued that the man should have the right to insist the woman have a termination.

For the record if I were to have got either a girl friend or a wife pregnant, I would be wanting them to have the child and play a full part in it's life, but I do wonder if this scenario may one day come to pass
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