[alc09]

Girth, take the blinkers off.

[bbfan1991]

I don't think Rooney has still got over that injury, he's had a disappointing WC, at least he's given a contribution despite the mess of our campaign.. better than nothing.

[Nemo123]

Originally Posted by alc09

I'm not even sure if Rooney would make a WC11 to be honest..

And to the person who said 5 England players would be in the top 20 players around, stop talking ****e.

Maybe this lot is the Nintendo generation. Lost forever to football.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by setanta

Large parts? 10 mins before the break and about 5 after. That's not large spells. You were shocking and the better team won.

Germany were totally on top of you prior to your first goal. How can you say that? They were dominating possession and had so many chances. I honestly though it was going to be 4 or 5 nil at that stage. You goal was totally out of the blue.

In the midfield England were as good as Germany. The German defenders were just as slow but some how the strikers couldn't capitalise. With different tactics and a couple of more attacking substitutions things could have been different.

[alc09]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

In the midfield England were as good as Germany. The German defenders were just as slow but some how the strikers couldn't capitalise. With different tactics and a couple of more attacking substitutions things could have been different.

I haven't seen midfield so overrun for a very long time.

What match were you watching?

[setanta]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

In the midfield England were as good as Germany. The German defenders were just as slow but some how the strikers couldn't capitalise. With different tactics and a couple of more attacking substitutions things could have been different.

I can't be having this conversation with you anymore, I'm sorry Girth. If you thought you were as good as them in midfield then you've left me speechless really.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by setanta

I can't be having this conversation with you anymore, I'm sorry Girth. If you thought you were as good as them in midfield then you've left me speechless really.

I wasnt as good as them cuz I wasnt playing but the team were still in that game up to Germany scoring the third goal.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

I wasnt as good as them cuz I wasnt playing but the team were still in that game up to Germany scoring the third goal.

Of course they were still in the game because there was only one goal in it but your were terrible in midfield and never looked like getting behind them. Germany always had another goal in them because they can pass quickly and could carve up your defence. That's the difference. You lot were taking pops from miles out or going for "Hollywood" passes, as Lawrenson said. No creativity. So no, you were nowhere near them in terms of play.

[Nemo123]

I had 1-0 England as a prediction, but affter 5 mins I knew that was wrong. Couldn't tell what way it would go for spells, so England can't have been all bad.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by setanta

Large parts? 10 mins before the break and about 5 after. That's not large spells. You were shocking and the better team won.

Germany were totally on top of you prior to your first goal. How can you say that? They were dominating possession and had so many chances. I honestly though it was going to be 4 or 5 nil at that stage. You goal was totally out of the blue.

Have to agree, absolutely. The best team won - England were sh*t.

2 goals in four matches! Shocking performances. Hope we DON'T ever get to host the World Cup till we can get a decent team together - how embarrassing would it be to be obliterated on our own turf!

[bbfan1991]

Originally Posted by angus58

Have to agree, absolutely. The best team won - England were sh*t.

2 goals in four matches! Shocking performances. Hope we DON'T ever get to host the World Cup till we can get a decent team together - how embarrassing would it be to be obliterated on our own turf!

Going OT I didn't think you liked football LOL.

[Locke.]

Originally Posted by setanta

Large parts? 10 mins before the break and about 5 after. That's not large spells. You were shocking and the better team won.

Germany were totally on top of you prior to your first goal. How can you say that? They were dominating possession and had so many chances. I honestly though it was going to be 4 or 5 nil at that stage. You goal was totally out of the blue.

At the end of the first half England had 55% and Germany 45%. At the end of the second half England 51% Germany 49%.

Attempts on target: England - 11. Germany - 9.

Attempts off target: England - 6. Germany - 6.

We had more of the ball, Germany just made use of it when they had it.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by setanta

Of course they were still in the game because there was only one goal in it but your were terrible in midfield and never looked like getting behind them. Germany always had another goal in them because they can pass quickly and could carve up your defence. That's the difference. You lot were taking pops from miles out or going for "Hollywood" passes, as Lawrenson said. No creativity. So no, you were nowhere near them in terms of play.

I mentioned something earlier about changing the tactics and making bolder substitutions. I kind of agree with you but I dont think that match was a one sided as the score suggested if there had been more adventure from the manager. The players were, for once, playing with a bit of desire but the Germans tactics were spot on and thus England were frustrated in the final third. I dont really blame the players all that much. Fabio's tactics were far too rigid.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Locke.

At the end of the first half England had 55% and Germany 45%. At the end of the second half England 51% Germany 49%.

Attempts on target: England - 11. Germany - 9.

Attempts off target: England - 6. Germany - 6.

We had more of the ball, Germany just made use of it when they had it.

Yes, you were taking shots on from 25 yards out cuz you didn't have the discipline or creativity to actually get behind them. More of the ball means nothing really if you're knocking it about at the back and then hoofing it upfield. Germany were sharper and more precise with their passing. By far the better team which is amazing when you consider the players England have.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

I mentioned something earlier about changing the tactics and making bolder substitutions. I kind of agree with you but I dont think that match was a one sided as the score suggested if there had been more adventure from the manager. The players were, for once, playing with a bit of desire but the Germans tactics were spot on and thus England were frustrated in the final third. I dont really blame the players all that much. Fabio's tactics were far too rigid.

Nah Girth, they were a shambles today, really. It was a really poor performance and I'm still scratching my head over it. How can a team with so many good players be so awful? What happened over the last few months with them?

[Locke.]

Originally Posted by setanta

Yes, you were taking shots on from 25 yards out cuz you didn't have the discipline or creativity to actually get behind them. More of the ball means nothing really if you're knocking it about at the back and then hoofing it upfield. Germany were sharper and more precise with their passing. By far the better team which is amazing when you consider the players England have.

And what happened when we were shooting from far out? We were scoring and hitting the bar. Though I don't think either of them 2 shots from Lampard count as on target, because the keeper has to save them/it has to be a goal to count as on target.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by setanta

Nah Girth, they were a shambles today, really. It was a really poor performance and I'm still scratching my head over it. How can a team with so many good players be so awful? What happened over the last few months with them?

In another post I compared it to Team USA consistently under performing at Olympic Basketball events yet having by far the best squad. I'm baffled why Gerrard and Lampard cant play together. They should be as potent as Iniesta and Xavi are for Spain

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Locke.

And what happened when we were shooting from far out? We were scoring and hitting the bar. Though I don't think either of them 2 shots from Lampard count as on target, because the keeper has to save them/it has to be a goal to count as on target.

It screams of desperation though. Why couldn't they play a bit of ball like the Germans? You have the players to do it, but for some reason they all underperformed. It's crazy really when you think about it. Rooney, Gerrard, Barry... all brutal. Something is going on there.

[Nemo123]

It's a real shame England won't be playing Argentina.

And I mean that most sincerely folks.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

In another post I compared it to Team USA consistently under performing at Olympic Basketball events yet having by far the best squad. I'm baffled why Gerrard and Lampard cant play together. They should be as potent as Iniesta and Xavi are for Spain

I'll say something that'll probably get me killed here, but you honestly don't have a creative midfielder. I mean a guy who starts play up and sees the first pass, you know? Gerrard and Lampard like to play further up the field and latch on to those kinda passes, you know that way? Barry doesn't do it for me, and I still firmly believe that you can't have Gerrard and Lampard in the same team.

[Nemo123]

Originally Posted by setanta

I'll say something that'll probably get me killed here, but you honestly don't have a creative midfielder. I mean a guy who starts play up and sees the first pass, you know? Gerrard and Lampard like to play further up the field and latch on to those kinda passes, you know that way? Barry doesn't do it for me, and I still firmly believe that you can't have Gerrard and Lampard in the same team.

Someone like Piqué of Spain I think is what's lacking. I'd play him in mf.

Since I saw him score for Barca a few months ago I've been a massive fan.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

I don't fullly agree. If you were to list the top 20 players in the world probably five or six English players would have to be in your mind for that list. And these players play for top teams with top managers who win at the highest level. I don't think Sir Alex Ferguson, Carlo Ancelotti, Jose Mourinho or Arsene Wenger would play these guys if they couldn't play. I think though something is fundamentally wrong. It reminds me of the NBA and how the USA always under perform at Olympics and world championships even though they have by far the best squads. Its baffling but I don't think turning you back on this bunch of players is the answer but I admit there is something fundamentally wrong,

I dont think so! Like I said, they are solid players, but its because they play with other amazing international stars, that make them look good. They are over rated. none of them can make somehting happen.. When the chips are down and you wnat someone to come through, they dont have anyone with that quality!

The NBA, not true, the US had underperformed once in the olympics, and lost I think it was 2004. But other than that, they always win. They won the last time, as well as the world championships. So you cant compare England to the US baskertball team. Thats not even close.

I still think that they need to get rid of that bunch, and look to the other young players. All the other big teams do that, but England insist on bringing in the same guys year in and year out! And they expectations are way too high, because they english fans think they should make it to the semis at least. Bottom line is, those players rent good enough, and the english dont have the desire to give the youngsters a chance. All the teams that stic to the past have underperformed. Italy, France. France has great young talented players, like Nasri, or Benzema, but they kept them out. As a result they suck.
Same for England/

[Locke.]

Capello just got it all wrong today.

The tactics were wrong. The formation was wrong. The team was wrong. The substitutions were so wrong.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by setanta

I'll say something that'll probably get me killed here, but you honestly don't have a creative midfielder. I mean a guy who starts play up and sees the first pass, you know? Gerrard and Lampard like to play further up the field and latch on to those kinda passes, you know that way? Barry doesn't do it for me, and I still firmly believe that you can't have Gerrard and Lampard in the same team.

They've been saying for years that with Gerrard and Lampard one should sit and the other go forward and work it out amongst themselves as to who does what and when. They're supposed to be world class players so why cant they organise themselves better on the pitch. Its baffling TBH. I compared them to Iniesta and Xavi. OK they both play for the same club team so can work on it for hours on the training ground and Xavi is slightly more defensive minded than Iniesta but still Gerrard and Lampard are still a massive problem. I think they both want to be the top man in midfield and neither wants to change the way they play at club level.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Nemo123

Someone like Piqué of Spain I think is what's lacking. I'd play him in mf.

Since I saw him score for Barca a few months ago I've been a massive fan.

Nah, somebody like Schweinsteiger or Alonso would do the job. Somebody strong and with the ability to dictate the rhythm of the game. Schweinsteiger was immense today. And then you have to couple a player like that with a more mobile, creative one, like Xavi or Fabregas. England are just not producing that type of player right now.

Oh, and why wasn't Parker selected? I'd have played him ahead of Barry any day of the week.